2023-24 FPHL Season Thread

[jabberoski]

What does that even mean? I'm a pro wrestling fan so I know what the WWE is. There's very few fights in River Dragons games which is a complete 180 when the old Columbus Cottonmouths were in the ECHL and the SPHL and there were legit 5-8 fights EVERY GAME. There's not even one fight a game now in the FPHL at least with the River Dragons.

I don't know where you live but the Columbus team is the only reasonable option for my wife and I to watch live hockey. The River Dragons are honestly at least as good as an ECHL team and our record reflects it.

Not sure why you feel the need to comment on the lack of skill in the FPHL per your words. This is a high single A minor league we are talking about. It sounds you like have unrealistic expectations of what that means. I don't go to a similar baseball minor league and yell at why the players aren't throwing 105 mph fastballs or hitting 450 foot home runs.

I can assure you that there were not 5-8 fights per game when the Cottonmouths were in the ECHL.

 

[The Hobgoblin]

I can assure you that there were not 5-8 fights per game when the Cottonmouths were in the ECHL.

It might have been higher. My wife and I were season ticket holders for years for the Cottonmouths. There were tons of fights during games including goalie fights. I'm actually glad those days are gone because it was frankly boring to have the games constantly broken up for wild melees.

 

[jabberoski]

It might have been higher. My wife and I were season ticket holders for years for the Cottonmouths. There were tons of fights during games including goalie fights. I'm actually glad those days are gone because it was frankly boring to have the games constantly broken up for wild melees.

No, it was not higher. It would be way lower. Maybe when the Cottonmouths were in the CHL it was 5-8. No chance in the ECHL.

 

[JMCx4]

... I don't know where you live but the Columbus team is the only reasonable option for my wife and I to watch live hockey. The River Dragons are honestly at least as good as an ECHL team and our record reflects it.

Not sure why you feel the need to comment on the lack of skill in the FPHL per your words. This is a high single A minor league we are talking about. It sounds you like have unrealistic expectations of what that means. I don't go to a similar baseball minor league and yell at why the players aren't throwing 105 mph fastballs or hitting 450 foot home runs.

So much to comment on here, but luckily comments are the lifeblood of internet chat boards ...

(1) There's no quantifiable way I've found (though many other hockey fans think & claim they have) for direct comparisons among the sub-AHL level hockey leagues. Team records are greatly influenced by their regular levels of intra-league competition, as are spectator perspectives of the quality of a team or even a single player in a given league (the latter with an occasional but rare exception). These conditions make inter-league comparisons fruitless, and tend to feed heated debates over one fan's favorite league being "at least as good as" another fan's favorite.

(2) But on the premise of inevitable standard categorizations of the levels of NA minor pro hockey, I'd respectfully suggest you reconsider your characterization of the current FPHL as "a high single A minor league." Or at a minimum I'd like to know which league you consider to represent LOW single A hockey.

(3) Over my last 12 seasons of following minor pro hockey (mostly by traveling as I've only had one "home team" to root for & they lasted just one miserable season), I've slowly grown to appreciate the FHL/FPHL as just another color on the multi-colored palette (and palate) of the North American game. It's not elegant, and it's sometimes flaky, but it can be entertaining when it takes itself seriously.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

onto wytheville's blue ridge bobcats at the end of the month.

 

[The Hobgoblin]

So much to comment on here, but luckily comments are the lifeblood of internet chat boards ...

(1) There's no quantifiable way I've found (though many other hockey fans think & claim they have) for direct comparisons among the sub-AHL level hockey leagues. Team records are greatly influenced by their regular levels of intra-league competition, as are spectator perspectives of the quality of a team or even a single player in a given league (the latter with an occasional but rare exception). These conditions make inter-league comparisons fruitless, and tend to feed heated debates over one fan's favorite league being "at least as good as" another fan's favorite.

(2) But on the premise of inevitable standard categorizations of the levels of NA minor pro hockey, I'd respectfully suggest you reconsider your characterization of the current FPHL as "a high single A minor league." Or at a minimum I'd like to know which league you consider to represent LOW single A hockey.

(3) Over my last 12 seasons of following minor pro hockey (mostly by traveling as I've only had one "home team" to root for & they lasted just one miserable season), I've slowly grown to appreciate the FHL/FPHL as just another color on the multi-colored palette (and palate) of the North American game. It's not elegant, and it's sometimes flaky, but it can be entertaining when it takes itself seriously.

I'm not putting down any league or trying to do so by comparison. There's a place for minor league pro hockey at whatever level it is considered. Just going to Cottonmouth/River Dragon and the old Atlanta Knights games I saw the differences in talent level.

Here's one for old timer's: what in the world would the old IHL be considered now? It felt like it was on the AHL level when I went to Atlanta Knights games when they won the IHL cup but was it?

I have spoken with the Columbus River Dragons head coach and the team owner more than once. They feel our team is ECHL talent level but they really like the FPHL and don't plan on moving. Not even to the SPHL that the Cottonmouths used to be in. I don't think the CHL is still around that the Cottonmouths were in for a long time.

My first hockey memories date back to 1980 and my first hockey hero was Mike Bossy. I've seen a ton of NHL and minor league games over the years. I don't want to put the FPHL down as a league because that is insulting just to be insulting. The league itself on their own website calls itself high single A hockey. I don't know if I have seen a worse league than the FPHL in terms of actual talent that was a serious minor league and not the local amateur/semi pro leagues that anyone can join.

onto wytheville's blue ridge bobcats at the end of the month.

The bobcats are the other FPHL team I do like. I really like their jerseys and their guys play with heart.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

Yeah three day- 3 game home stretch coming up at the end of the month.

 

[JMCx4]

... I have spoken with the Columbus River Dragons head coach and the team owner more than once. They feel our team is ECHL talent level but they really like the FPHL and don't plan on moving. Not even to the SPHL that the Cottonmouths used to be in. I don't think the CHL is still around that the Cottonmouths were in for a long time.

... I don't want to put the FPHL down as a league because that is insulting just to be insulting. The league itself on their own website calls itself high single A hockey. I don't know if I have seen a worse league than the FPHL in terms of actual talent that was a serious minor league and not the local amateur/semi pro leagues that anyone can join. ...

I'm not surprised that the Dragons' coach & its owner expressed those feelings a/b their collection of player talent. Many such opinions of lower minor pro teams have been expressed by people in hockey organizational positions who are too close to the glass to see the whole game. Not to mention their need to hype their product for the benefit of building & sustaining fan and sponsor support.

As for the FPHL website declaring the League represents high single A hockey (a claim that I couldn't verify by a quick look at their mobile home page), that would be the marketing equivalent of the the ECHL's long-standing promotion that they are the "Premier 'AA' Hockey League" (as if there is another double-A equivalent to establish degrees of premier-ness). Presuming all of the A-rankings in minor pro hockey can be fairly applied from the former U.S. minor league baseball organizational structure, there is significant objective evidence in recruitment & advancement of players over the years that the SPHL has laid claim to any credible "high single A" designation.

And for the record, the Central Hockey League (CHL) incarnation that included a Columbus Cottonmouths team was absorbed by the ECHL in 2014 in the form of 7 expansion teams. So that's one League closed for debate ... especially since that CHL was the brief home of my fateful St. Charles Chill.

 

[sabremike]

Watching the FPHL is like watching the WWE. If you enjoy that type of hockey, that's fine. As for me, if I want to spend money watching a hockey game it won't be an FPHL game. I have plenty of other reasonably priced options (college, NAHL, ECHL, AHL) within reach. And I'll still comment on the relative lack of skill in the FPHL.

If the FPHL is WWE what does that make the league who signed a guy right after the FPHL banned him?

 

[JMCx4]

If the FPHL is WWE what does that make the league who signed a guy right after the FPHL banned him?

LNAH South Division?

 

[The Hobgoblin]

I'm not surprised that the Dragons' coach & its owner expressed those feelings a/b their collection of player talent. Many such opinions of lower minor pro teams have been expressed by people in hockey organizational positions who are too close to the glass to see the whole game. Not to mention their need to hype their product for the benefit of building & sustaining fan and sponsor support.

As for the FPHL website declaring the League represents high single A hockey (a claim that I couldn't verify by a quick look at their mobile home page), that would be the marketing equivalent of the the ECHL's long-standing promotion that they are the "Premier 'AA' Hockey League" (as if there is another double-A equivalent to establish degrees of premier-ness). Presuming all of the A-rankings in minor pro hockey can be fairly applied from the former U.S. minor league baseball organizational structure, there is significant objective evidence in recruitment & advancement of players over the years that the SPHL has laid claim to any credible "high single A" designation.

And for the record, the Central Hockey League (CHL) incarnation that included a Columbus Cottonmouths team was absorbed by the ECHL in 2014 in the form of 7 expansion teams. So that's one League closed for debate ... especially since that CHL was the brief home of my fateful St. Charles Chill.

From the FPHL website:

OFFICIAL SITE OF THE
FEDERAL PROSPECTS HOCKEY LEAGUE
SINGLE A MINOR PROFESSIONAL HOCKEY

When I looked at it some point last year it said "High single A" so it is interesting to me that they've dropped the "high" designation. I know the River Dragons team people always say "high single A" when discussing the league.

FWIW my understanding of watching minor league hockey since the 1980's is this to use baseball as a reference because frankly it is the only reference point we have with minor league hockey:

AAA = AHL
AA = ECHL
High A = SPHL
Low A = FPHL

That's just my humble and unbiased opinion. And I will note to back up my previous statement that the Columbus River Dragons just flat out beating the brains out of the entire FPHL shows they should be in another, higher league because their talent is good enough for it. I watched the old Cottonmouths in the ECHL and CHL and this team is at least as good as those teams and frankly I think they are better.

 

[JMCx4]

A season record so far of 25-3-2-2-1=83 pts. is certainly worth noting for the Dragons in the Continental Division, but so is the 23-5-6-0-1=77 pts. for Binghamton in the Empire Division. IMHAUO you should wait for the Columbus River Dragons to just flat out beat the brains out of the entire FPHL for several seasons running (including equal success in the post-season playoffs where they face ultimate championship competion from the other division) before you declare them worthy to be in another, higher league because their talent is good enough for it. Meanwhile, sit back & enjoy the hockey.

 

[NEPA Ice]

The original question is why anyone would "bash the FPHL". If you really enjoy watching Columbus along with their other fans- that's great. I'm sincerely glad you're able to have some fun.

But the skill levels at the FPHL level just aren't that good. If I would go up the road to an Elmira River Sharks game, I certainly wouldn't expect to see NHL, AHL, or ECHL skills. But I don't go because it's not worth the time or money.

Meanwhile, they draw a pathetic crowd and the loyal fans get upset that so few people attend because "the boys are playing their hearts out". I have no doubt they're indeed doing so, but it's not enough for me to want to pay money to see them when I can pay similar prices and see players demonstrating much better skills,

And in fact, I just recently went to a NAHL game in Johnstown and was really impressed by the skills and effort. They weren't just playing a game for the fans to watch. They were putting in so much effort, hoping that in doing so they could land a commitment to a Div 1 school. It was well worth the ticket price, and the fans had a lot of hockey savvy. Sure wish Elmira had invested in a franchise in this league rather than the FPHL!

 

[JMCx4]

... And in fact, I just recently went to a NAHL game in Johnstown and was really impressed by the skills and effort. They weren't just playing a game for the fans to watch. They were putting in so much effort, hoping that in doing so they could land a commitment to a Div 1 school. It was well worth the ticket price, and the fans had a lot of hockey savvy. Sure wish Elmira had invested in a franchise in this league rather than the FPHL!

Your wish could only come true IF the NAHL adopted FPHL business expansion practices. Get NAHL Commissioner Mark Frankenfeld to engage the Elmira municipal leaders and tell them how a junior hockey team will fill their arena and their government coffers from ticket sales & large crowds carrying oodles of disposable income several nights per week from September to April, and VIOLA! "Ladies & gentlemen, YOUR Elmira Eagles!" Team name pending negotiations with the Elmira College Athletics Dept. folks, of course.

 

[GindyDraws]

The original question is why anyone would "bash the FPHL". If you really enjoy watching Columbus along with their other fans- that's great. I'm sincerely glad you're able to have some fun.

But the skill levels at the FPHL level just aren't that good. If I would go up the road to an Elmira River Sharks game, I certainly wouldn't expect to see NHL, AHL, or ECHL skills. But I don't go because it's not worth the time or money.

Meanwhile, they draw a pathetic crowd and the loyal fans get upset that so few people attend because "the boys are playing their hearts out". I have no doubt they're indeed doing so, but it's not enough for me to want to pay money to see them when I can pay similar prices and see players demonstrating much better skills,

And in fact, I just recently went to a NAHL game in Johnstown and was really impressed by the skills and effort. They weren't just playing a game for the fans to watch. They were putting in so much effort, hoping that in doing so they could land a commitment to a Div 1 school. It was well worth the ticket price, and the fans had a lot of hockey savvy. Sure wish Elmira had invested in a franchise in this league rather than the FPHL!

I mean, yeah, you could support prospects who have a lot to gain, but ideally you must support the 30 somethings who peaked ages ago and refuse to let the dream die. That's the pro-FPHL argument.

And, it's a dead horse but probably the reality is that the ones who badmouth the FPHL aren't opposed to more hockey, but rather BAD hockey. If your idea of going to a game is seeing goons and high scoring, then yeah; it has it in spades. But most people aren't living and dying for a league with an obvious top and a lack of parity separating the rest.

 

[NEPA Ice]

Allow me to explain using an analogy...A friend of mine took me to a local greasy spoon joint, and it was pretty obvious the cook they had wasn't very good. I was sorry that I had spent money on the meal, and when my friend asked me what I thought, I said, "I won't be coming back- it wasn't very good." But he still goes there because he likes it. I have no issue with that, but he doesn't get after me because I don't support his taste, and even better, he doesn't expect me to say out loud that the food there is great and that it's definitely worth my money to eat there.

Similarly, if you happen to relish the FPHL, that's fine. Who am I to tell you you're a joke for doing so? I'm glad you like it. But the question was, "Why do people bash the FPHL?" and the answer is that a fair number of people think it's so low in skill level that it isn't worth the time and money to support it. AND if you ask us what we think of it, we'll be honest in our answer...it's some pretty bad stuff!

And if you want ME to support the local franchise, up the quality and I'll reconsider.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

Still going to wytheville in slapshot chiefs jersey.

 

[JMCx4]

Still going to wytheville in slapshot chiefs jersey.

Don't expect your attire to be unique among the game night(s) crowd. Save some beer money & buy yourself a Bobcats jersey.

 

[JMCx4]

Way-cool gesture by the BR Bobcats players & organization ...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02U92ExyHNEdRkxCKdvhyKcmdwr89LRyPFrQBpyrARzL5j9zEnQYDhvtQKoMoXrrbml&id=100090446613893

 

[The Hobgoblin]

If you obviously hate something I don't see why you would bother to bash it or clearly relish bashing fans of something with thinly veiled personal attacks about their tastes in "bad hockey". Or, excuse me, analogies stating the same. Sad.

 

[VaCaps Fan]

The good in hockey.

 

[The Hobgoblin]

Way-cool gesture by the BR Bobcats players & organization ...

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02U92ExyHNEdRkxCKdvhyKcmdwr89LRyPFrQBpyrARzL5j9zEnQYDhvtQKoMoXrrbml&id=100090446613893

View attachment 818944

Someone should tell this 90 year old hockey fan the team he supports is just 30 year old guys with nothing better to do and he supports bad hockey as a result. Shame on him for loving hockey! The outrage!

 

[JMCx4]

Someone should tell this 90 year old hockey fan the team he supports is just 30 year old guys with nothing better to do and he supports bad hockey as a result. Shame on him for loving hockey! The outrage!

It's all good, sweet Mr. Viars thought they were The Radio City Rockettes.

 

[The Hobgoblin]

It's all good, sweet Mr. Viars thought they were The Radio City Rockettes.

I wouldn't object to that!

 

[NEPA Ice]

I wish to sincerely apologize to all who may have been offended. After watching several FPHL games on YouTube I see that this provides an action packed, exciting entertainment option for many, with skills appropriate for lower level hockey. I promise to no longer answer any questions posed by those who frequent this thread.