Armchair GMs II: Potential Red Wings Ideas & Moves

[Run the Jewels]

• Holland should have used a compliance buyout on Franzen. Didn't happen.
• Holland shoud have traded Jimmy Howard. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded for Tyler Myers. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded Justin Abdelkader. Didn't happen.
• Holland should sit on his thumbs and let Blashill do his thing. Hopefully this happens.

We need to draft cheap elite talent at the top of the draft and get Holland to retire so Stevie Y can take over.

Please let this happen.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

• Holland should have used a compliance buyout on Franzen. Didn't happen.
• Holland shoud have traded Jimmy Howard. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded for Tyler Myers. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded Justin Abdelkader. Didn't happen.
• Holland should sit on his thumbs and let Blashill do his thing. Hopefully this happens.

We need to draft cheap elite talent at the top of the draft and get Holland to retire so Stevie Y can take over.

Please let this happen.

when does Hollands contract expire? I know its the same time as Stevie Y

 

[Actual Thought*]

when does Hollands contract expire? I know its the same time as Stevie Y

I seriously doubt Yzerman will ever work for the Redwings again. With Mike Illitch's age I don't see it happening. He is a Tampa guy now. I don't think he has any loyalty to the Detroit fan base. I also wouldn't be all that excited if he did.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

I seriously doubt Yzerman will ever work for the Redwings again. With Mike Illitch's age I don't see it happening. He is a Tampa guy now. I don't think he has any loyalty to the Detroit fan base. I also wouldn't be all that excited if he did.

I don't think he will either. But hey crazy things happen. Maybe Tampa suddenly drives off a cliff for some reason.

 

[Run the Jewels]

when does Hollands contract expire? I know its the same time as Stevie Y

Pretty sure he has 3 years left after this year. Steve Yzerman has said the Ilitches are like parents to him. Who knows what condition Mike Ilitch will be in at that point. I can't say I have any idea whether Yzerman would want to come back, all I can say is it's not crazy to think he would want to return, particuarly with the new arena and if/when we start drafting elite talent at the top of the draft.

There are the parts we can "control" including being awful and bereft of talent which will result in us routinely drafting in the top 10. We haven't drafted and developed an elite talent in over a decade - Mrazek will probably end up being the exception but it's too early to say. If we are drafting at the top of the draft the odds of us acquiring elite talent improve dramatically.

The Ilitches can also control the new arena of course which will open in 2017. The one part we can't control is whether Yzerman accepts if/when the organization reaches out to him.

The timing works out perfectly for Holland to oversee the traditional rebuild. Retool on the fly is dead. My biggest concern is with how out to lunch Holland is we may not draft as well as we could/should when we have picks near the top of the draft. We just have to hope this part works out.

So yeah, three years with top draft picks due to our roster being one of the worst in the NHL. Then in 2017-18 we open the new barn. Holland retires and Detroit becomes much more attractive to Yzerman. I think there's a good chance he'd say yes regardless but as Michigan proved with Jim Harbaugh if you show him the love and have the Red Wings alumni base reach out to Yzerman and tell him we need him to come home it just might work.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

I don't think he will either. But hey crazy things happen. Maybe Tampa suddenly drives off a cliff for some reason.

the wings would actually be better with Nill than yzerman

Nill is making his stamp on the Stars and you can see the type of player and style of game he values vs hollands

so long as Holland CHOOSES to not properly address the defence and the redundancy within the roster this team and this franchise will be stuck going nowhere

you can not have dumb, poor puck moving dmen in todays NHL

you can not have so many small but "crafty" wingers in todays nhl

you can not have a 5 million dollar a year splitter in todays NHL

we do not have a proper balance on this roster right now

 

[Run the Jewels]

the wings would actually be better with Nill than yzerman

Nill is making his stamp on the Stars and you can see the type of player and style of game he values vs hollands

so long as Holland CHOOSES to not properly address the defence and the redundancy within the roster this team and this franchise will be stuck going nowhere

you can not have dumb, poor puck moving dmen in todays NHL

you can not have so many small but "crafty" wingers in todays nhl

you can not have a 5 million dollar a year splitter in todays NHL

we do not have a proper balance on this roster right now

Nill would be a clear upgrade but he'll be 60 or 61 when Holland's contract expires. He also doesn't have the track record that Yzerman has built up. I think Nill is doing a great job, and I think he's in a very good situation in Dallas so it's hard to see him make a move after such a short period of time given his age. I am not suggesting it's impossible, only arguing that Yzerman would be the perfect fit given his ties to the organization, his proven rebuild of one of the worst franchises in the league, and the fact he would - in theory - leave the Bolts after 8 years and would have left them in very good shape.

I think the Harbaugh analogy is perfect for Yzerman.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Nill would be a clear upgrade but he'll be 60 or 61 when Holland's contract expires. He also doesn't have the track record that Yzerman has built up. I think Nill is doing a great job, and I think he's in a very good situation in Dallas so it's hard to see him make a move after such a short period of time given his age. I am not suggesting it's impossible, only arguing that Yzerman would be the perfect fit given his ties to the organization, his proven rebuild of one of the worst franchises in the league, and the fact he would - in theory - leave the Bolts after 8 years and would have left them in very good shape.

I think the Harbaugh analogy is perfect for Yzerman.

yzerman has done an admirable job but his two biggest tickets were and remain gary bettman handouts in the way of stamkos and hedman

without them that franchise is nowhere near as good and would be a team that fights all season for a playoff spot

 

[Actual Thought*]

Nill would be a clear upgrade but he'll be 60 or 61 when Holland's contract expires. He also doesn't have the track record that Yzerman has built up. I think Nill is doing a great job, and I think he's in a very good situation in Dallas so it's hard to see him make a move after such a short period of time given his age. I am not suggesting it's impossible, only arguing that Yzerman would be the perfect fit given his ties to the organization, his proven rebuild of one of the worst franchises in the league, and the fact he would - in theory - leave the Bolts after 8 years and would have left them in very good shape.

I think the Harbaugh analogy is perfect for Yzerman.

You do know Nill had his hand in pretty much every single player we have right? You do know that Yzerman would need like 2 decades of performance that is much better than what he has shown to even be in the conversation as an upgrade right? This reminds me of the argument that Blashill was going to be better than Babcock. Can we just put these ridiculous notions to bed? Getting rid of anyone who has proven success is a bad way to run a franchise.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

• Holland should have used a compliance buyout on Franzen. Didn't happen.
• Holland shoud have traded Jimmy Howard. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded for Tyler Myers. Didn't happen.
• Holland should have traded Justin Abdelkader. Didn't happen.
• Holland should sit on his thumbs and let Blashill do his thing. Hopefully this happens.

We need to draft cheap elite talent at the top of the draft and get Holland to retire so Stevie Y can take over.

Please let this happen.

1) Yeah, maybe. At the time of the buyout, Franzen was still a top 6 forward and not a candidate for LTIR because of concussions. You could say they should have used it regardless because of the length of the deal, but Johan Franzen made this team much better when he was playing.

2) Why? When? When we had Jonas Gustavsson as the backup? When Petr Mrazek was playing in the world juniors for the Czechs and was still two-three years away? When we had Ty Conklin backing him up? It has not been reasonable until this year to potentially deal Howard because Mrazek has proven he can handle the load and Howard actually has rebuilt some value. Any idea of dealing Howard a couple years ago is ridiculous hindsight at best.

3) Larkin and a 1st for Tyler Myers? So, Larkin and Svech for Myers? Yeah, I don't want that. Also, wanting to deal Mantha++ is again, ridiculous hindsight. At the time the deal was being offered, Mantha was a budding top 6 forward with size and scoring ability who was going to be given a chance to make the Wings as a 19 year old.

4) Trade Abby for what? Replace Abby with who? It's easy to throw out a "he should have done this" when you give no specifics. Justin Abdelkader is one of those types of players who are infinitely more valuable to you than what another team would give you for him. Say you get a second round pick for him (which is probably generous), you have literally nothing in the way of physicality on the roster.

5) Finally, one I agree with. Holland should just let Blashill work with the team to get it to an effective one utilizing his gameplan. Help him out by adding pieces where necessary, but don't micromanage him.

I would be alright with Yzerman taking over for Holland. Not because Holland is a dumpster fire or anything, but Yzerman has proven to be a great GM in his own right. You might not be singing his praises as much as you do now if he does come here though. With the roster and atmosphere he'd have in Detroit, he probably wouldn't operate much differently than Holland.

 

[Classicnamesup]

Maybe the Bolts will lose Stamkos and Yzerman will take the fall

 

[Pavels Dog]

the wings would actually be better with Nill than yzerman

Nill is making his stamp on the Stars and you can see the type of player and style of game he values vs hollands

so long as Holland CHOOSES to not properly address the defence and the redundancy within the roster this team and this franchise will be stuck going nowhere

you can not have dumb, poor puck moving dmen in todays NHL

you can not have so many small but "crafty" wingers in todays nhl

you can not have a 5 million dollar a year splitter in todays NHL

we do not have a proper balance on this roster right now

Nill had no hand in drafting Klingberg and he is the biggest reason Dallas' defense isn't looking as terrible anymore. He has tried to improve that D but nothing has been as big as the emergence of Klingberg. I'm not sure Nill could have done much more than what Holland has done in Detroit. Would Boston have considered trading Seguin within the division? Unlikely.

 

[The Zermanator]

Friedman rumour on trade board mentions Barrie as possibly being available at some point. Would be willing to pay big for him.

Something with either DeKeyser and/or Tatar as centrepiece/s.

DeKeyser, Tatar, Kindl, 2nd

for

Barrie, Iginla

 

[GoAwayDanCleary]

Friedman rumour on trade board mentions Barrie as possibly being available at some point. Would be willing to pay big for him.

Something with either DeKeyser and/or Tatar as centrepiece/s.

DeKeyser, Tatar, Kindl, 2nd

for

Barrie, Iginla

That is soooo bad. We are trying to add to the defensive corps.

 

[Pavels Dog]

That is soooo bad. We are trying to add to the defensive corps.

Yeah Dekeyser is maybe our biggest untouchable other than Larkin and Mrazek. If we trade Dekeyser the return can be nothing less than a young #1D like OEL, Faulk or Fowler.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

Friedman rumour on trade board mentions Barrie as possibly being available at some point. Would be willing to pay big for him.

Something with either DeKeyser and/or Tatar as centrepiece/s.

DeKeyser, Tatar, Kindl, 2nd

for

Barrie, Iginla

Don't the Red Wings and Avalanche just not trade with one another? For instance, we wanted Forsberg in 2008, and they wouldn't trade him to us and then we had to do a three way trade with Colorado and Tampa just to get Quincey out of Colorado. I don't know if the Roy and Sakic administration have different feelings on the topic, but that has been the recent historical precedent.

 

[The Zermanator]

That is soooo bad. We are trying to add to the defensive corps.

DeKeyser for a 50+ point dman, I'd say we're the ones adding here.

Kronwall-Green
Ericsson-Barrie
Ouellet-Smith (Quincey when healthy)

That is much better than what we have now. Barrie is also roughly the same age as DeKeyser and is likely better than DeKeyser will ever be. Easier for offensive players to develop a d game than the reverse, see Sproul, R. Plus Barrie's still an RFA after his current deal.

Don't the Red Wings and Avalanche just not trade with one another? For instance, we wanted Forsberg in 2008, and they wouldn't trade him to us and then we had to do a three way trade with Colorado and Tampa just to get Quincey out of Colorado. I don't know if the Roy and Sakic administration have different feelings on the topic, but that has been the recent historical precedent.

Yeah, that seems to have been the case since the rivalry. But I mean, really. Are they all children? They're not even in the same conference anymore and haven't really had anything resembling a rivalry in more than a decade. Move on and stop limiting yourself by having one less potential trade partner.

 

[Run the Jewels]

3) Larkin and a 1st for Tyler Myers? So, Larkin and Svech for Myers? Yeah, I don't want that. Also, wanting to deal Mantha++ is again, ridiculous hindsight. At the time the deal was being offered, Mantha was a budding top 6 forward with size and scoring ability who was going to be given a chance to make the Wings as a 19 year old.

Please stop with the Dylan Larkin for Tyler Myers stuff. Bob McKenzie said last October that the Sabres wanted Anthony Mantha. Bob McKenzie. That was a great trade and Holland was too chicken to do his job and acqiure a RHD who could be our long term answer as a #1 d-man.

I know talk of trading prospects scares everyone on this form but you have to give to get and the odds of Mantha ever being anything close to Myers in the NHL are very, very long.

You do know Nill had his hand in pretty much every single player we have right? You do know that Yzerman would need like 2 decades of performance that is much better than what he has shown to even be in the conversation as an upgrade right? This reminds me of the argument that Blashill was going to be better than Babcock. Can we just put these ridiculous notions to bed? Getting rid of anyone who has proven success is a bad way to run a franchise.

We're talking about hiring a GM to replace Holland. Yzerman has more experience and is more accomplished. These are facts.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

That is soooo bad. We are trying to add to the defensive corps.

its alot more difficult to fill out the top of the order than the bottom

you deal dekeyser 100 times out of 100 to land barrie, no questions asked

 

[Pavels Dog]

Please stop with the Dylan Larkin for Tyler Myers stuff. Bob McKenzie said last October that the Sabres wanted Anthony Mantha. Bob McKenzie. That was a great trade and Holland was too chicken to do his job and acqiure a RHD who could be our long term answer as a #1 d-man.

I know talk of trading prospects scares everyone on this form but you have to give to get and the odds of Mantha ever being anything close to Myers in the NHL are very, very long.

5 points and -8 Tyler Myers could be our long-term #1? He hasn't had over 40 points since his rookie season, only over 30 points once since then. Seems injury prone. It's debatable if he's better than Dekeyser. Potential doesn't win hockey games.

In hindsight? IF there was ever a Mantha for Myers deal.. yeah I'd consider it. But Myers is not as amazing as people think and Mantha still has a lot of potential.

It's easy to sit around saying Holland should have traded prospect X, but a philosophy of building through the draft means you don't trade your #1 prospect after he has had a monster season. You protect your best prospects because suddenly one of them turns out the way Larkin is.

 

[Classicnamesup]

Mantha was one of the top prospects in the league back then, no surprise everyone was very nervous giving him away. Now we would be much more comfortable doing it.

Barrie >> DDK and it isn't even close. We badly need a player like Barrie, Fowler, Shattenkirk. Make moves to make it happen, move forwards rather than D plz.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

5 points and -8 Tyler Myers could be our long-term #1? He hasn't had over 40 points since his rookie season, only over 30 points once since then. Seems injury prone. It's debatable if he's better than Dekeyser. Potential doesn't win hockey games.

In hindsight? IF there was ever a Mantha for Myers deal.. yeah I'd consider it. But Myers is not as amazing as people think and Mantha still has a lot of potential.

It's easy to sit around saying Holland should have traded prospect X, but a philosophy of building through the draft means you don't trade your #1 prospect after he has had a monster season. You protect your best prospects because suddenly one of them turns out the way Larkin is.

this is very true, as equally true as a GM should know a players value and potential both good and bad

 

[SimplySolace]

Team needs defense, we should include DDK in every proposal.

 

[Flowah]

I don't think he will either. But hey crazy things happen. Maybe Tampa suddenly drives off a cliff for some reason.

Tampa's not exactly lighting the world on fire right now.

 

[The Zermanator]

Team needs top-end defense, we should include DDK in every proposal.

FTFY.

This team is stronger if we get a top pair guy, even if it means losing DeKeyser.

Kronwall-Green
Ericsson-Barrie

is far better than

Kronwall-Smith
DeKeyser-Ericsson

or whatever other mediocre top 4 combination you can think up with our current d corps.

You gotta give to get. Something a lot of people around here seem to have trouble understanding.