A Serious Debate: How to fix this team?

[JCLA]

Giving away thousands of free tickets and diminishing the value to Season Ticket Holders does not make the team more or less likely to relocate. The same base of ~6-8k STH has existed for the past 5+ years.

Front page news of "Canes bring in Duchene!!! Finally a #1C!!" is not driving even one person into the arena. You may as well be talking about a Gleep-Gloops invading the Crab Nebula. The people of Raleigh don't know who Duchene or Turris or James Neal is and they won't care. There are a lot of reasons for that, a primary one for me is the piece of **** who owns the team who has invested just about zero dollars over the past 20 years to promote hockey in Raleigh.

The only thing that will drive attendance is winning. With that in mind, I think you can be fairly sure that Ron Francis is only making moves that he thinks will increase wins. If he thinks the team will do worse with a 1C at the cost of a current top-4 D, that trade ain't happening no matter how bad posters here want it.

1st. i never said anything about giving away tickets.
2nd. I never said the players name is going to bring people. I think people are so inclined to risk the future for the short term right now is because if we don't start winning now and boosting attendance, now, we may not have a team in the near future.
3rd. This is my whole point about why people are up in arms about francis. If this team was rebuilding and middling in attendance I don't think there would be as big a push to make a risky trade. We'd probably be more willing to wait.
4th. it seems this was just a rant you wanted to go on.

 

[JCLA]

This is one of those statements that really drives me crazy. Not to call you out specifically, because I've seen this MANY other times on these boards, but why can't we see him one way and someone else see him another? Sure, if everybody sees him as a 2nd pairing defenseman, then that doesn't get it done. But if we (Canes) come to that conclusion about him due to our more intimate knowledge, but another team still sees him with 1st pairing potential, then he could pull in a 1C. Obviously, you have to find the right trading partner to make that happen, but it is possible.

Well i was responding to him, not somebody with a different opinion.

 

[JCLA]

Hanifin is a 2nd liner with us, and likely always will be with Slavin being in the way. With both being LHD, and Slavin already having the chemistry with Pesce, I don't really think there's a realistic chance for Hanifin to get himself on the 1st line, even if his game improves to that point. Its a nice luxury to have when you already have one of the league's best young d-men on the roster.

So that's where I am coming from when I say he's a 2nd liner for the Canes. Its not an insult, its not saying he can't be good, its that I just don't think he'll supplant Slavin. If you can move him for someone who is still enamored with his potential, you can center him in a deal for a legit 1st liner.

I realized this may have been your point about 5 minutes after I responded.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

The other thing we don't know his how much PK may or may not inhibit big moves when it entails bigger contracts. I'm not saying that is the case, but I do wonder since JR went from a bargain shopper who was a terrible GM to a guy that made aggressive moves in Pittsburgh (Kessel, Hagelin, Daley, Schultz, etc..) and seen as a very good GM.

Instead of obtaining $4.75 (Johansson) or $6M (Duchene) type guys, we are still bargain shoppers. TVR, Teravainen, Kruger (who only makes $2.3M next year), Dhalbeck, Versteeg (with retention), Stempniak, etc... All guys under $3M.

 

[FaulkYouAho]

i think could be our lucic (2nd line PWF). roy our better version of bickell wallmark the next kruger (top of the line 4th line C) saarela shooting those pucks towards roy and the goalie (3rd line scorer). Kuokkanen from what ive seen of him in the NHL he will make it to a 2nd liner that makes those nifty little passes. This teams future is one of the brightest in the NHL the few that have better/comparable futures in talent are Philly and Toronto. This organization has 15 prospects from the last 3 drafts that i think could become full time nhlers. Thats not to mention some of the young talent already in the lineup. Aho Slavin Pesce Faulk Skinner Tuevo Lindholm ect. Imagine a lineup like this
Skinner (40 goals every year) Necas (50 or 60 assists every year) Gauthier (20 goals 50 pts 60-80 pims)
Kuokkanen (30 assists 50 points) Aho (60-70 points yearly) Lindholm (40 assists mostly primary)
The bottom 6 is just unpredictable. so many NHL talent players that can slot in there.
Our defense will just be unstoppable look at this
Hanifin (Doughty type 50 point player) Bean (60 point dman)
Slavin (Even better slavin that will open up offence for Faulk) Faulk (20 goal 50-60 point defenseman)
Flurey (Shut down pair) Pesce (Shut down pair)

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Yeah I know, its like, totally either one or the other. Someone who drafts to develop and also makes strategic moves at the right time could never, ever be a good GM. Its either one extreme or the other!

Right, and Fans are the ones that know exactly when the right time to make a strategic move is. It could never, ever be that a GM knows better.

 

[Stickpucker]

Too bad we didn't pick up Reilly Smith to play 3c this offseason.

 

[sheriff bart]

After reading all this, yeah, time to kill them all.

 

[RibFrabcus]

This

i think could be our lucic (2nd line PWF). roy our better version of bickell wallmark the next kruger (top of the line 4th line C) saarela shooting those pucks towards roy and the goalie (3rd line scorer). Kuokkanen from what ive seen of him in the NHL he will make it to a 2nd liner that makes those nifty little passes. This teams future is one of the brightest in the NHL the few that have better/comparable futures in talent are Philly and Toronto. This organization has 15 prospects from the last 3 drafts that i think could become full time nhlers. Thats not to mention some of the young talent already in the lineup. Aho Slavin Pesce Faulk Skinner Tuevo Lindholm ect. Imagine a lineup like this
Skinner (40 goals every year) Necas (50 or 60 assists every year) Gauthier (20 goals 50 pts 60-80 pims)
Kuokkanen (30 assists 50 points) Aho (60-70 points yearly) Lindholm (40 assists mostly primary)
The bottom 6 is just unpredictable. so many NHL talent players that can slot in there.
Our defense will just be unstoppable look at this
Hanifin (Doughty type 50 point player) Bean (60 point dman)
Slavin (Even better slavin that will open up offence for Faulk) Faulk (20 goal 50-60 point defenseman)
Flurey (Shut down pair) Pesce (Shut down pair)

I don't think we'll have 3 50 point defensemen.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

This

I don't think we'll have 3 50 point defensemen.

Nevermind defensemen, we haven't had three 50 point players since 2010/2011.

 

[Breakdowns]

Nevermind defensemen, we haven't had three 50 point players since 2010/2011.

that`s just sad

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

And many years the Canes had 1. One 50 point player.

10/11: 5 (Staal, Skinner, Ruutu, Cole, Jokinen)
11/12: 1 (Staal)
12/13: Lockout Shortened season
13/14: 2 (Staal, Skinner)
14/15: 1 (Staal)
15/16: 1 (Skinner)
16/17: 1 (Skinner)

Basically, if your name wasn't Eric Staal or Jeff Skinner, you weren't a 50 point player in the last 5 full seasons.

 

[Joe McGrath]

And many years the Canes had 1. One 50 point player.

10/11: 5 (Staal, Skinner, Ruutu, Cole, Jokinen)
11/12: 1 (Staal)
12/13: Lockout Shortened season
13/14: 2 (Staal, Skinner)
14/15: 1 (Staal)
15/16: 1 (Skinner)
16/17: 1 (Skinner)

Basically, if your name wasn't Eric Staal or Jeff Skinner, you weren't a 50 point player in the last 5 full seasons.

That’s awful. Aho has 49 last year, but even still, over 100 players had 50+ points in a down year for scoring.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

That’s awful. Aho has 49 last year, but even still, over 100 players had 50+ points in a down year for scoring.

The Leafs has 6 players with > 50 and 5 with > 60 last year.

 

[Joe McGrath]

I just realized the southern most team the Hurricanes have beaten this year is Toronto.

 

[The Faulker 27]

And many years the Canes had 1. One 50 point player.

10/11: 5 (Staal, Skinner, Ruutu, Cole, Jokinen)
11/12: 1 (Staal)
12/13: Lockout Shortened season
13/14: 2 (Staal, Skinner)
14/15: 1 (Staal)
15/16: 1 (Skinner)
16/17: 1 (Skinner)

Basically, if your name wasn't Eric Staal or Jeff Skinner, you weren't a 50 point player in the last 5 full seasons.

So we still suck. Ok. I'm getting back to work.

 

[mattihp]

fallin for dahlin

To bad it is pronounced Dahliiiiin. Kinda rhymes with Dineen.

 

[the halleJOKEL]

you don't pronounce it falleen?

 

[Lucky Lindy]

There is the answer to our questions.

 

[HisIceness]

What can Brown do for you?

 

[GoldiFox]

I assume that means Brown is going to sit in the Press Box while Jooris plays. Rather than the team bringing up someone to add scoring.

 

[AD Skinner]

you don't pronounce it falleen?

Wasn't this guy a Falleen?

 

[dogbazinho]

The other thing we don't know his how much PK may or may not inhibit big moves when it entails bigger contracts. I'm not saying that is the case, but I do wonder since JR went from a bargain shopper who was a terrible GM to a guy that made aggressive moves in Pittsburgh (Kessel, Hagelin, Daley, Schultz, etc..) and seen as a very good GM.

Instead of obtaining $4.75 (Johansson) or $6M (Duchene) type guys, we are still bargain shoppers. TVR, Teravainen, Kruger (who only makes $2.3M next year), Dhalbeck, Versteeg (with retention), Stempniak, etc... All guys under $3M.

While I don't know how much it impacts current state of affairs, one thinks It makes us a little more hesitant with Duchene. I do think being cheap led to some bad trades where we had to dump contracts unnecessarily. It's one thing when teams have to trade away contracts to fit under the cap, or use it to sign another player, it's another when we do it just to save money.

 

[dogbazinho]

On offense we seem a bit predictable on most nights. I'm not sure if our tactics, lack of chemistry, or talent but we are so enthralled with cycling the puck that even when the rare player cuts to the net the player with the puck usually chooses to cycle the puck behind the net again. The only 3 times I've seen us break from this is:

1. Skinner gets bored and takes it upon himself to beat his man to the net.
2. Puck gets momentarily stripped from us, ricochets to an open man which leads to our best scoring chance.
3 Puck goes back to the point and they shoot a predictable shot either right at the goalies chest, off net, or into the shins of a defender.

 

[Stickpucker]

Oh no sir we change it up....even lines cycle clockwise while odd lines cycle counter clockwise