As of 2023, International hockey is dead

[NyQuil]

Arent you bored watching Canada beat up on everyone all the time. Snooze fest if you ask me

"Canada should win every tournament! Look at the number of registered players and their hockey infrastructure! If they don't win, it's a massive choke!"

"This is boring."

 

[NyQuil]

Finland failed to sell out Finland - Canada QF at the recent 2023 World Championships. It was mostly bored business people snoozing in the stands. While The Finnish soccer team managed to sell out Stadium 32,000 seats againt no other than San Marino !!! The worst soccer team in the world ( San Marino ) got 32,000 attendance. While QF against the best hockey country Canada only got 9,000 seats. Tells you everything. It doesn't help that Hartwall arena is rusting away by excellent KHL businesses.

I didn't watch any Finland hockey games. I don't know anyone who did. Finland isn't really a hockey country. EPO skiing is our thing. Myllylä, Kirvesniemi, Repo, Isometsä etc were all doped when they medalled in skiing.

Canada has more registered soccer players than registered hockey players.

Canada had ~55,000 people attend a national team soccer qualifier between Canada and Mexico.

Roughly 10 million Canadians watched the Canada vs. Croatia (around the same as the Finals) group match at the 2022 World Cup.

By comparison, 16.6 million Canadians watched the hockey Gold Medal final at the 2010 Olympics.

Soccer is just popular worldwide period.

 

[member 305909]

Canada has so much immigration from countries in which people don't know that there's a sport called hockey that it's inevitable that hockey will sink in popularity.

As for Finland, if Finland qualifies for next year's euros, and it's looking good, that would be another notch on the way of soccer taking over Finland as well.

Most Finns realize that even qualifying for a major tournament is a bigger chievement than a Skoda cup-victory.

 

[Nate070]

I have come to a conclusion that international hockey became such a niche sport that it is only truly cared about by the hardcore fans in a handful of countries. It’s probably on the same level as international handball nowadays as there’s ZERO exposure and any interest for the casual fans, especially in North America. And there are multiple reasons for it:

- First and foremost: NHL have not sent their players to the last 2 Olympics, making those tournaments absolutely boring and pointless.

- Gimmicky World Cup: a parody of a best on best tournament in 2016 was still interesting for fans, but clearly the made up teams and players out of shape and interest made it underwhelming, NHL cancelled it since then.

- Canada dominance: argue it or not, but Canada established itself as the main hockey power winning most of the tournaments making it less interesting to watch: last WHC is a big proof of that, Canada F rather easily coasted through the tourney and grabbed the gold

- Russia ban: hate it or not, but Russia is a top 3 hockey nation when it comes to number of fans, hockey players and money poured into the sport. Without Russia, any tournament is missing a number of rivalries, many fans, many sponsors

- WHC losing popularity among players: if you compare the rosters of 2019 and 2023 WHC, it’s entirely different tournament, very few NHLers agree to play for their country nowadays and with Russia and Belarus bans they’re replaced with lower level teams that make the tournament even less enticing for the players.

All of this can obviously change if the NHL starts participating in Olympics, Russia is back and WHC regains its popularity, but for now the international hockey is rather dead than alive

I think you have to change the header to: International hockey for russia is DEAD.

 

[ViD]

I think you have to change the header to: International hockey for russia is DEAD.

Until NHL starts participating in the Olympics, that’s a very little loss - WJHC is the only thing that stings

 

[Albatros]

Canada has so much immigration from countries in which people don't know that there's a sport called hockey that it's inevitable that hockey will sink in popularity.

Though it must be said that also historically many of the biggest hockey legends had such immigration background. But nowadays the game is far less accessible and no longer a part of the integration experience the way it perhaps once was.

 

[moropanov]

Canada has so much immigration from countries in which people don't know that there's a sport called hockey that it's inevitable that hockey will sink in popularity.

As for Finland, if Finland qualifies for next year's euros, and it's looking good, that would be another notch on the way of soccer taking over Finland as well.

Most Finns realize that even qualifying for a major tournament is a bigger chievement than a Skoda cup-victory.

Nah qualifying for Euro where half countries get in isnt really much of achievement hockey gold in best againts best tournament would propably be comparable to making top 8 in Soccer world cup or atleast top 16

 

[Silky Johnson]

I miss best on best hockey very much but can live without it as its second to the NHL to me. World Juniors is still fun but I could live without the World Championships at the best of times.

As to Russia. While it does suck not to have them in international tournaments I would not watch any event with them participating.

More importantly, Finland, Sweden, Chechia, Slovakia, Canada & likely the US would boycott any event the IIHF let them participate in.

Russia will not be allowed to participate in Hockey any time soon.

 

[member 305909]

Nobody cares if Belarus is banned forever.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Though it must be said that also historically many of the biggest hockey legends had such immigration background. But nowadays the game is far less accessible and no longer a part of the integration experience the way it perhaps once was.

The immigrants coming to Canada *today* (from Asia, Africa, the Caribbean, Latin America, etc) are very different than what was coming in during the late 1800s and early 20th century. Much fewer from backgrounds that have an affinity for sports like hockey and more that gravitate towards basketball and soccer. Good for Canada in those sports but the hockey pool may not be as strong moving forward.

 

[Albatros]

keep hockey away from your dirty politicians , I like to see best against the best , those players have nothing to do with decisions their government do

How would you put together an international tournament without the participation of international hockey federations?

Of course the NHL and the NHLPA could try to operate their own national teams similar to the fakes often seen in some video games, but no one would take that very seriously and many players would likely just refuse to take part, especially if there's no extraordinary amount of money on the table.

 

[Albatros]

The immigrants coming to Canada *today* (from Asia, Africa, the Caribbean, Latin America, etc) are very different than what was coming in during the late 1800s and early 20th century. Much fewer from backgrounds that have an affinity for sports like hockey and more that gravitate towards basketball and soccer. Good for Canada in those ports but the hockey pool may not be as strong.

If we look at, say, Ukrainian Canadians (who have provided a massive number of NHL players over the years), they had absolutely no connection to the sport before being introduced to it in Canada. Decisive was that the conditions were right for the second and third generation kids to start playing. Soccer and basketball have a lot going for them globally which surely contributes to a cultural shift, but the main reason why they've been replacing hockey in Canada and other relevant countries is still accessibility.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

If we look at, say, Ukrainian Canadians (who have provided a massive number of NHL players over the years), they had absolutely no connection to the sport before being introduced to it in Canada. Decisive was that the conditions were right for the second and third generation kids to start playing. Soccer and basketball have a lot going for them globally which surely contributes to a cultural shift, but the main reason why they've been replacing hockey in Canada and other relevant countries is still accessibility.

I think we're dancing around this a bit. Hockey is much more attractive to white Europeans from cold climates than it is to blacks of African or Caribbean descent or people of Asian descent (such as Indian or Chinese). That's not to say that such groups can't find their way to hockey and end up loving it (they do) but there are a lot more barriers to overcome and sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze. The U.S. has had similar shifts where immigration is concerned but our population is much larger so this isn't as much of a story.

 

[Albatros]

I think we're dancing around this a bit. Hockey is much more attractive to white Europeans from cold climates than it is to blacks of African or Caribbean descent or people of Asian descent (such as Indian or Chinese). That's not to say that such groups can't find their way to hockey and end up loving it (they do) but there are a lot more barriers to overcome and sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze. The U.S. has had similar shifts where immigration is concerned but our population is much larger so this isn't as much of a story.

I don't think that's much of a factor really, otherwise there should be significantly more Canadians with Swedish or Finnish roots playing hockey than there are those with Croatian or Portuguese.

 

[WayTooCold]

Yeah there's no pride in qualifying to Euro soccer when 32 teams make it. Medal or bust. The last Euro soccer Finland managed to produce 1 single shot at goal in 3 games! What a joke.

There's no hockey gene in Finns that Croatians are lacking. It's all about bad cold weather. Finland had at some point 1 gold medal ( Swedish coach ) and 10 silvers. W/o Sweden donating gold in 2011. I don't think Finland would have won 3 skoda cups anyway.

And by the way the Granlund's swoop game winning goal against Russia in semifinal was illegal by the rules. You can't carry a puck with equipment. I could just put some super glue on my stick and carry the puck to the net.

 

[ZDH]

It's bc the rest of the world doesn't want to get embarrassed by McDavid and Bedard for the next decade.

 

[Albatros]

McDavid captaining Team Canada at the World Championships it was the same story as with the Oilers, he put up a ton of points on his own and the team finished solid 4th after losing to Switzerland.

 

[wmupreds]

Yeah there's no pride in qualifying to Euro soccer when 32 teams make it. Medal or bust. The last Euro soccer Finland managed to produce 1 single shot at goal in 3 games! What a joke.

There's no hockey gene in Finns that Croatians are lacking. It's all about bad cold weather. Finland had at some point 1 gold medal ( Swedish coach ) and 10 silvers. W/o Sweden donating gold in 2011. I don't think Finland would have won 3 skoda cups anyway.

And by the way the Granlund's swoop game winning goal against Russia in semifinal was illegal by the rules. You can't carry a puck with equipment. I could just put some super glue on my stick and carry the puck to the net.

You're saying all lacrosse goals are illegal? That's a take.

Also Euros have 24 teams now, not 32

 

[lilidk]

You're saying all lacrosse goals are illegal? That's a take.

Also Euros have 24 teams now, not 32

I was always wondering why not . What happened if stick going against goaltender mask .

 

[Hanji]

I think we're dancing around this a bit. Hockey is much more attractive to white Europeans from cold climates than it is to blacks of African or Caribbean descent or people of Asian descent (such as Indian or Chinese). That's not to say that such groups can't find their way to hockey and end up loving it (they do) but there are a lot more barriers to overcome and sometimes the juice isn't worth the squeeze. The U.S. has had similar shifts where immigration is concerned but our population is much larger so this isn't as much of a story.

This is valid. There's a significant Latino middle class in the US. It's growing exponentially.
I'm talking 1st and 2nd generation Latino-Americans kids paticularly in Texas, California, Arizona.
Unlike the thier economically equivalent white counterparts in these states, hockey isn't catching on with the Latino population nearly to the same degree.

 

[WayTooCold]

This is valid. There's a significant Latino middle class in the US. It's growing exponentially.
I'm talking 1st and 2nd generation Latino-Americans kids paticularly in Texas, California, Arizona.
Unlike the thier economically equivalent white counterparts in these states, hockey isn't catching on with the Latino population nearly to the same degree.

Finland has collapsing demographics. Immigrants from middle class background like Matias Maccelli, Adam Lambert, John Gibson etc are the ones interested in hockey. They have seen McDavid lighting up the NHL and think it's cool. African immigrants in Finland are not interested in hockey. They play soccer instead. They are kinda lean guys as well. You gotta be something like 190cm / 100kg to succeed. Komarov and Barkov have Russian background. Probably much more.

 

[NyQuil]

McDavid captaining Team Canada at the World Championships it was the same story as with the Oilers, he put up a ton of points on his own and the team finished solid 4th after losing to Switzerland.

Meh, 4th and 3rd are the same thing.

 

[Lartsaman]

Nobody cares if Belarus is banned forever.

Belarus should let play sooner than Russia. Yes they are helping Russia to invade their neighbourgs but they dont do the killing personally. They were a progressing hockey nation before the war, now they suffer a lot of this situation. Just let them play at Division 1A and hold Russia for a while. My best bet would be that Russia comes back to Olympics in Italy. War has since then lased four years and ended at stalemate. We can f*** around with Russia for a while but we dont ban some little country crazy about ice hockey and ruin their development.

 

[Lartsaman]

I have wondered a totally new international tournament held in Russia, Moscow or St.Pete either way. Six teams playing for the trophy;

Those six teams are one of the largest countries in the whole world.

Group 1

Russia with KHL-stars, Belarus with KHL-stars, Kazakhstan with KHL Stars. Kazakhstan can add all their imports, nobody cares any regulations, this is not an iihf-tournament.

Group 2

Canada and USA with the best possible roster they can find in Europe and along them plays Team China with its naturalized players.

Best two takes each others in semifinals an proceed too the final matchup. I bet that every hockey fan in Russia would want to see Canada-Russia final game. And every other nation would laugh out loud when Canadas Ö-Team beats them. At the Bronze Medal game USA can beat Belarus and enjoy the same old bronze they´re usually enjoyng at an ihf-sanctioned events.

Tournament would be like Super Channel One Cup and the trophy presented by Rene Fasel that would be too large, just too large.

 

[MardyBum]

Belarus should let play sooner than Russia. Yes they are helping Russia to invade their neighbourgs but they dont do the killing personally. They were a progressing hockey nation before the war, now they suffer a lot of this situation. Just let them play at Division 1A and hold Russia for a while. My best bet would be that Russia comes back to Olympics in Italy. War has since then lased four years and ended at stalemate. We can f*** around with Russia for a while but we dont ban some little country crazy about ice hockey and ruin their development.

I don't think their C-tier dictator is doing them any favors. They might be gone in a few years.