PGT: 9/20 - Canada vs USA - Canada 4 United States 2 FINAL - USA ELIMINATED

[Scotty B]

Originally Posted by IslandBeast
Yeah if that 6'9 basketball player from Alabama decides to play hockey instead...look out...and I bet that 6'4 300 pound football player from Texas could skate like the wind if he had enough practice..

Sure sure...and Bo Knows Hockey... & Jordan's a five tool guy at baseball...NOT...

Go hothouse your ALL GIANT team at Ann Arbour, for 6-10 years or so, and get back to us...

I'm betting our A team spanks them silly...

Speaking of Giants...Buff was pretty quiet last night...and was a minus on the nite...maybe he picked the wrong sport?

 

[Dbrownss]

Sure sure...and Bo Knows Hockey... & Jordan's a five tool guy at baseball...NOT...

Go hothouse your ALL GIANT team at Ann Arbour, for 6-10 years or so, and get back to us...

I'm betting our A team spanks them silly...

Speaking of Giants...Buff was pretty quiet last night...and was a minus on the nite...maybe he picked the wrong sport?

That's because he's an awful defenseman....

 

[AINEC*]

If the States won they'd be losing their minds, yet Canadians aren't classy because they celebrate hahaha. Typical

 

[Coaches Coroner]

If the States won they'd be losing their minds, yet Canadians aren't classy because they celebrate hahaha. Typical

Pretty much sums it up.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

If the States won they'd be losing their minds, yet Canadians aren't classy because they celebrate hahaha. Typical

If only someone had said that.

Most people are responding to posts in the vein of 'Yankees simply aren't good at hockey."

 

[AD1066]

Yeah if that 6'9 basketball player from Alabama decides to play hockey instead...look out...and I bet that 6'4 300 pound football player from Texas could skate like the wind if he had enough practice..

You do realize that Seth Jones is the son of a former NBA player?

 

[Dbrownss]

If the States won they'd be losing their minds, yet Canadians aren't classy because they celebrate hahaha. Typical

As an American...I'd lose my mind because it shouldn't and didn't happen. Team Canada is simply the best. You are correct though...a winning underdog is a sore winner. As for Canada, it was a given. I don't mind some of the chest thumping considering team USA was built to beat Canada...and lost in a laughable fashion. That's not on the American fans...that's on the clown shoe managment team.

 

[Srsly]

If it makes you feel good to think that USA would beat Canada just cuz Kessel would have been on the team then have at it.

But seriously do you think USA would have beaten Canada yesterday if Kessel was good enough to have been selected?

Just my opinion. We all have different opinions. It doesn't make anyone better or worse then anyone else. The sun will come up tomorrow.

I love Kessel but he would probably make the score closer to 5-3 or 5-4 if he were on the ice. He's a great player but his two way game would probably be the cause of some goals against the US as well. I don't think he's as poor defensively as some do, but team Canada would be able to pounce on most forwards that aren't far above average defensively. He certainly would have helped with Team Europe though...

 

[Frank the Tank]

Related to the topic of Canada vs. US approach to hockey that has been discussed, I think certain quotes by American players speak to their naive approach to the game:

"If it comes to 100% skill, they win. 100% grit, we win." — T.J. Oshie

Canada has big tough players too that also happen to be very skilled. To refer to Canada as pure skill is only going to motivate guys like Weber, Burns, Perry, ROR, and Getzlaf to play tougher. The best thing that happened to Canada was the US beating them in the first exhibition game while running around and hitting the Canadian players. The next game Canada arrived ready to play skilled AND gritty hockey, and Canada never had a problem in setting the tone over the ensuing two games. I knew it was a great sign for Canada when guys like Tavares and Thornton were willing to make an example of Kesler (basically sticking-up for Weber). It really demonstrated that the team mentality had been achieved.

 

[NickLidstrom]

Did he really say that?

Sean Avery is retired, so it's unlikely.

 

[buttman*]

Related to the topic of Canada vs. US approach to hockey that has been discussed, I think certain quotes by American players speak to their naive approach to the game:



Canada has big tough players too that also happen to be very skilled. To refer to Canada as pure skill is only going to motivate guys like Weber, Burns, Perry, ROR, and Getzlaf to play tougher. The best thing that happened to Canada was the US beating them in the first exhibition game while running around and hitting the Canadian players. The next game Canada arrived ready to play skilled AND gritty hockey, and Canada never had a problem in setting the tone over the ensuing two games. I knew it was a great sign for Canada when guys like Tavares and Thornton were willing to make an example of Kesler (basically sticking-up for Weber). It really demonstrated that the team mentality had been achieved.

The US has never out grinded Canada. They have some great skaters but to suggest you are going to outgrind Canada? Crosby, Marchand, Getzlaf, Perry, Benn (injured), Keith (injured), Weber, Burns, Bergeron, Toews, Ryan O'reilly, Thornton, Taveres etc. these guys are skilled but they all play a grinding style. That's what makes Canada so tough. Canada can play any game you want. Skill, size, grinding, speed, special teams, goaltending etc. And the one intagible the US sorely lacks -- leadership.

 

[Scotty B]

If it makes you feel good to think that USA would beat Canada just cuz Kessel would have been on the team then have at it.

But seriously do you think USA would have beaten Canada yesterday if Kessel was good enough to have been selected?

Just my opinion. We all have different opinions. It doesn't make anyone better or worse then anyone else. The sun will come up tomorrow.

I'm only saying Kessel shoulda been on the team...and I believe he woulda likely delayed having hand surgery to do so...As for the rest?

I'm not in the crystal ball business

 

[buttman*]

If only someone had said that.

Most people are responding to posts in the vein of 'Yankees simply aren't good at hockey."

Americans are good at hockey and getting better as more play and they put more money into there programs. Lots of great young Americans like Gaudreau, Matthews, Eichel, Trouba, Jones, Gostisbehere, Larkin etc. coming up through the ranks.

 

[CrypTic]

- That said, now that I'm watching in the States and on ESPN, the tournament has been billed non-stop as a pulpit for propaganda regarding how amazing this US team is (was), and how they were built to beat Canada. The number of times that was repeated (at least on ESPN and the NHL Network, the latter which I thought would be neutral) was staggering. Best of all was the non-stop harping about 1 friggin win in 1996! They brought in Hull, Chelios (who were actually fun for commentary), Doug Weight with his ring, talked about Amonte all the time, and never made ANY significant mention that there HAS been a WC since 1996, and that the US didn't do that well. To say nothing of the defeats that they have suffered at the Olympics (I'll leave out the World Championships cuz nobody has all their players), directly at the hands of Canada. So, while I get the hype of the matchup, there was just this all too familiar unbalanced bluster. The other "Make America Great Again" thread...it's not completely satirical, given the rhetoric.

Anyway, just sick of having to watch roundtables and documentaries on the 1996 World Cup.

- The blame on the coaching and management is well deserved. There is also blame to go around on the players, and I'll say outright that this version of Pacioretty is very familiar and very alarming. Emelin is having a better tournament. Kane, Pavelski, JVR, Oshie -- they just didn't bring it, no matter what Torts failed to do. I actually don't think that there's a gap in US and Canadian talent, but there definitely is a difference in the system buy in and "110%" effort of every player on Canada, going back to probably 2002, but even more obvious under Babcock. Which brings me to my next point:

- TC is just unbelievably well-oiied and dedicated to executing the game plan. There is a certain pride factor that I'm happy to see exists in our collective consciousness, but that permeates to NHL players as well; I don't even agree with the roster 100%, but whoever is there is playing by Team Canada rules.

So, as much as the US played poorly, they barely had a second to make a decision -- there was already someone (superstar/elite player) with fresh legs bearing down on them. Credit has to be given to Canada for making the US look so helpless. I think that in the Europe game, it was more about not knowing how to regroup, though Europe has certainly bought in to their system.

I agree about ESPN pushing the 1996 win. It was way too much.

I disagree about the players not trying, though I think some of that was Torts being a bad coach, which Hull and Chelios alluded to. IMO part of that was also that players like Pavelski, JVR, Oshie and Kane are used to being on good possession teams. Pavs, Kane, and some of the other players are also used to playing in front of good d-men who move the puck to the forwards. Look at the corsis for Team Canada vs Team USA players:



It's a lot easier for forwards to look good when the d-men are getting the puck and moving it to them quickly. (And for the d-men to play more aggressively and score when the forwards are staying back to cover for them.) The players have some responsibility for the team's play but I don't think it's a matter of character or lack of desire or effort for most of them, like some ppl are suggesting in this thread. It's a lot easier to look like you're giving 100% on a good team that's playing well with good systems, good coaching, and game plan that's working well than on a poorly constructed team that may lack the above.

 

[haveandare]

I agree about ESPN pushing the 1996 win. It was way too much.

I disagree about the players not trying, though I think some of that was Torts being a bad coach, which Hull and Chelios alluded to. IMO part of that was also that players like Pavelski, JVR, Oshie and Kane are used to being on good possession teams. Pavs, Kane, and some of the other players are also used to playing in front of good d-men who move the puck to the forwards. Look at the corsis for Team Canada vs Team USA players:



It's a lot easier for forwards to look good when the d-men are getting the puck and moving it to them quickly. (And for the d-men to play more aggressively and score when the forwards are staying back to cover for them.) The players have some responsibility for the team's play but I don't think it's a matter of character or lack of desire or effort for most of them, like some ppl are suggesting in this thread. It's a lot easier to look like you're giving 100% on a good team that's playing well with good systems, good coaching, and game plan that's working well than on a poorly constructed team that may lack the above.

Yup. Torts never really got this in NY or Columbus - it doesn't matter much how good your forwards are in a vacuum if they're playing on a team and/or in a system that doesn't allow for the D to get them the puck quickly and reliably.

 

[PullHard]

And yet it seems fairly consistent with all observable results, doesn't it.

Which part of Kane's face in the dying minutes looking like he was about to break down in tears says "I'm not trying my hardest and I don't care about our results" to you? Do you honestly think those 20 some guys on the American team are hitting and taking hits, engaging in puck battles, etc. because they don't care about the results of the game? What about their personal pride even just ignoring any sort of nationalistic motivation?

 

[Murray0930*]

I just gotta say as far as U.S. Hockey goes Torts just didn't play his cards right if it were me I would have Big Buff crash the net ESPECIALLY on the power play Canada has no answer for that just ask the Canucks lol

 

[Beansy*]

I just gotta say as far as U.S. Hockey goes Torts just didn't play his cards right if it were me I would have Big Buff crash the net ESPECIALLY on the power play Canada has no answer for that just ask the Canucks lol

The Canucks never had d-men like Weber or Burns. I suspect Canada would have an answer for that.

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

True but they also need guys who play a complete two way game if they want to beat Canada. They need guys who are not scared to go to the tough areas of the ice and in the corners. They need guys who will not do a figure 8 ice dancing move when it comes to battling for the puck. You don't beat Canada with guys like Kessel. He would be rendered completely moot against Canada.

Just my opinion. We all have different opinions. It doesn't make anyone better or worse then anyone else.

You do however win Stanley Cups with him

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

US are barely a top 6 team is this tourney .... no surprise here , let's move on to a top team and beat them down
GO CANADA
maybe next one, US and Mexico can combine - team South-North America

Someone skipped a geography class...

 

[Michel Beauchamp]

Three goals went passed him and off the post...in the waning minutes of the game...and one he just feebly waved at...

You probably meant pucks.

So 3 went by him and went in...

What do you mean, no ?

Much ado about nothing in that case.

 

[Preisst*]

Did you watch Canada vs US semi final game in Sochi? Kessel came within a whisker of scoring early in first period which woulda put a whole new complection on that game ( and quite possibly the whole tourney ) considering final score was 1-0 Canada...

Kessel was a dangerous, DANGEROUS forward in Sochi...a dynamic potential game breaker who really stood out alongside both his peers and opponents at times

Yeah I did. If Kessel would have happened to score on that then I'm sure Canada would have buckled down and won by a higher score then they did. End result is still the same.

Doesn't mean he did anything else in the game, which by the way he didn't.

 

[Preisst*]

I love Kessel but he would probably make the score closer to 5-3 or 5-4 if he were on the ice. He's a great player but his two way game would probably be the cause of some goals against the US as well. I don't think he's as poor defensively as some do, but team Canada would be able to pounce on most forwards that aren't far above average defensively. He certainly would have helped with Team Europe though...

There's a reason the USA had zero interest in picking him for their team.

Under your suggestion Kessel either would have scored a goal and caused a goal or scored 2 goals and caused one.

I suggest he would have been a complete non factor scoring wise but may have been the cause of 1-3 goals against.

 

[SanDogBrewin]

If only someone had said that.

Most people are responding to posts in the vein of 'Yankees simply aren't good at hockey."

Yep

 

[Scotty B]

Originally Posted by Lazlo Hollyfeld
If only someone had said that.

Most people are responding to posts in the vein of 'Yankees simply aren't good at hockey."

Is this guy even Canuck? Pretty sure I saw Paris + French Flag...