OT: Around Hockey and the NHL

[Felonious Python]

 

[LightningStrikes]

 

[gn2007]

Who seen this coming wtf

 

[T REX]

Seems like we got fleeced looking at some of these other deals.

We just don't have the pieces and teams are going all in.

It's going to be a bloodbath. Glad we got our 2 cups.

 

[Stormbreaker]

 

[Major4Boarding]

Kane and Ladd come off their books this summer ($8.125M total). Just in time to be enticed to take Seabrook's contract off JFBB's hands

 

[Stormbreaker]

Wait I thought he was "week to week"

 

[Stormbreaker]

????????

 

[Felonious Python]

 

[Felonious Python]

Alpharetta isn't downtown Atlanta...

 

[Major4Boarding]

Alpharetta isn't downtown Atlanta...

You’re right, it’s not. But if I remember right with the Thrashers fan base, a large chunk of them (and STH’s) were in north Fulton County. My previous employer - our Southeast headquarters was in Alpharetta. MARTA access and a good chunk of money is in and around that area (Norcross, etc)

They got a long way to go though. I say it’s a longshot, but at least they’ll have one thing going for them this go-around. An ownership that actually wants them.

 

[Felonious Python]

You’re right, it’s not. But if I remember right with the Thrashers fan base, a large chunk of them (and STH’s) were in north Fulton County. My previous employer - our Southeast headquarters was in Alpharetta. MARTA access and a good chunk of money is in and around that area (Norcross, etc)

They got a long way to go though. I say it’s a longshot, but at least they’ll have one thing going for them this go-around. An ownership that actually wants them.

STH's aren't the issue. It's about infrastructure, and to an extent, a place free agents want to go.

Richmond, VA is building a 17,000 seat arena, but not in Richmond, it's kind of its own thing in Henrico County. It won't hit it's potential.

People move to Atlanta area, and orient themselves to how close they want to be to Atlanta. They don't orient themselves to Alpharetta.

The Hawks have existed for years. Maybe squabble about revenue and dates, but downtown seems to work fine for them.

 

[Major4Boarding]

People move to Atlanta area, and orient themselves to how close they want to be to Atlanta. They don't orient themselves to Alpharetta.

The Hawks have existed for years. Maybe squabble about revenue and dates, but downtown seems to work fine for them.

Seems odd then why people end up in Alpharetta, Norcross, and Duluth when they move to the Metro Atlanta area and yet identify themselves as Atlantans

Yeah, the Hawks have existed for years. But it was clear from day one when A$G took over the Thrashers from Turner, there was already an exit plan to divest themselves of the club. Downtown would’ve worked just fine. It did work fine, for a small bit of time. Had they had a committed ownership group to not only hold on to them, but actually invest in the product, it would’ve be a far different outcome.

But they didn’t and that’s why they are now in YWG. The idiots that made up the first run of Atlanta Spirit Group are a classic, textbook example of an ownership group that couldn’t get out of each others way and a perfect storm of dysfunction. And when you have that environment, that also had zero interest in investing in the product, well there you have it.

I’m curious to see what lack of infrastructure there would be in that area?

 

[Felonious Python]

Seems odd then why people end up in Alpharetta, Norcross, and Duluth when they move to the Metro Atlanta area and yet identify themselves as Atlantans

Yeah, the Hawks have existed for years. But it was clear from day one when A$G took over the Thrashers from Turner, there was already an exit plan to divest themselves of the club. Downtown would’ve worked just fine. It did work fine, for a small bit of time. Had they had a committed ownership group to not only hold on to them, but actually invest in the product, it would’ve be a far different outcome.

But they didn’t and that’s why they are now in YWG. The idiots that made up the first run of Atlanta Spirit Group are a classic, textbook example of an ownership group that couldn’t get out of each others way and a perfect storm of dysfunction. And when you have that environment, that also had zero interest in investing in the product, well there you have it.

I’m curious to see what lack of infrastructure there would be in that area?

Ownership isn't the question. There can be otherwise good ownerships that botched the arena location, and bad ownership isn't going to be better in the suburbs.

Putting a team in the suburbs prioritizes one area over the others. Of course, there are things like job and education considerations in picking a place to move to, but it's done in relation to Atlanta. They live in Alpharetta or Duluth because it's near Atlanta. If you live in a suburb south of the Atlanta, Alpharetta may be one mile too far. That wasn't the bargain. Car ownership also becomes mandatory.

Infrastructure would be the roads, transit, and buildings needed to support a ~20k arena, even like what you find in nearby Duluth.

Gas South Arena is only a half hour away, also in the north Atlanta suburbs, and seats 13k. How many arenas do they need? How many events do they think they can get? How much would they hurt each other by having competing events on the same day? What's even the point of having NBA and NHL home games on the same day?

 

[TheDaysOf 04]

 

[RDTBay4]

The NHL is considering ANOTHER 2 expansion teams....Houston and Atlanta (again). Blehhgh

 

[Felonious Python]

The NHL is considering ANOTHER 2 expansion teams....Houston and Atlanta (again). Blehhgh

Both cities also apparently have arena issues, so this would all be years down the line.

The Coyotes need to figure out what they're doing, as well. If Tempe says no to an arena, then they may not have much of an option but to relocate.

If they do expand, then I'd have to figure that they'd come in one at a time. Two teams at once would stretch the expansion draft, probably too far.

 

[RDTBay4]

Both cities also apparently have arena issues, so this would all be years down the line.

The Coyotes need to figure out what they're doing, as well. If Tempe says no to an arena, then they may not have much of an option but to relocate.

If they do expand, then I'd have to figure that they'd come in one at a time. Two teams at once would stretch the expansion draft, probably too far.

Yea, I've read several people, and heard people the radio and a podcast all say they would like to see 4 come in at once.

Yea, 4 players off each team....riiiight. Even one is bad, two would be terrible, anymore would be catastrophic, especially to a team like us with a small prospect pool and no draft capital.

 

[Felonious Python]

Yea, I've read several people, and heard people the radio and a podcast all say they would like to see 4 come in at once.

Yea, 4 players off each team....riiiight. Even one is bad, two would be terrible, anymore would be catastrophic, especially to a team like us with a small prospect pool and no draft capital.

It wouldn't be good for the expansion teams, either. The 2000 expansion draft had two teams. Minnesota and Columbus. Instead of building one bad team, they had to split the player pool between themselves.

Kansas City already has an arena.

 

[Major4Boarding]

It wouldn't be good for the expansion teams, either. The 2000 expansion draft had two teams. Minnesota and Columbus. Instead of building one bad team, they had to split the player pool between themselves.

Kansas City already has an arena.

True. But a city council that is "Nope. We're good. We're in the black. No need to go in reverse". Lamar Hunt Jr sounded like he was interested years ago till he was told $500M was the price tag.

"Nope".

Kansas City Council is good with their lease agreement with AEG Worldwide. It would take alot of deep pockets to get that one done.

Coincidentally, Quebec City also has an arena. But it'll take a whole fleet of deep pockets for that one. So the League will continue to dangle "ready-to-receive" cities like KC and QC over the heads of many. City government or otherwise.

 

[Hoek]

There's barely enough decent goalies to go around now. Imagine when they add another 4 roster spots for the guys in the AHL now...

 

[JoVel]

Yeah at some point you have to start thinking about how large hockey's talent pool is. Adding multiple teams at once when we're at 32 already weakens the product team quite a bit. But I mean, we'd get to see McDavid hit 180 points or whatever.

 

[Felonious Python]

True. But a city council that is "Nope. We're good. We're in the black. No need to go in reverse". Lamar Hunt Jr sounded like he was interested years ago till he was told $500M was the price tag.

"Nope".

Kansas City Council is good with their lease agreement with AEG Worldwide. It would take alot of deep pockets to get that one done.

Coincidentally, Quebec City also has an arena. But it'll take a whole fleet of deep pockets for that one. So the League will continue to dangle "ready-to-receive" cities like KC and QC over the heads of many. City government or otherwise.

AZ could theoretically move to Kansas City, possibly keeping the same owners.

I wonder about the timing a little bit. RSNs collapse and then Atlanta and Houston rumors surface.

The problem is especially concerning for teams that have depended on RSNs’ media rights fees to help fund everything from player salaries to marketing efforts. Local media rights can make up to 50% of an MLB team’s total revenue, sources said. Times will be tough if that dries up.

As revenue for RSNs plummets, sports execs search for new local rights models with focus on streaming

Sports business executives are so concerned about the cratering RSN business that executives from leagues, teams, distributors and the networks have met regularly over the past several weeks to look into new business models for local media rights, according to several sources.

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

The AHL would also expand if the NHL approved another team.

 

[LightningStrikes]

Yeah at some point you have to start thinking about how large hockey's talent pool is. Adding multiple teams at once when we're at 32 already weakens the product team quite a bit. But I mean, we'd get to see McDavid hit 180 points or whatever.

Yeah this. Also, I don’t see a lot of young Russian talent coming to NA and the NHL anytime soon.

 

[Major4Boarding]

AZ could theoretically move to Kansas City, possibly keeping the same owners.

I wonder about the timing a little bit. RSNs collapse and then Atlanta and Houston rumors surface.

As revenue for RSNs plummets, sports execs search for new local rights models with focus on streaming

Sports business executives are so concerned about the cratering RSN business that executives from leagues, teams, distributors and the networks have met regularly over the past several weeks to look into new business models for local media rights, according to several sources.

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

The AHL would also expand if the NHL approved another team.

Theoretically if I walked into the League offices in NY with (liquidity) $1.5B and announced I'd like a franchise in Orlando, would they tell me no?

Regarding Alex Meurelo and AZ. If Tempe implodes, I would think that the League would want that Houston TV market way before KC and steer him that way. (Not saying you specifically) Everyone always brings up Kansas City because they have an arena. Well, that's accurate. They do. And only 16 years old at that. Like I said though, it would take an owner (or group) with deep pockets to sway city council with things like "I don't need your money. I'll handle the CapEx, maintenance, etc thru AEG". I get to keep in-Arena Revenues though".

They'd have to fund the practice facility build too, and lay out sound financials that blows their minds that convinces them they will maintain (scratch that, exceed) what they are currently receiving. Meurelo ain't that guy. His track record with previous business dealings, Glendale as well, and speculation of how financially sound is he really would most definitely spook KC Council.

Now if Meurelo and Lamar Hunt Jr partnered up (the later becoming the majority owner), then you'll see eyes and ears perk up. I'm pretty much convinced Tempe gets done though, truthfully. Although, as we say over on the BOH board, anything can happen when it involves the Coyotes. We mean... anything!

The RSN (timing) dots are definitely connecting. For me at least. This is an apparent full-measured cash grab because of not only the Bally and Diamond Sports bullshit, but also an added security blanket to fully emerge from the Covid era losses and the players escrow debt shrinking (almost gone).

AHL Expansion. Dare I say San Antonio (Houston) is brought back from the dead? Can Gwinnett fit the role of an AHL city? In years past, I always thought they'd be a worthy candidate to become an AHL spot. Haven't really followed up on them in awhile though. That's your wheelhouse, FP, so I'll defer to you on that one.