Around the NHL XXXVI: Ladd AND Weise/Fleischmann to Chicago.

[Tawnos]

What does reducing Wideman's suspension to 10 games after he's sat out 19 accomplish?

Does he get 9 games of pay back? Is his record for future incidents not as bad?

He should get that pay back, in addition to the fine being reduced.

 

[Sooth]

And then they go out and sign Stalberg and trade for Eric Staal both of whom have very good fancy stats.

I think, like most teams and professionals, they are using them and weighing them in to their decisions. Just not using them as the end all be all

This.

As someone who is somewhat interested in fancy stats and thinking on "should I do my thesis on it", I would love to get my hands on some data.

But still, numbers won't tell you everything. (Probably beating a dead horse here, but still) Hockey is such a dynamic sport that it'd be hard to judge completely on analytics. There should always be some consideration on human relations & relationships. (as in, the personal stuff that might or might not be going on with Kreider. That is something you cannot predict.)

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Erik Karlsson is the best offensive defense ive seen play the game...

watching him in person is completely different than on TV. the amount of ice he can cover is crazy

 

[darko]

the Ottawa Senators are not an NHL team when he's off the ice

Agree on this.


EK is a fantastic player but some treat him like he's the greatest thing since the invention of sliced bread. Best offensive D-man by a decent margin but he does have his shortcomings defensively which can't be ignored.

Is he the #1 D-man in NHL? Nope. Duncan Keith is but EK is definitely top-5 with the likes of PK, Weber and Doughty.

 

[darko]

I'd probably put EK at #3 behind Keith/Weber.

 

[wolfgaze]

Ooohhh Pens & Blue Jackets playing tonight... First game where both Crosby & Dubinsky will be playing after their little altercation...

 

[Machinehead]

I see the argument that Karlsson isn't quite as good defensively as a Doughty or a Keith.

I don't get the argument that he's a 4th forward. He's pretty solid defensively.

There's lots of offensive defenseman who are a hundred times worse defensively and don't get called a "4th forward."

 

[I Eat Crow]

Karlsson is definitely a great player, but calling him the best offensive defenseman one has ever seen play the game is a bit short sighted.

Lidstrom, Leetch, Bourque, and MacInnis all say hello, and that's just within the past 15 years.

 

[Boruto]

Sergei Vezina Bobrovsky is one of the worst starter now.

 

[Cassano]

Karlsson is definitely a great player, but calling him the best offensive defenseman one has ever seen play the game is a bit short sighted.

Lidstrom, Leetch, Bourque, and MacInnis all say hello, and that's just within the past 15 years.

He's better than all of them (offensively) except Bourque IMO.

 

[Igor Shestyorkin]

I see the argument that Karlsson isn't quite as good defensively as a Doughty or a Keith.

I don't get the argument that he's a 4th forward. He's pretty solid defensively.

There's lots of offensive defenseman who are a hundred times worse defensively and don't get called a "4th forward."

Exactly.

 

[Thirty One]

Agree on this.


EK is a fantastic player but some treat him like he's the greatest thing since the invention of sliced bread. Best offensive D-man by a decent margin but he does have his shortcomings defensively which can't be ignored.

Is he the #1 D-man in NHL? Nope. Duncan Keith is but EK is definitely top-5 with the likes of PK, Weber and Doughty.

I don't think sliced bread is all that great. There's nothing like biting into a whole loaf.

I do think that defensive zone play vs. defensive play (i.e. the sum of all the activities that lead to the prevention of goals) is an important distinction for players like Karlsson, who excel at keeping the puck at the other end of the ice.

 

[nsvoyageurs]

St. Louis Blues ‏@StLouisBlues 3 hours ago

BREAKING NEWS: #stlblues sign Carl Gunnarsson to a three-year extension worth $8.7 million. http://*******/1Rclw1X

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

Karlsson is definitely a great player, but calling him the best offensive defenseman one has ever seen play the game is a bit short sighted.

Lidstrom, Leetch, Bourque, and MacInnis all say hello, and that's just within the past 15 years.

Orr Coffee are two who shouldn't be left out either. Even tho is going further back

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

He's better than all of them (offensively) except Bourque IMO.

He's not better then Leetch offensively.

 

[darko]

He's not better then Leetch offensively.

This.

Leetch had 5 20-goal seasons and 5 50-assist seasons. One 100-point season.

 

[Raspewtin]

St. Louis Blues ‏@StLouisBlues 3 hours ago

BREAKING NEWS: #stlblues sign Carl Gunnarsson to a three-year extension worth $8.7 million. http://*******/1Rclw1X

terrible defenseman

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

This.

Leetch had 5 20-goal seasons and 5 50-assist seasons. One 100-point season.

Different times

 

[Machinehead]

Karlsson is definitely a great player, but calling him the best offensive defenseman one has ever seen play the game is a bit short sighted.

Lidstrom, Leetch, Bourque, and MacInnis all say hello, and that's just within the past 15 years.

None of those players embarrassed their peers the way Karlsson does.

Maybe there's just not as many great offensive defenseman today as there was in the 90's. I could certainly buy that the way the game has become overly structured.

But only Bobby Orr has dominated contemporaneous defensemen the way Karlsson does.

 

[Raspewtin]

This.

Leetch had 5 20-goal seasons and 5 50-assist seasons. One 100-point season.

Erik Karlsson has had 3 50 assist seasons.....

I think Leetch was better but it has to be said that nobody is on Karlsson's planet right now. There were plenty of top tier offensive D with Leetch around. He had competition. Karlsson simply doesn't.

 

[The Lunatic Fridge]

Erik Karlsson has had 3 50 assist seasons.....

I think Leetch was better but it has to be said that nobody is on Karlsson's planet right now. There were plenty of top tier offensive D with Leetch around. He had competition. Karlsson simply doesn't.

Well leetch was actually good defensively, so there's that.

 

[Machinehead]

Well leetch was actually good defensively, so there's that.

So is Karlsson.

When will this die?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Erik Karlsson has had 3 50 assist seasons.....

I think Leetch was better but it has to be said that nobody is on Karlsson's planet right now. There were plenty of top tier offensive D with Leetch around. He had competition. Karlsson simply doesn't.

Honestly, different times.

When Leetch had his 50+ assist seasons, the GPG averages were:

1990-91: 3.46
1991-92: 3.48
1993-94: 3.24
1995-96: 3.14
1996-97: 2.92
2000-01: 2.76

Karlsson's 3 seasons with 50+ assist seasons, the GPG averages were:

2011-12: 2.73
2013-14: 2.74
2015-16: 2.69

 

[Raspewtin]

Well leetch was actually good defensively, so there's that.

So is Karlsson

 

[The Lunatic Fridge]

So is Karlsson

So is Karlsson.

When will this die?

Great arguement. Now go watch him play and stop reading his stats sheet.
I've seen plenty of sens games and there's 2 things karlsson is, a points machine and a speed demon. A shutdown defenseman, he is not. He gets abused routinely. WAY more than other "norris caliber" guys like Weber, subbam, doughty, etc.

This is not to say he is stu bickel level bad, but to compare him to guys like leetch is laughable.