Anyone else think Lou needs to back off with some of his policies?

[CDN24]

no he did not.

Don't be so sure.

He got a 4 year deal at 3.125M coming off his entry level deal after scoring 31 gaols and 31 assists in the last year of his entry level. Then 1 yr away from being a UFA when that deal expired Lou filed for arbitration.

Ultimately he had a star player and he lost him the minute he became eligible to be a UFA... The GM's job is took keep those guys Lou failed.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Don't be so sure.

He got a 4 year deal at 3.125M coming off his entry level deal after scoring 31 gaols and 31 assists in the last year of his entry level. Then 1 yr away from being a UFA when that deal expired Lou filed for arbitration.

Ultimately he had a star player and he lost him the minute he became eligible to be a UFA... The GM's job is took keep those guys Lou failed.

He lost a player that flat out said that he wanted to play in his home state. And he talked to his best friend, Ryan Suter during the Olympics how amazing it would be to play together IN MINNESOTA.

This is why when Suter was given a the exact same deal from Nashville - he STILL went to Minnesota. To play with his best friend. There was no way in God's green earth was Lou Lamoriello able to pay Suter + Parise got from Minnesota, to stay in New Jersey.

but sure. Lou chased Parise away. we can work with that too

 

[D3ADLY]

No he should not back off. Only those players will play for the Leafs that know the real value of dawning that jersey and want to be here. We will not operate like we did for last 50 years. I like what Lou is doing.

 

[CDN24]

He lost a player that flat out said that he wanted to play in his home state. And he talked to his best friend, Ryan Suter during the Olympics how amazing it would be to play together IN MINNESOTA.

This is why when Suter was given a the exact same deal from Nashville - he STILL went to Minnesota. To play with his best friend. There was no way in God's green earth was Lou Lamoriello able to pay Suter + Parise got from Minnesota, to stay in New Jersey.

but sure. Lou chased Parise away. we can work with that too

When he got to be a UFA he wanted to play in his home state, don't you think that maybe Lou has some Impact over the previous years.

I guess Scott N wanted to play with his brother too and Rafalski why did he choose the Wings when he became a free agent? A lot of guys have left have left NJ as UFA's, there is always a public reason but to think that Lou's policies are not part of it is a bit Naïve IMO.

Brian Gionta, Scott Gomez, David Clarkson... Its a long list of stars who have left when they become UFA

 

[Daisy Jane]

When he got to be a UFA he wanted to play in his home state, don't you think that maybe Lou has some Impact over the previous years.

I guess Scott N wanted to play with his brother too and Rafalski why did he choose the Wings when he became a free agent? A lot of guys have left have left NJ as UFA's, there is always a public reason but to think that Lou's policies are not part of it is a bit Naïve IMO.

Brian Gionta, Scott Gomez, David Clarkson... Its a long list of stars who have left when they become UFA

Scott Neidermayer did. he said so. quite frankly, I don't buy this cloak and dagger "well i'm going to SAY this is why, but it's obviously other reasons". for the most part hockey players will say "it wasn't a fit, thanks for the memories." (in Hockey-ese)

ultimately - something I think you are significantly forgetting. New Jersey haemorrhages (or did) money. it didn't matter about how many times they made the playoffs, etc, Medowlands is and has been for a while, 30th in terms of revenue generated. So if there's not a lot of money coming in, you can't pay everyone you want what they feel they are worth.

Do i think some left due to Lou - sure, just like I think a lot of people stayed BECAUSE of Lou. a LOT of players (minus Parise/Scott) generally didn't end up being "amazing" after they left. Meh on Gionta. Seriously, regarding Clarkson? I remember how Holik hit a wall, pretty much the year after he signed his big payday. So maybe instead of Lou "chasing away" people, he was good in not locking anyone down.

but. again. whatever. milage will vary,

 

[CDN24]

Scott Neidermayer did. he said so. quite frankly, I don't buy this cloak and dagger "well i'm going to SAY this is why, but it's obviously other reasons". for the most part hockey players will say "it wasn't a fit, thanks for the memories." (in Hockey-ese)

ultimately - something I think you are significantly forgetting. New Jersey haemorrhages (or did) money. it didn't matter about how many times they made the playoffs, etc, Medowlands is and has been for a while, 30th in terms of revenue generated. So if there's not a lot of money coming in, you can't pay everyone you want what they feel they are worth.

Do i think some left due to Lou - sure, just like I think a lot of people stayed BECAUSE of Lou. a LOT of players (minus Parise/Scott) generally didn't end up being "amazing" after they left. Meh on Gionta. Seriously, regarding Clarkson? I remember how Holik hit a wall, pretty much the year after he signed his big payday. So maybe instead of Lou "chasing away" people, he was good in not locking anyone down.

but. again. whatever. milage will vary,

Look at Scott Neidermayer's contract history with Lou. Fall 1998 as a RFA he had to hold out for a month to get Lou to open the purse strings. Fall 2000 he has to hold out for 2 months as a RFA, Summer 2004 he is again a RFA and files for arbitration to get a 1 yr deal. Lockout wipes out the season and he becomes a UFA and leaves.

I agree not all the UFA's who left went on to great things but the fact remains most guys left NJ as UFA's under Lou's watch. The only NJ drafted ones I can think of who stayed longterm were Elias and Zajac and Brodeur.

 

[Daisy Jane]

Look at Scott Neidermayer's contract history with Lou. Fall 1998 as a RFA he had to hold out for a month to get Lou to open the purse strings. Fall 2000 he has to hold out for 2 months as a RFA, Summer 2004 he is again a RFA and files for arbitration to get a 1 yr deal. Lockout wipes out the season and he becomes a UFA and leaves.

I agree not all the UFA's who left went on to great things but the fact remains most guys left NJ as UFA's under Lou's watch. The only NJ drafted ones I can think of who stayed longterm were Elias and Zajac and Brodeur.

as i stated why.
again. you can believe what you want.

milage will have to vary.

 

[Stephen]

Toronto's a different program than New Jersey with different market conditions and different budget, different lifestyle, etc. Lou has said as much, Shanahan has said as much. We can't assume all those arcane Lou-isms in New Jersey to be modus operandi here, because the power structure is different and the needs of the market are different.

Having been a fan of GM management and franchise building over the years, it does seem like the things Lou did to build his program in NJ also probably hastened some peoples departures from that team. Money and personal reasons account for some of it, but man look at the staggering departure rate from the Devils over the years:

Gionta
Gomez
Holik
Niedermayer
Nieuwendyk
Mogilny
Gilmour
Driver
Parise
Kovalchuk
Clarkson
Rafalski
Madden
Brodeur

 

[Daisy Jane]

Toronto's a different program than New Jersey with different market conditions and different budget, different lifestyle, etc. Lou has said as much, Shanahan has said as much. We can't assume all those arcane Lou-isms in New Jersey to be modus operandi here, because the power structure is different and the needs of the market are different.

Having been a fan of GM management and franchise building over the years, it does seem like the things Lou did to build his program in NJ also probably hastened some peoples departures from that team. Money and personal reasons account for some of it, but man look at the staggering departure rate from the Devils over the years:

Gionta
Gomez
Holik
Niedermayer
Nieuwendyk
Mogilny
Gilmour
Driver
Parise
Kovalchuk
Clarkson
Rafalski
Madden
Brodeur

Understandable. But if you look at the years they hit UFA - generally speaking. the majority of them were "the best" of their year. but when they signed their big contract how much of an impact did they really make?

Other than Parise, Nieuwendyk, Neidermayer, and Mogliny, how much did hey make a massive impact.

as far as I recall - Lou was pushed hard to get a Kolvachuk (hence the deal) and then he wanted to go home. (and he's been gong-showy in the KHL attitude wise, so whatevers).

I'm not handwashing Lou's policies or how he does contracts. But if all of those people wanted max dollars and max years, and NJ couldn't AFFORD it - are you guys honestly saying he should have overpaid and screwed up the Devils even more so they wouldn't have walked away, and then he'd be chastised for being stupid for keeping them. it's like he can't win.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Salary + GP Bonus + Signing bonus = 925k Maximum
A bonuses = 850k max
B bonuses = 2M max

Which means the maximum if all bonuses are reached is 3.775M.

Thanks. Was too lazy to look it up.

 

[colchar]

Holy ****.

I don't understand this fan-base. Whine when we lose. Whine when we win. Whine when we draft a franchise center (or high potential to be one). Are the majority of the posters in this thread 14 year-olds, and still have their mom do their shopping, make their beds, and make their lunches for school? If it was a reliable source, and we had evidence that the contract was not signed due to Lou's reluctance to give performance bonuses, then debate (the Zaitsev bonuses is interesting though). But people are flipping out over absolutely nothing. It's like this fan-base is used to being upset over something, and when there is finally nothing to be upset about, people need to fill this need. So they pick out this musing tweet by... Jim Mirtle? James Mirtle? Myrtle beach? (I can't actually remember his first name).

As for "Lou's rules". These 14 year-old posters need to get a real job after university and see how the world works. There are rules in the workplace, not to mention rules in general if you want to be taken seriously by your peers, or be successful.

Leafs "Jimmies Rustled" Nation.

I often wonder about the age of some posters here too. I suspect that the real world is going to bite a lot of them on the ass.

 

[colchar]

Also his no facial hair policy is nonsense. no contendors are following remotely similar policies yet they have no problem finding success.

The New York Yankees have a personal grooming policy. It has hardly hurt their success now has it?

In some ways i think it may just be exerting authority just for the sake of it.

He is in charge (with the exception of Shanny) so he sets the rules just as any boss does. Since he is setting the rules his version of professionalism is all that matters.

 

[colchar]

Lou is causing a serious problem by not signing Matthews with the appropriate bonuses that we will have to deal with for years.

You have no idea if a problem exists nor how any alleged problem might affect things down the line. None whatsoever. Your comments are based on nothing more than guesses and assumptions on your part. Personally, I would prefer actual facts to guesses and assumptions.

His approach to this is stubborn and archaic, and I won't drink the koolaid and say that he knows what he is doing.
He doesn't.

He knows a damned sight more about running an NHL team than you ever will.

 

[ULF_55]

The New York Yankees have a personal grooming policy. It has hardly hurt their success now has it?

Have to be pretty young not to understand what money can buy.

 

[34]

Lou needs to back off. The no facial hair rule is wrong. This is hockey, not figure skating.

Players should also be allowed to pick their own #'s. Is Toronto the only team in the NHL that does this?

 

[burpsalot]

Lou needs to back off. The no facial hair rule is wrong. This is hockey, not figure skating.

Players should also be allowed to pick their own #'s. Is Toronto the only team in the NHL that does this?

Not that I personally care, but if it's the choice of clean shaven or the ridiculous look of Thorton & Burns, I'll take clean shaven any day.

 

[Maple Leaf]

Lou is ancient
Ancient people are out to lunch
Give the young gentleman some cash

 

[Ropesman]

I agree that Lou's policies are strict and sometimes extreme, but to say that players feel slighted by him or get run out of town just doesn't make sense to me.

If he was as hard headed and just plain bad as some are suggesting why would Shanny, who was drafted and played for Lou, go get him in the first place? Shanahan has repeatedly stated that he wants this to be a safe place to play and a place people want to come to play. If Lou was the type of GM who ruled with an iron fist and an overwhelming number of players disliked why would Shanahan hire him?

That's just my two cents on the idea....

 

[burpsalot]

Lou is ancient
Ancient people are out to lunch
Give the young gentleman some cash

Some posters are young
Young people are gullible
Mirtle is an idiot taking advantage of the gullible
Lou said it will be done soon
Shanny said they give out bonuses
No cash though
Direct deposit

 

[varano]

Parise

He did not. However it was a large blunder for Lou not to trade him while he had the chance. Lou's Code of Honour for dealing with UFA's goes completely against a players "Any team can sign me if they pay me the most" mentality

 

[Maple Leaf]

Some posters are young
Young people are gullible
Mirtle is an idiot taking advantage of the gullible
Lou said it will be done soon
Shanny said they give out bonuses
No cash though
Direct deposit

You are a gentleman
And a scholar
I tip my hat to you
Good Sir

 

[Legion34]

Lou wont be the gym for matthews ufa years. We dont have to worry about that.

Beyond that. What exactly is his numbers rule? High or have to earn it?

If its high. How did he pitch to stamkos?

 

[ShaneFalco]

Lou has earned the right to implement policies
And we've seen over the years the Country Club atmosphere that existed

#CultureChange

 

[colchar]

Have to be pretty young not to understand what money can buy.

I would wager that I am older than you are. And if athletes were so determined to keep facial hair, long hair, etc. as some here seem to be insinuating money wouldn't matter when they can go to other teams and make similar amounts (the Yankees are hardly the only rich team in baseball).

 

[colchar]

Lou needs to back off.

He is the boss so no, he does not need to back off.

The no facial hair rule is wrong.

And why, exactly, is it wrong? What harm has it done? What harm does demanding a professional appearance do? And why stop at facial hair, why not claim he is wrong demanding that they wear suits to the rink? Why not let them wear whatever the hell they want?