Player Discussion Alain Vigneault (MOD: Re-read rules 13-15)

[haveandare]

Please let him go. He seems to seriously think that changing nothing will lead to better results if he just keeps forcing it.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

Please let him go. He seems to seriously think that changing nothing will lead to better results if he just keeps forcing it.

Honestly, I'd be prone to agree with you if there were other examples aside from McI, who is a very unique case, of whom he can play and expect more success with.

Etem stunk. He's getting 14-15 min on average a night in Vanc. He's got like a single point in 10+ games.

No one in the minors. Not one person I'm confident in calling up over Glass and Paille and saying... yep, that was a no brainer.

The Rangers had no big league club depth. And they traded away their future so that when this day came, they could start infusing some talented youth in.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Tanner Glass had more even strength time than Kevin Hayes and Dominic Moore had more even strength ice time than Brassard and the entire third line. Just...why?

 

[Inferno]

Honestly, I'd be prone to agree with you if there were other examples aside from McI, who is a very unique case, of whom he can play and expect more success with.

Etem stunk. He's getting 14-15 min on average a night in Vanc. He's got like a single point in 10+ games.

No one in the minors. Not one person I'm confident in calling up over Glass and Paille and saying... yep, that was a no brainer.

The Rangers had no big league club depth. And they traded away their future so that when this day came, they could start infusing some talented youth in.

Glass and paille are playing because when we had better options...Sheppard, stempniak, a traffic cone, he elected to play worthless players like glass over them.

We let better players go to keep crappy ones because our idiot coach has a fetish for Terrible hockey players.

Here's a thought..?why not dress seven defenseman?

No.. That would make too much sense.

I think our coach relies on this four line hockey be to a fault...you play four line hockey I'd your fourth line doesn't suck balls...if they do, you become a three line team.

Amazing how well stempniak played on both the pp and the pk.

Effing Vigneault....

 

[haveandare]

Honestly, I'd be prone to agree with you if there were other examples aside from McI, who is a very unique case, of whom he can play and expect more success with.

Etem stunk. He's getting 14-15 min on average a night in Vanc. He's got like a single point in 10+ games.

No one in the minors. Not one person I'm confident in calling up over Glass and Paille and saying... yep, that was a no brainer.

The Rangers had no big league club depth. And they traded away their future so that when this day came, they could start infusing some talented youth in.

Better deployment of the current roster alone would make a positive difference IMO.

Play McI first of all, that's a no brainier at this point.

Then, shelter G and Staal for god's sake. They cannot keep up. It's very, very clear. For all the talk about Yandle being poor in his own zone, which I partly disagree with, I'm more than willing to give him cracks at harder minutes if it means he's on the ice more and Staal is on less. I would rather give McI a crack at harder minutes if it means he's on the ice more and G is on less. At least try something with the defense. It's absurd how little changes considering how poor the results are and what little improvement is made.

For the forwards, there's just always wacky stuff like 4th line playing more than any other when down a goal, Glass or Fast or someone leading in TOI for certain periods, etc. It just does't make sense. And if it worked, whatever, I'd be open to it being a good idea. But it doesn't make sense and it doesn't work. It needs to stop.

Also as Inferno stated, in the cases of Paille and especially Glass, AV is stuck with them because he didn't want to use the other better options he had in the past, and now they're gone.

 

[Gordon Bombay]

Please let him go. He seems to seriously think that changing nothing will lead to better results if he just keeps forcing it.

The guy before him tried doing the same thing with his system. AV is digging his own grave. He has resources to work with and doesn't. Yandle's PP usage is enough of a reason to get rid of him. Gee, Alain was it by chance the PP in the 3rd was better or was it because Yandle got more than 20 secs on it? We haven't used him right for a year now, why did we get him again?

 

[Maineice11]

When AV first started here and it was a mess for the first few months, I was extremely patient. It's a new system, new coach, it was going to happen, would have been nice if it didn't happen, but not unexpected. AV was able to coach that team to SC Finals that season, and the next season (last year) to game 7 of the EC Finals. This season with a lot of the same players has not looked right, I think it has a lot to do with his personnel choices in the lineups, which i attribute to lack of accountability. In my opinion, at the NHL level the only way to hold players accountable is either bag skate them, limit their ice time in a game (bench them), or make them healthy scratch. In other words, play the players that are working, the ones that are competing and working hard, i.e. McIlrath. I also believe that Torts was here as the coach for so long that his voice was still in the players heads the last 2 seasons, but has faded off now and that could be the problem.

At this point, 50 games in and playing like this with as many problems as this team has had, if you want to make the playoffs you have to change the coach. I'm for letting AV go today, and hiring a new coach. Not a lot available, but someone that will have that firmness with the players like Torts did. I would like to see either Keenan or Messier take over (mainly i'm just curious what Messier can do as a head coach in the NHL) or a combination of the two, which I think would quite the coaching duo.

That said, this is not all on AV. The players are not competing or working hard enough during the games, which is their job, but it is AV's job to push them to work harder and compete and he has fallen flat on his face this season in that aspect of it.

A change is needed, and it has to happen now, or else the Ranger organization is okay with throwing away this season and another year of Lundqvist in his prime.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

A change is needed, and it has to happen now, or else the Ranger organization is okay with throwing away this season and another year of Lundqvist in his prime.

If you think Lundqvist is in his prime, you have been paying attention.

Firing AV isn't going to solve anything, unless the replacement is Q or Babcock.

 

[Maineice11]

If you think Lundqvist is in his prime, you have been paying attention.

Firing AV isn't going to solve anything, unless the replacement is Q or Babcock.

Comparing Lundqvist's play now to the beginning of the season, you can make the argument he does not look like he is in his prime. He has been letting in soft goals, but he has also made some great saves.

Right now, outside of McIlrath when he plays, McD on occasion, Miller, and the last couple of games Brassard, nobody on this team appears to be competing or working hard during games, and in some of Stepan's comments after the game last night say that. If one or two players are not competing that's one thing, but when you have the majority of the team not competing that has to fall on the coach's shoulders.

I see a poor power play, a poor penalty kill, and lack of high compete level, which I do not believe can be solved in a few trades by the trade deadline.

What changes would you, realistically (Not NHL2016), make to get this team to the playoffs this season, if you don't fire AV?

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

Last night was the straw that broke he camels back for me.

Im jumping on the bandwagon.

AV has worn out his welcome.

 

[True Blue]

I see a poor power play, a poor penalty kill, and lack of high compete level, which I do not believe can be solved in a few trades by the trade deadline.

True on the special teams and compete level. AV needs to change the mindset of the team. Unfortunately, the team is molded in exactly the image that he wants. A one trick pony that is very pretty when prancing. But not one to run through muck and mire.

 

[Off Sides]

Last night was the straw that broke he camels back for me.

Im jumping on the bandwagon.

AV has worn out his welcome.

Welcome to the dark side, we have cookies.

For me it's been just straws too, last year Glass, Stempniak was silly but they were still winning and for the most part his other choices made sense. This year everything from the get go. 14F, Hayes to wing. Stoll center where Moore was, Etem. Yandle's usage. Scratching guys after a goal or good game.

Some of that is on management too. As well some on other stuff that probably forced his choices, but AV is making me sad/mad this year where it was just annoying last year.

 

[Blais to Win]

... if it worked, whatever, I'd be open to it being a good idea. But it doesn't make sense and it doesn't work. It needs to stop.

Very simply and well put.

 

[Don Jaroodi*]

Let's see if Gorton can work some magic at the deadline, otherwise it doesn't matter who you have coaching this team, you aren't winning a Stanley Cup now with Marc Staal, Dan Girardi on this team. Just not gonna happen.

I'd be all for moving everyone over 30 and yes that includes Hank if the price is right.

 

[McRanger]

True on the special teams and compete level. AV needs to change the mindset of the team. Unfortunately, the team is molded in exactly the image that he wants. A one trick pony that is very pretty when prancing. But not one to run through muck and mire.

AV's teams have run through quite a bit of muck and mire the last 2 seasons and postseasons, so I am not sure how anyone can come to that conclusion.

The problem is those teams are not this team. Those teams were not one trick ponies and this team is a zero trick pony. I am not even sure it is a pony.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

Welcome to the dark side, we have cookies.

For me it's been just straws too, last year Glass, Stempniak was silly but they were still winning and for the most part his other choices made sense. This year everything from the get go. 14F, Hayes to wing. Stoll center where Moore was, Etem. Yandle's usage. Scratching guys after a goal or good game.

Some of that is on management too. As well some on other stuff that probably forced his choices, but AV is making me sad/mad this year where it was just annoying last year.

I've gotten to the point where I don't even want us to try to improve the team because I'm certain AV will misuse any players we get, or play inferior players above them.

I thought the Glass thing was just him clinging to the old "every team needs a tough guy" attitude, and while I didn't agree with it, I could live with it...until he decided to play him over players that were clearly more talented and a better fit for our team (Stempniak, Sheppard, Stoll, Megna to an extent).

Then the whole Yandle disaster. we give up a LARGE amount of assets for Keith Yandle, and play him like a bottom pairing Dman?

He randomly holds certain players accountable while others have long leashes, he is terrible at developing talent, and he is incredibly stubborn.

Remember when he said that his biggest downfall with the Canucks was not being able to ice 4 competitive lines? I guess he hasn't learned from his mistakes.

I believe his early successes with this team has given him an air of cockiness and the belief that even though the results have not been in his favor thus far, it will all work out because it has in the past.

He stays the course despite obvious failure.

AV needs to go.

 

[Captain Lindy]

If you think Lundqvist is in his prime, you have been paying attention.

Firing AV isn't going to solve anything, unless the replacement is Q or Babcock.

I think they already have jobs.

 

[Captain Lindy]

I've gotten to the point where I don't even want us to try to improve the team because I'm certain AV will misuse any players we get, or play inferior players above them.

I thought the Glass thing was just him clinging to the old "every team needs a tough guy" attitude, and while I didn't agree with it, I could live with it...until he decided to play him over players that were clearly more talented and a better fit for our team (Stempniak, Sheppard, Stoll, Megna to an extent).

Then the whole Yandle disaster. we give up a LARGE amount of assets for Keith Yandle, and play him like a bottom pairing Dman?

He randomly holds certain players accountable while others have long leashes, he is terrible at developing talent, and he is incredibly stubborn.

Remember when he said that his biggest downfall with the Canucks was not being able to ice 4 competitive lines? I guess he hasn't learned from his mistakes.

I believe his early successes with this team has given him an air of cockiness and the belief that even though the results have not been in his favor thus far, it will all work out because it has in the past.

He stays the course despite obvious failure.

AV needs to go.

I agree with every word of this.

Well said!

 

[aufheben]

Just some player usage by Alain the Brain

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

If you think Lundqvist is in his prime, you have been paying attention.

Firing AV isn't going to solve anything, unless the replacement is Q or Babcock.

There are other good coaches in this league and there are guys who aren't even coaching at this level who will come great coaches.


At this point, I'd rather try to roll the dice on an unknown than keep Alain. Every single criticism that Vancouver fans had about him have manifested themselves this season, along with some new ones.

Where the **** is the guy from 2 seasons ago who actually knew what he was doing? Its as if he did all of that just to prove his worth and then settled into doing things his way because, yolo.

 

[Captain Lindy]

There are other good coaches in this league and there are guys who aren't even coaching at this level who will come great coaches.


At this point, I'd rather try to roll the dice on an unknown than keep Alain. Every single criticism that Vancouver fans had about him have manifested themselves this season, along with some new ones.

Where the **** is the guy from 2 seasons ago who actually knew what he was doing? Its as if he did all of that just to prove his worth and then settled into doing things his way because, yolo.

I remember the Vancouver fans in here saying that too. Time has proven them right. I'm done with this guy. he's misusing Yandle and it is sickening, along with burying Wrath. I'm sick of it already.

 

[GordonGecko]

Don't like the grave AV has dug himself, but he still has some leash left. His job depends on how the Rangers do in the playoffs. It's one thing to crap up the regular season, it's another to crap up the postseason

 

[MacTruck27]

Don't like the grave AV has dug himself, but he still has some leash left. His job depends on how the Rangers do in the playoffs. It's one thing to crap up the regular season, it's another to crap up the postseason

It is another thing to miss the playoffs altogether, which seems like it is becoming more and more of a possibility in this eastern conference.

 

[Inferno]

I honestly don't think we are making the playoffs

 

[Raspewtin]

I will beat this god damn horse until it's erased from existence.



Amazing that the pairs most often played are the ones that are unholy abominations.