Around Hockey XX (All Non-Jackets Hockey talk in here)

[cbjfaninmo]

I think all of your points are valid. The only thing to worry about is when things go a bit sideways and Joey becomes pouty. If that doesn't happen probably a decent deal for both sides given the no bonuses, no no movement clauses.

Heck maybe we could trade for him?

Jones+ for RyJo?

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I think all of your points are valid. The only thing to worry about is when things go a bit sideways and Joey becomes pouty. If that doesn't happen probably a decent deal for both sides given the no bonuses, no no movement clauses.

Heck maybe we could trade for him?

Maybe he and Laviolette will get into it and Nashville will buy him out and the CBJ can sign him as a UFA. Johansen doesn't turn 26 until after the next buyout period so he can be bought out for 1/3rd.

 

[Doug19]

I miss Ryjo, wish we still had him.

 

[MAHJ71]

I miss Ryjo, wish we still had him.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

 

[Monk]

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I miss Ryjo, wish we still had him.

Having him would make us a big time contender (in addition to Jones).

 

[Cyclones Rock]

I raise you one.

No, make that

 

[MAHJ71]

Having him would make us a big time contender (in addition to Jones).

Having him not loaf every shift would have made us a better team.

Lots of what ifs.. I'm completely happy with Jones.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Having him not loaf every shift would have made us a better team.

Lots of what ifs.. I'm completely happy with Jones.

Unfortunately for those groups of people it isn't correct. I remember the same wrong stigma was placed on Atkinson under Richards, Brassard and Voracek under Arniel. The only time it was correct was Nash, under many head coaches.

Joey didn't go balls out every shift. Very few do. He was just called out for it since the team sucked and he was the best forward.

I am also happy with Jones. I wish there was a way to have both. We'd be great, but unfortunately that wasn't possible.

 

[major major]

Unfortunately for those groups of people it isn't correct. I remember the same wrong stigma was placed on Atkinson under Richards, Brassard and Voracek under Arniel. The only time it was correct was Nash, under many head coaches.

Joey didn't go balls out every shift. Very few do. He was just called out for it since the team sucked and he was the best forward.

You're rewriting history. We had major problems with Joey under both Richards and Torts.

He was either very lazy or had a serious health issue. It was a serious thing very different from the norm - I'm baffled you didn't notice (you don't remember the "lupus threads" in back to back years?). It doesn't strike you as substantially outside the norms when a player leaves the team, missing games, when a new coach is hired?

 

[CBJWerenski8]

You're rewriting history. We had major problems with Joey under both Richards and Torts.

He was either very lazy or had a serious health issue. It was a serious thing very different from the norm - I'm baffled you didn't notice (you don't remember the "lupus threads" in back to back years?). It doesn't strike you as substantially outside the norms when a player leaves the team, missing games, when a new coach is hired?

Leave the team? He was sent home because he was sick. That's what he said. Torts said. The team said. If you don't believe them then that's fine, but that's what was reported. He didn't just up and leave the team (I believe the game was in Colorado) because he was upset about Torts being hired/calling him out in Minnesota, there was a reason. When I get a cold or an illness I don't have the same energy as I do when I'm not. I only recall lupus threads during that year, not years prior. Funny, nobody called him out for being lazy before that terrible season, aside from the brief AHL playoff lesson (in which there is no defense for) that we all put behind him once he lit up the NHL the very next year.

He had the heart condition that summer, came in out of shape, and didn't catch up in conditioning before he was dealt. He wasn't a perfect soldier. That doesn't mean he should be framed as a villain by the management team or fans. The divorce was hardly one sided.

 

[major major]

Leave the team? He was sent home because he was sick. That's what he said. Torts said. The team said. If you don't believe them then that's fine, but that's what was reported. He didn't just up and leave the team (I believe the game was in Colorado) because he was upset about Torts being hired/calling him out in Minnesota, there was a reason. When I get a cold or an illness I don't have the same energy as I do when I'm not. I only recall lupus threads during that year, not years prior. Funny, nobody called him out for being lazy before that terrible season, aside from the brief AHL playoff lesson (in which there is no defense for) that we all put behind him once he lit up the NHL the very next year.

He had the heart condition that summer, came in out of shape, and didn't catch up in conditioning before he was dealt. He wasn't a perfect soldier. That doesn't mean he should be framed as a villain by the management team or fans. The divorce was hardly one sided.

There were conditioning/health issues in multiple years.

We had "what is wrong with Joey" threads in two separate seasons. I think it was 2014-15, and then 15-16. He had a stretch of two months from November to January of 14-15 where the wheels fell off - his skating slowed markedly. He said he just had times where the legs don't want to move. I can appreciate that but he was an otherwise stellar defensive forward getting repeatedly walked, it stood out.

I'm not disputing that he's still usually a good player in spite of it, but how you can forget the gravity of his issues is baffling to me.

Someone will have to check the record, but when Torts was first hired, the first news reports were that Joey was not with the team, but there was no normal explanation of "out because of illness" like one would expect. It was just silence. Then much later the report that he was flying back to Columbus with a trainer, then later a report from the FO that it had something to do with a heart problem that had been plaguing him since the summer time. I'm not committing to whether Joey's problems were mostly in his head or heart but the timing and the way news dribbled out made me suspicious that we were just dealing with a kid who didn't want to grow up and was afraid (as many players are) of a hardass coach about to get in his face.

I'm not framing anyone or even villainizing anyone. He was a kid, sometimes they take a while to grow up. I didn't have a problem with his salary dispute in 2014 and mgmt later regretted going public with him. Management did do the right thing when they decided they didn't want to build the fragile locker room around him (and end up paying him $8m per).

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Someone will have to check the record, but when Torts was first hired, the first news reports were that Joey was not with the team, but there was no normal explanation of "out because of illness" like one would expect. It was just silence. Then much later the report that he was flying back to Columbus with a trainer, then later a report from the FO that it had something to do with a heart problem that had been plaguing him since the summer time. I'm not committing to whether Joey's problems were mostly in his head or heart but the timing and the way news dribbled out made me suspicious that we were just dealing with a kid who didn't want to grow up and was afraid (as many players are) of a hardass coach about to get in his face.

I'm not framing anyone or even villainizing anyone. He was a kid, sometimes they take a while to grow up. I didn't have a problem with his salary dispute in 2014 and mgmt later regretted going public with him. Management did do the right thing when they decided they didn't want to build the fragile locker room around him (and end up paying him $8m per).

Here's something I found in a quick google search.

https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/blue-jackets-ryan-johansen-undergoing-tests-for-illness-fatigue/

After Columbus Blue Jackets forwards Ryan Johansen did not play in the final six minutes of their loss to the Minnesota Wild last week, he was scratched for their next game in Colorado and sent home with an undisclosed illness.

On Monday, Blue Jackets coach John Tortorella said Johansen is currently listed as "day-to-day" and that he is continuing to get some testing done to figure out why he has not been feeling well recently.

"Joey just doesn't feel well," Tortorella said Monday, via the Blue Jackets' website. "He lacks energy, and so we'll list him as day-to-day, and he's just getting some medical testing done and we're going to leave him alone and see if we can get that straightened out."

Johansen will not play Tuesday night in New Jersey and his status for the remainder of their road trip is unknown.

The Columbus Dispatch reported over the weekend that Johansen was hospitalized "at least once" over the summer with an accelerated heart rate. On Monday, his agent, Kurt Overhardt, told Aaron Portzline of the Dispatch that his current situation is not heart related.

So, according to this, it was due to illness. The date of this article was October 25th, 2015. The day after the Colorado game in which he was sent home.

I don't recall anyone calling out his play in 2014-15, especially when he was carrying that team to start the year due to injuries especially with no camp. I do recall 15-16 threads though, but again that was also the season of his heart issue, and thus a conditioning issue. Either way, it's a dead subject now. He's in Nashville thriving, and Jones is here thriving. Both teams are happy.

I do appreciate the way you talk about this issue though, trying to get facts and have a real conversation. With this board and Joey its like talking to a wall who can only say "hurr durr he didn't care lazy team cancer" for a good majority of the posters here.

 

[mikeyp24]

Accelerated heart rate doesn't mean heart condition. I've been hospitalized for dehydration after being sick a few days and I wasn't released because my heart rate was like mid 100s and I habe stomach issues I literally have to go to the ER 4ish times a year. Every time my blood pressure is very high and even though I say it's not my heart because it goes 160 or 180 over like 110 to 120 and it's just because pain/dehydration/stress. People make it out like he has something serious going on... he doesn't or the preds don't trade Jones for him or overpay him to stay. He's healthy with no heart problems.

He is where he should be on a team in another conference where we don't have to watch him float for 3 periods and he turned us into the team people wish we could have been with him... Jones will help us millions more then the other guy could.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

he doesn't or the preds don't trade Jones for him or overpay him to stay. He's healthy with no heart problems.

He is where he should be on a team in another conference where we don't have to watch him float for 3 periods and he turned us into the team people wish we could have been with him... Jones will help us millions more then the other guy could.

Yep, pretty much par for the course around here. With you being a captain of the ship. Inaccurate.

 

[major major]

Here's something I found in a quick google search.

https://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/blue-jackets-ryan-johansen-undergoing-tests-for-illness-fatigue/



So, according to this, it was due to illness. The date of this article was October 25th, 2015. The day after the Colorado game in which he was sent home.

I don't recall anyone calling out his play in 2014-15, especially when he was carrying that team to start the year due to injuries especially with no camp. I do recall 15-16 threads though, but again that was also the season of his heart issue, and thus a conditioning issue. Either way, it's a dead subject now. He's in Nashville thriving, and Jones is here thriving. Both teams are happy.

I do appreciate the way you talk about this issue though, trying to get facts and have a real conversation. With this board and Joey its like talking to a wall who can only say "hurr durr he didn't care lazy team cancer" for a good majority of the posters here.

Here's a summary of the infamous December 2014 "lupus" thread. (compiled by DSL in another such "what is wrong with Joey" thread the following year.)

Torts told Joey after the first game that he was out of shape. Then Joey leaves the team, and there is a big powwow with Overhardt and the FO. Maybe he really was just sick, and all the fuss was coincidental. But it's not like his play was just bad for a couple games. It was a two months at a time thing that occured in consecutive seasons. In a later interview in Nashville (I think a year ago in the summer) he admitted that he had to improve his conditioning. Nothing that shocking or malevolent to my mind. I just bring it up to counter your contention that he had a normal NHL work ethic and is taking the fall for the team's problems. I think he was responsible for a lot of the team's problems. If he could have kept pace with Saad and Foligno after that red hot preseason together a lot of things might have gone differently.

 

[major major]

I won't link to individual pieces, but if you do a google search for Oct. 23-24th 2015, you can find quite a lot of information. What we heard was "We're searching for answers for his low energy levels" - there was a report that he "fell ill" which was later repeated as "dealing with illness" but never any report of a particular illness. That's odd. It looks to me like he couldn't keep up with what the team demanded because he was just terribly out of shape.

I also just found a reference to the club expressing their displeasure with Johansen's fitness level in 2014.

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Johansen's laughing all the way to the bank and the Preds laughed all the way to the SC Finals last year-which they may have won with a healthy #91.

Keep bashing. It's ridiculous. The kid finished 11th in the NHL one year in scoring and had 63 points in another year when no other forward busted 50. A real no effort guy. LOL. The Jackets blew it with him.

Nashville + Johansen= 21 playoff wins in the past two years. Columbus - Johansen = 1.

 

[major major]

Johansen's laughing all the way to the bank and the Preds laughed all the way to the SC Finals last year-which they may have won with a healthy #91.

Keep bashing. It's ridiculous. The kid finished 11th in the NHL one year in scoring and had 63 points in another year when no other forward busted 50. A real no effort guy. LOL. The Jackets blew it with him.

Nashville + Johansen= 21 playoff wins in the past two years. Columbus - Johansen = 1.

Classic Cyclones Rock tropes. You can tell how hard a player works by his point totals, and a team win record. Brilliant.

I suppose you think Wennberg is great too now, huh? A year ago you insisted til you were blue that Wennberg would never come close to Krejci level.

Well over the last ~120 games since the trade, Wennberg and Johansen have nearly identical G/A/Pts stats, about 13G, 49A per year (those are Krejci's exact stats the year Boston won the cup).

 

[Cyclones Rock]

Classic Cyclones Rock tropes. You can tell how hard a player works by his point totals, and his team win record. Brilliant.

By the way, nice predictions on the Jackets playoffs last season. Your dismissal of their miserable regular season stretch performance was prescient.

I look forward to your preposterous prognostications this season

David Poile evidently uses different criterion than you when judging effort. I'll go with his over yours. Wennberg over Johansen. OK

 

[major major]

By the way, nice predictions on the Jackets playoffs last season. Your dismissal of their miserable regular season stretch performance was prescient.

I look forward to your preposterous prognostications this season

I only recall saying that they had a chance against the Penguins. Not a very bold prediction.

A bold prediction is saying the Jackets would never get out of the league gutter until they drafted #1OA (in the right year) and got a real superstar #1C, because there is no other way to counteract the suck that is inherent in Columbus. That was a bold prediction, a prediction someone (you perhaps?) made before last season. One might call it "preposterous"?

 

[Viqsi]

I only recall saying that they had a chance against the Penguins. Not a very bold prediction.

A bold prediction is saying the Jackets would never get out of the league gutter until they drafted #1OA (in the right year) and got a real superstar #1C, because there is no other way to counteract the suck that is inherent in Columbus. That was a bold prediction, a prediction someone (you perhaps?) made before last season. One might call it "preposterous"?

I do remember at least one bold prediction that Mason, once he got out of Columbus, would never again play in the AHL, let alone the NHL, because he was so impossibly bad.

 

[Old Guy]

Having him not loaf every shift would have made us a better team.

Lots of what ifs.. I'm completely happy with Jones.

This is like what Cousin Eddie said about the Jelly Of The Month Club membership; "Clark.......it's the gift that keeps on giving."

 

[Daytonian]

[Thiessen is expected to begin the regular season as the starting goalie for AHL Cleveland and the No. 3 on the Blue Jackets' depth chart, Aaron Portzline of The Columbus Dispatch reports[/I]. (rotowire.com)

Good choice. Thiessen is reliable and can fill the #3 goalie slot.