Andrew copp

Roomba With a Bauer

Registered User
Sep 11, 2007
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Welcome to the new Kris Draper. Both started in Winterpeg... He's just got a cheaper version of Lang's contract.
That's an insult to prime Kris Draper. Draper in his prime was far and away the best defensive forward in the league. Draper was the original Helm with hands.

I would go so far as to say that if you took prime Kris Draper, put him in the worst team in the league instead of a powerhouse dynasty, and told him to center the first line he would probably look a lot like Larkin.
 

Gniwder

Registered User
Oct 12, 2009
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Bellingham, WA
You are aware that '06, '07, '08, and '09 were all salary-cap years, right?

Welcome to the new Kris Draper. Both started in Winterpeg... He's just got a cheaper version of Lang's contract.


Are you literate? You can read, right?
Yeah, they were cap years where Holland circumvented the cap with his front loaded contracts. That's not legal any more. That's what I already said, it's ironic that you're questioning my literacy.

Isn't Copp getting love? He always gets defenders here, lol. I don't have a literacy issue, I have to pull out the dictionary for YOU, lol.

So anyways, getting back to the point, how does signing Copp to an overpaid contract help the Red Wings build those teams that you mentioned? He's not a skill player, and overpaid. That's the exact opposite of what the team needs, and he's 12 ply on top of everything else.

Try to validate your argument instead of throwing personal insults. HOW DOES AN OVERPAID 3C HELP THE RED WINGS ACHIEVE THE CUP?!?!? Who's the equivalent player with similar contract on those Cup teams?!?!
 

norrisnick

The best...
Apr 14, 2005
29,363
13,942
Yeah, they were cap years where Holland circumvented the cap with his front loaded contracts. That's not legal any more. That's what I already said, it's ironic that you're questioning my literacy.

Isn't Copp getting love? He always gets defenders here, lol. I don't have a literacy issue, I have to pull out the dictionary for YOU, lol.

So anyways, getting back to the point, how does signing Copp to an overpaid contract help the Red Wings build those teams that you mentioned? He's not a skill player, and overpaid. That's the exact opposite of what the team needs, and he's 12 ply on top of everything else.

Try to validate your argument instead of throwing personal insults. HOW DOES AN OVERPAID 3C HELP THE RED WINGS ACHIEVE THE CUP?!?!? Who's the equivalent player with similar contract on those Cup teams?!?!
Check again. Those four seasons had none of those contracts.

No, at best you've got people pointing out that crying about his goals or hits or whatever else it will turn into is silly when he's doing exactly what he's paid to do. And we know this, because it's exactly what he's always done. To expect anything different from his past, is silly.

It's systems more than anything. We need to f*** right off with all the indirect chip out chip in puck movement that we're trying and pass to a friendly sweater. Hitting has nothing to do with anything because the best cap-era Wings' teams hit less than this current version.

Point to the insult.
 

Gniwder

Registered User
Oct 12, 2009
14,437
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Bellingham, WA
Is that 3.5 - 4 range your opinion or is that the actual range? I did not look up every team in the NHL, but the ones I did look up was Jean Gabriel Pageau was the closest match at $5 AVV. Then the LA Kings are paying $8.5 for Pierre-Luc Dubois who is on pace for 38 points. Granted he is an inconsistent 50-60 point getter, so he's an extreme example. He'd easily be out #2 center. But $8.5 tho...
PLD is so overpaid it's hilarious.

You want to emulate the best GMs not the worst, lol.
Check again. Those four seasons had none of those contracts.

No, at best you've got people pointing out that crying about his goals or hits or whatever else it will turn into is silly when he's doing exactly what he's paid to do. And we know this, because it's exactly what he's always done. To expect anything different from his past, is silly.

It's systems more than anything. We need to f*** right off with all the indirect chip out chip in puck movement that we're trying and pass to a friendly sweater. Hitting has nothing to do with anything because the best cap-era Wings' teams hit less than this current version.

Point to the insult.
Questioning someone's literacy is an insult.

Getting back to the point, Copp is a dump and chase, puck cycling player. His assists both primary and secondary are almost entirely from cycling the puck back to the defenseman on his side. Go look at any of his highlights this season. You can blame the system, but that's his game.

Those team you mentioned were al puck possession teams, something this team is really bad at. The reason why they get hemmed into the defensive zone is because they're 12 ply. If Copp was a puck possession player, it wouldn't matter so much, but he's not. He's a defensive player, and in that role you gotta throw checks. He brings so little for his pay.

It's really odd that you are adamant about arguing for a soft player with no puck skills when you're arguing that the team needs to be a puck possession team. Meanwhile you hated the DBC trade and Kane signings, lol. Nice logic.
 

norrisnick

The best...
Apr 14, 2005
29,363
13,942
Questioning someone's literacy is an insult.

Getting back to the point, Copp is a dump and chase, puck cycling player. His assists both primary and secondary are almost entirely from cycling the puck back to the defenseman on his side. Go look at any of his highlights this season. You can blame the system, but that's his game.

Those team you mentioned were al puck possession teams, something this team is really bad at. The reason why they get hemmed into the defensive zone is because they're 12 ply. If Copp was a puck possession player, it wouldn't matter so much, but he's not. He's a defensive player, and in that role you gotta throw checks. He brings so little for his pay.

It's really odd that you are adamant about arguing for a soft player with no puck skills when you're arguing that the team needs to be a puck possession team. Meanwhile you hated the DBC trade and Kane signings, lol. Nice logic.
Not really, but whatever.

I'm guessing that has something to do with what the team is asked to do. He can give and receive a pass just fine. The team as a whole isn't good at getting open for a pass and prefers to rim or chip the puck around. Almost all of them can pass the puck just fine. They choose not to. You're guess is as good as mine as to why they are choosing the indirect puckmovement route, but since they keep getting icetime... I'm going to assume that's because the coaching staff is fine with it.

There is absolutely nothing about defense that necessitates throwing hits.

I was against trading a mint for a $9Mx8yr DeBrincat. Very few people thought that Ottawa was just going to give him away and we'd sign him for less than $8Mx4. And I'm guessing DBC would be ahead of Copp on the HFB/DRW shit list if he went on his goal droughts at $9M/yr. As for Kane... jury is still out on whether that's a net positive or not. He's physically/individually better than most could have anticipated, but his addition has been anything but seamless at this point.
 

Gniwder

Registered User
Oct 12, 2009
14,437
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Bellingham, WA
Not really, but whatever.

I'm guessing that has something to do with what the team is asked to do. He can give and receive a pass just fine. The team as a whole isn't good at getting open for a pass and prefers to rim or chip the puck around. Almost all of them can pass the puck just fine. They choose not to. You're guess is as good as mine as to why they are choosing the indirect puckmovement route, but since they keep getting icetime... I'm going to assume that's because the coaching staff is fine with it.

There is absolutely nothing about defense that necessitates throwing hits.

I was against trading a mint for a $9Mx8yr DeBrincat. Very few people thought that Ottawa was just going to give him away and we'd sign him for less than $8Mx4. And I'm guessing DBC would be ahead of Copp on the HFB/DRW shit list if he went on his goal droughts at $9M/yr. As for Kane... jury is still out on whether that's a net positive or not. He's physically/individually better than most could have anticipated, but his addition has been anything but seamless at this point.
If you think Copp can pass, then we don't need to discuss this any more, lol. He was taken off the PP for a reason. Plays die on his stick. He's playing a simple cycling game because that's what he's capable of doing, and the coaches are letting him play his game. 35pts/season is better than nothing and he can get that playing the cycle game. Same thing Helm/LGD did, but now the team has defensemen that can make plays and also shoot.
 
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Gniwder

Registered User
Oct 12, 2009
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Bellingham, WA
Who do you want to emulate?

LOL.

Seriously though, I think the biggest issue with the roster make up is that this team lacks identity of any sort, compounded by whatever system Lalonde is trying to run. Just a bunch of guys running around trying to outscore their mistakes.

All I know is you won't see a player like Copp with a big contract on Stanley Cup teams.
 

Dotter

THE ATHLETIC IS GARBAGE
Jul 2, 2014
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goo.gl

LOL.

Seriously though, I think the biggest issue with the roster make up is that this team lacks identity of any sort, compounded by whatever system Lalonde is trying to run. Just a bunch of guys running around trying to outscore their mistakes.

All I know is you won't see a player like Copp with a big contract on Stanley Cup teams.

In your linked example, Ken Holland is the best GM and some fans say Yzerman is emulating Kenny's style. So... there's that.
 

Gniwder

Registered User
Oct 12, 2009
14,437
7,736
Bellingham, WA
In your linked example, Ken Holland is the best GM and some fans say Yzerman is emulating Kenny's style. So... there's that.
Let's go with more recent examples. I think anything past a decade is obsolete considering how fast the game has changed.
 

SirloinUB

Registered User
Aug 20, 2010
4,687
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Canada
People forget that among forwards Andrew Copp had the second most assists last season while seeing regular deployment in a shutdown role.


We have 3 forwards who are on pace to match that total. Of course Copp is not one of them lol

He’s had a tough year and is clearly a player because of his work ethic rather than his skill level haha.

Still, there are worse players on this team than him.
 
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Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,223
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Tampere, Finland
Copp would be better in the scoring sheet, if our game tactics would involve point-shots, tip-ins and netfront screens. Those are his strengths at o-zone.

But all of those plays are almost non-existent at this current team. They just play with different style where Copp is a very bad fit.
 

RRhoads

Registered User
Mar 10, 2015
2,887
2,744
Norway
Copp would be better in the scoring sheet, if our game tactics would involve point-shots, tip-ins and netfront screens. Those are his strengths at o-zone.

But all of those plays are almost non-existent at this current team. They just play with different style where Copp is a very bad fit.
Yeah, I agree. Good points
 

RED WINGS STOMP

Registered User
Nov 28, 2022
955
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A worthless bum.

I don't like it, but I got used to him be a nothing on offense. It isn't ideal for a guy making the money he is, but figured he at least helps defensively and on the PK.

But if the San Jose Sharks are dotting this guy up on defense and add that to his already negative value in the offensive zone? Sorry, not acceptable. I would make up an injury and LTIR this guy right now.
 
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letsgowings9999

Registered User
May 13, 2023
660
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Ahhh I remember ppl getting mad at me when we signed him and argued he was a 50+ pt forward lmao good times

Gonna be an expensive bottom 6 player. Cant see yzerman paying 2 mill hit x3 to move him. He should though, it's time to insert the likes of mazur,soderblom and berggren by next the start of next season. Kasper and danielson arent far off
 

Chelis Chili

Proud HFB member since 21 years [sic!]
Dec 26, 2002
706
505
Hockeytown
25 games without goal! Only 10 assists and just one multiple scoring game!

"Own goal" combo with Lyon yesterday!

Horrible!
 
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