4-5 years from now, Calle Jarnkrok will be a...

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

Still worst trade we've made in a long ass time. And I rather like Legwand. Even though he's getting ****ted on by Babs.

 

[PullHard]

Jarnkrok 12-2-7-9 +7
Legwand 21-4-7-11 -9

That's a hard pill to swallow. At least for me.

 

[Johnz96*]

I've watched a few Preds games since the trade and I think he's been pretty good but not as good as some in this thread were making him out to be while on his hot streak. He's been very good at even strength, but oddly he's looked somewhat lost on the PP despite getting lots of time there.

He's gotten better at faceoffs since his scoring dried up and he's definitely not a liability defensively but Trotz has certainly helped him by almost exclusively starting him in the offensive zone.

Looks like he's far better off in Nashville than he was in Detroit though, he's getting an opportunity there that he couldn't have gotten here for at least a year or 2.

That's just stupidity by the Wings brass. He would arguably be the Wings' 2nd best Center entering the playoffs this year
They didn't learn nothing from their mistakes of the past 2 seasons when ther kids saved the seasons only because they were afforded the opportunity to do so because of injuries.

 

[FlashyG]

That's just stupidity by the Wings brass. He would arguably be the Wings' 2nd best Center entering the playoffs this year
They didn't learn nothing from their mistakes of the past 2 seasons when ther kids saved the seasons only because they were afforded the opportunity to do so because of injuries.

No he wouldn't. Datsyuk, Sheahan, Helm right now are clearly ahead of him. Then you have Zetterberg, Weiss, and if need be Franzen who are all also ahead of him. He just couldn't crack our line-up.

The kids also had almost nothing to do with our play last season, and surely didn't "save" that season.

This season they've been impact players but ones who are, were arguably able to do so because of the extra time they spent in the AHL.

 

[Claypool]

That's just stupidity by the Wings brass. He would arguably be the Wings' 2nd best Center entering the playoffs this year
They didn't learn nothing from their mistakes of the past 2 seasons when ther kids saved the seasons only because they were afforded the opportunity to do so because of injuries.

Jarnkrok clearly wanted to play in the NHL and the Red Wings didn't think he was ready. He was probably two years away from making the team at the earliest. So they dumped him. Better to get something for him than let him return to Sweden for nothing. Everyone would have been upset if Calle bolted and the Red Wings lost him for nothing.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

That's just stupidity by the Wings brass. He would arguably be the Wings' 2nd best Center entering the playoffs this year
They didn't learn nothing from their mistakes of the past 2 seasons when ther kids saved the seasons only because they were afforded the opportunity to do so because of injuries.

Better than Datsyuk, Sheahan, or Helm? No.

You also fail to contemplate his position on the Wings next year. With Zetterberg and Weiss healthy, you have a logjam at center you aren't really getting out of without moving assets around just for a guy who hadn't played an NHL game yet.

Unfortunately this will be an issue whenever he scores points (unless he pulls a Brunner and falls off the face of the earth) instead of people sitting back and taking a long-term approach to analyzing the kid. He hasn't even played a full season yet.

 

[Johnz96*]

No he wouldn't. Datsyuk, Sheahan, Helm right now are clearly ahead of him. Then you have Zetterberg, Weiss, and if need be Franzen who are all also ahead of him. He just couldn't crack our line-up.

The kids also had almost nothing to do with our play last season, and surely didn't "save" that season.

This season they've been impact players but ones who are, were arguably able to do so because of the extra time they spent in the AHL.

The Wings had Sammy, Cleary, Bertuzzi, Miller, Andersson, Abdelkader, Emmeron, Eaves and Weiss ahaead of Nyquist and Tatar at the beginning of the season. We might have won a Cup if they used Tatar or Nyquist in Abby's place last year.
I argued that Nyquist and Tatar were better than all those guys at the beginning of the season and most people here were like 'maybe they will be but they aren't now'
I argued for years that Filppula and Hudler were better than guys that were playing ahead of them or cutting into their opportunities and because of it much better than most people here thought they were.
I like Sheahan but Jarnkrok is a better hockey player. Jarnkrok more than doubled Weiss' production in less than half of the games.
When he got called up to Nashville I proposed a bet that he would score at a higher PPG and have a better +/- than Legwand. Nobody took me up on it.

Tatar, Nyquist and Andersson were afforded some opportunity (although they weren't really given a chance to make much of an impact) last year and were an improvement over some of the slugs that played ahead of them and they wouldn't have been given an opportunity at all if it weren't for injuries.

 

[FlashyG]

The Wings had Sammy, Cleary, Bertuzzi, Miller, Andersson, Abdelkader, Emmeron, Eaves and Weiss ahaead of Nyquist and Tatar at the beginning of the season. We might have won a Cup if they used Tatar or Nyquist in Abby's place last year.
I argued that Nyquist and Tatar were better than all those guys at the beginning of the season and most people here were like 'maybe they will be but they aren't now'
I argued for years that Filppula and Hudler were better than guys that were playing ahead of them or cutting into their opportunities and because of it much better than most people here thought they were.
I like Sheahan but Jarnkrok is a better hockey player. Jarnkrok more than doubled Weiss' production in less than half of the games.
When he got called up to Nashville I proposed a bet that he would score at a higher PPG and have a better +/- than Legwand. Nobody took me up on it.

Tatar, Nyquist and Andersson were afforded some opportunity (although they weren't really given a chance to make much of an impact) last year and were an improvement over some of the slugs that played ahead of them and they wouldn't have been given an opportunity at all if it weren't for injuries.

Sheahan is better than Jarnkrok in almost every conceivable way right now. Whether he'll stay that way is another question entirely but right now he's at worst even with Calle offensively, better defensively, light years ahead as far as physical play, and even further ahead when it comes to faceoffs.

Weiss hasn't played healthy with the Wings at all, if he doesn't return to form then Jarnkrok is the better player, but a healthy Weiss is about where Jarnkrok might get if he reaches his full potential.

People didn't take you up on your bet because it is completely lopsided in your favor. Jarnkrok played 12 games, so all his per game numbers are going to be inflated. Lets see how he does over the course of a full season.

In his best game of the season (today's) he started almost every shift in the offensive zone, went 25% on faceoffs, and played almost exclusively against Minnesota's 4th line and 3rd defensive pair. Legwand today started most of his shifts in the defensive or Neutral zones, went 100% on faceoffs, and went up against St. Louis top defensive pairing, and their top 2 forward lines.

To compare their numbers without context isn't fair to Legwand who's being counted on to do far more than Jarnkrok is being asked to do, or is likely capable of.

 

[SoupNazi]

Jarnkrok clearly wanted to play in the NHL and the Red Wings didn't think he was ready. He was probably two years away from making the team at the earliest. So they dumped him. Better to get something for him than let him return to Sweden for nothing. Everyone would have been upset if Calle bolted and the Red Wings lost him for nothing.

Hat Trick Dick, anyone?

 

[Honest M]

If anything Nyquist's play this season is evidence that Holland's system of keeping kids in the minors longer than everyone else works.

I can't see any reason to believe that if he was called up earlier he'd be any better than he is right now.

LOL, this is really.. . Nyquist's development was held back by this decision, for a player that can contribute and adapt to the game it serves him better playing him where he belongs. Nyquist has taken quite a few steps since he got his chance.

Better send Dats and Z to some minor league so they can reach their potential, nooo …
Anyway maybe Nyquist have caught up the lost time so he wouldn’t be better if he was given the chance earlier.
For the teem, the record would have been better and we (paying customers) would have some more highlights to enjoy.

Regarding Jarnkrok I’m not that concerned. I think he can be a decent third liner but preds are a better fit for him since he would have a hard time getting on the wings lineup.

 

[Soft Rock Renegade]

Jarnkrok clearly wanted to play in the NHL and the Red Wings didn't think he was ready. He was probably two years away from making the team at the earliest. So they dumped him. Better to get something for him than let him return to Sweden for nothing. Everyone would have been upset if Calle bolted and the Red Wings lost him for nothing.

even so, you could argue legwand isn't worth a second round pick. he's a fourth line winger on this team. fourth line wingers are not worth 2nds.

and the spot jarnkrok could have taken would have been andersson's, who'd be in legwands spot right now.

and calle could easily play the wing. a lot of centers that come up here start on the wing

 

[ap3x]

In his best game of the season (today's) he started almost every shift in the offensive zone, went 25% on faceoffs, and played almost exclusively against Minnesota's 4th line and 3rd defensive pair. Legwand today started most of his shifts in the defensive or Neutral zones, went 100% on faceoffs, and went up against St. Louis top defensive pairing, and their top 2 forward lines.

To compare their numbers without context isn't fair to Legwand who's being counted on to do far more than Jarnkrok is being asked to do, or is likely capable of.

Right, it's all about the context. Still, Jarnkrok's performance in his first 12 games is worth mentioning. Happy (for him) and kind of sad (about him leaving) at the same time. But as u said: gotta wait how consistent he will be over the course of a full season. Anyways, wishing him all the best, even if it shouldn't be with the Wigns this time.

 

[Frk It]

even so, you could argue legwand isn't worth a second round pick. he's a fourth line winger on this team. fourth line wingers are not worth 2nds.

and the spot jarnkrok could have taken would have been andersson's, who'd be in legwands spot right now.

and calle could easily play the wing. a lot of centers that come up here start on the wing

I remember in another thread someone saying when were healthy Hollands not expecting Legwand to be in the top 6, maybe it was top 6 center.

So my question is.... Why the **** are we giving up a 2nd and Jarnkrok for a guy you're expecting to be a bottom 6 center when healthy?

 

[Frk It]

Really not liking this trend of grabbing guys who are 1st line centers by default on bad teams, and getting deceived by their 50-55 pt seasons.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

I remember in another thread someone saying when were healthy Hollands not expecting Legwand to be in the top 6, maybe it was top 6 center.

So my question is.... Why the **** are we giving up a 2nd and Jarnkrok for a guy you're expecting to be a bottom 6 center when healthy?

Did Holland say that, or is that just what someone thinks Holland is using him for? If the former, then that is a bad thing. If the latter, then it's just baseless speculation.

Really not liking this trend of grabbing guys who are 1st line centers by default on bad teams, and getting deceived by their 50-55 pt seasons.

Does that mean Jarnkrok achieving a 50-55 point season on the Predators during his career will be deceptive?

 

[Frk It]

Did Holland say that, or is that just what someone thinks Holland is using him for? If the former, then that is a bad thing. If the latter, then it's just baseless speculation.



Does that mean Jarnkrok achieving a 50-55 point season on the Predators during his career will be deceptive?

This is the post I was trying to find (http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=83350185&postcount=120), and it didn't say exactly what I thought it did. But in most cases "checking line player" = bottom 6er.

You can move my post to this thread if you think it's necessary.

 

[Cbdudek]

I am really happy that Jarnkrok is doing well with the Preds this season. I think that Jarnkrok has the potential to be a top 6 player in the NHL. The question is, will he put it together. I don't think that Holland moving Jarnkrok for Legwand was a bad trade in itself. So long as Legwand is signed is the key.

 

[Hckytwn]

Jarnkrok clearly wanted to play in the NHL and the Red Wings didn't think he was ready. He was probably two years away from making the team at the earliest. So they dumped him. Better to get something for him than let him return to Sweden for nothing. Everyone would have been upset if Calle bolted and the Red Wings lost him for nothing.

Jarnkrok leaving for Sweden was an unsubstantiated lie. Both him and the Red Wings are on the record saying that wasn't the case--stop using this an excuse.

But, you're right in saying that the Wings didn't think he was ready... but that's the problem, right? They had no clue what they had. At least in the near-term, it's apparent he's 1) NHL-ready 2) As productive (if not better) than Legwand.

So, we traded him and a 2nd round pick for what? A 4th line center? We're still just as backed up at center with or without Jarnkrok, so clearly this currently stands as a horrible trade.

 

[Hckytwn]

I am really happy that Jarnkrok is doing well with the Preds this season. I think that Jarnkrok has the potential to be a top 6 player in the NHL. The question is, will he put it together. I don't think that Holland moving Jarnkrok for Legwand was a bad trade in itself. So long as Legwand is signed is the key.

Did this trade do anything for us? Looking at the stats today, the answer is a resounding no. Jarnkrok is younger, cheaper and better than Legwand (not even counting the second round pick we lost).

The correct move was probably to bring up Jarnkrok and play him, but only time will confirm that.

 

[ap3x]

Jarnkrok leaving for Sweden was an unsubstantiated lie. Both him and the Red Wings are on the record saying that wasn't the case--stop using this an excuse.

Sources backing up your accusation? Didn't see any offical comments/statements, which question the "excuse".

 

[TKB]

I remember in another thread someone saying when were healthy Hollands not expecting Legwand to be in the top 6, maybe it was top 6 center.

So my question is.... Why the **** are we giving up a 2nd and Jarnkrok for a guy you're expecting to be a bottom 6 center when healthy?

That's easy….Legwand is (was) locked up for 6 weeks.

 

[Hckytwn]

Sources backing up your accusation? Didn't see any offical comments/statements, which question the "excuse".

Try Google? Here's one from the horse's mouth--plus there's another one out there from one of our assistant coaches saying it wasn't true:

http://section303.com/jarnkrok-puts-to-bed-rumors-of-returning-to-sweden-52339

 

[SoupNazi]

Since we have been rehashing the same arguments for the past ten pages, let's go ahead and lock this one up. Let's focus on the playoff hockey to come.