2021-2022 AUS Thread
- Thread starter AUS Fan
- Start date
School which is suppose to cover tuition/compulsory fees. Players get reimbursed for books in most cases
AUS Fan
Registered User
So what you are saying is that the CHL gives a school $6000 as part of the package for a player.
This money is enough to cover tuition, books, etc for one school year.
The school gives the player a "scholarship" worth $6000, enough to cover tuition, books, etc for one school year.
The school then gives the player $6000 they received from the CHL.
This is an example, the dollar amounts are irrelevant. Is this what you say is happening?
This money is enough to cover tuition, books, etc for one school year.
The school gives the player a "scholarship" worth $6000, enough to cover tuition, books, etc for one school year.
The school then gives the player $6000 they received from the CHL.
This is an example, the dollar amounts are irrelevant. Is this what you say is happening?
AUS Fan
Registered User
I wish you had stated something like that at the outset instead of waltzing around the subject. You don't need to accuse anyone, but it would have saved a lot of time trying to figure out what you were saying.
If this happens, and I'm sure it does, it's not "fair", but no one seems to object. The CIS Must know what's going on, other schools Must know, but no one says or does anything.
Until it is deemed "illegal", schools can do what they want, I guess.
If this happens, and I'm sure it does, it's not "fair", but no one seems to object. The CIS Must know what's going on, other schools Must know, but no one says or does anything.
Until it is deemed "illegal", schools can do what they want, I guess.
“I wish you had stated something like that at the outset instead of waltzing around the subject. You don't need to accuse anyone, but it would have saved a lot of time trying to figure out what you were saying.”
Opening up someone eyes to self understand is better and accusing anyone well that story for another day but I see you got understanding of how league works but blinders do happen when you are “AUS Fan”
“Until it is deemed "illegal", schools can do what they want, I guess.”
All I’m going say is CAP or as people call it UNB rule -which is unfair to blame UNB - but cap rule will be gone as all school voted for it’s removal to extent
“If this happens, and I'm sure it does, it's not "fair", but no one seems to object. The CIS Must know what's going on, other schools Must know, but no one says or does anything.”
Teams/Conference have complained but it is what it is. Unless all conference step up we will see balance same. CIS/USports they know but see no/hear no/ wash hands
I am done talking about this
Enjoy off season cause it’s going be real silly one.
Opening up someone eyes to self understand is better and accusing anyone well that story for another day but I see you got understanding of how league works but blinders do happen when you are “AUS Fan”
“Until it is deemed "illegal", schools can do what they want, I guess.”
All I’m going say is CAP or as people call it UNB rule -which is unfair to blame UNB - but cap rule will be gone as all school voted for it’s removal to extent
“If this happens, and I'm sure it does, it's not "fair", but no one seems to object. The CIS Must know what's going on, other schools Must know, but no one says or does anything.”
Teams/Conference have complained but it is what it is. Unless all conference step up we will see balance same. CIS/USports they know but see no/hear no/ wash hands
I am done talking about this
Enjoy off season cause it’s going be real silly one.
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Rob
Registered User
Very happy they finally dropped the cap rule. It only took a pandemic for them to realize how stupid it was!
AUS Fan
Registered User
The Cap was put in place to prevent UNB from stocking the cupboard with top tier players so other teams couldn't get them. We'll see what happens over the next few seasons.
I don't think the pandemic had much to do with the change and perhaps to other teams it was not stupid. Everyone does not wear Red glasses.
Rob
Registered User
I never understood this argument. They were getting the best players they could. Not just so "other teams couldn't get them". If I remember there were complaints about Geordie Wudrick who was a high touted recruit but ended up being a healthy scratch for much of the season. The reason being he was a disappointment.
AUS Fan
Registered User
I understand your sentiment because you wear Red glasses. I recall a game at UdeM I happened to be at.
UNB had a couple of guys who would be top 6 on any other team, sitting up by the canteen charting faceoffs.
No, they weren't injured. One was Wudrick. He wasn't a "disappointment", he was a good player who didn't want to play the style asked of him.
No other team in the CIS could do that.
I'll leave it there because I don't want to get into a philosophical discussion.
Rob
Registered User
FreddyFoyle
Registered User
Okay, I don't pay attention for a couple of days and all sorts of debate breaks out!
Some facts. USports DOES NOT CARE about CHL education packages. They made the decision some time ago to exempt them from the Athletic Financial Awards (AFA's). There is no means or income test for AFA's - your other sources of income have no effect on whether an individual can receive an AFA.
I don't know about other conferences, but in at least one AUS school the CHL education package money is paid directly to the student athlete, not the school. I assumed that was the rule across the country, since USports DOES NOT CARE. If the OUA school is receiving the money from the CHL on behalf of the student towards their tuition, that's the OUA's business I guess. I can't believe they would ever hold back any of that money, would they?
Yes, some students get more than the minimum tuition and books guaranteed by the CHL, because the team decides to top up the education package. I guess some refer to that as the 'golden package'. I do know a while back there was an AUS hockey player who was getting around $15,000 per year from his CHL team for his education package, per their negotiated agreement. Is that against CHL rules? I don't know. But USports DOES NOT CARE. It is just treated as income like having a summer job. It does not affect that student-athlete's eligibility for an AFA.
So I don't see why there is any concern about CHL education packages. It is independent of any school policies (and don't forget, a former Junior player can collect the money even if he never plays hockey again, or decides to take up a trade instead of going to university).
However, the AFA 'pot' for men's hockey can vary by school/team, as it maxes out at 14 times (i.e. 70% of a championship roster) the cost of undergraduate tuition and fees at that school. Plus Academic All-Canadians don't count against the pot limit, but their individual award cannot exceed tuition and required fees. And of course, a conference like the OUA can choose to put their own limits on AFA's, but as long as they don't exceed the USports rules, that is their choice (and a stupid one in my opinion).
Some facts. USports DOES NOT CARE about CHL education packages. They made the decision some time ago to exempt them from the Athletic Financial Awards (AFA's). There is no means or income test for AFA's - your other sources of income have no effect on whether an individual can receive an AFA.
I don't know about other conferences, but in at least one AUS school the CHL education package money is paid directly to the student athlete, not the school. I assumed that was the rule across the country, since USports DOES NOT CARE. If the OUA school is receiving the money from the CHL on behalf of the student towards their tuition, that's the OUA's business I guess. I can't believe they would ever hold back any of that money, would they?
Yes, some students get more than the minimum tuition and books guaranteed by the CHL, because the team decides to top up the education package. I guess some refer to that as the 'golden package'. I do know a while back there was an AUS hockey player who was getting around $15,000 per year from his CHL team for his education package, per their negotiated agreement. Is that against CHL rules? I don't know. But USports DOES NOT CARE. It is just treated as income like having a summer job. It does not affect that student-athlete's eligibility for an AFA.
So I don't see why there is any concern about CHL education packages. It is independent of any school policies (and don't forget, a former Junior player can collect the money even if he never plays hockey again, or decides to take up a trade instead of going to university).
However, the AFA 'pot' for men's hockey can vary by school/team, as it maxes out at 14 times (i.e. 70% of a championship roster) the cost of undergraduate tuition and fees at that school. Plus Academic All-Canadians don't count against the pot limit, but their individual award cannot exceed tuition and required fees. And of course, a conference like the OUA can choose to put their own limits on AFA's, but as long as they don't exceed the USports rules, that is their choice (and a stupid one in my opinion).
AUS Fan
Registered User
That's pretty well where my heads at wrt CHL money.
Does it give some schools an advantage? Probably/Possibly, but other schools are allowed to offer AFA's as well.
Not quite the same, but I think back a few years when I was at UofA campus. Almost every building has some oil company name on it. That's money the school didn't have to spend so they could perhaps give more AFA's. I realize that capital spending is a separate pot, but you get my drift.
They also "owned" a couple of houses where the hockey players lived. I don't know the arrangement but am pretty certain the buildings were owned by the school. That could be considered an advantage.
We can go around the circle, wringing our hands about the unfairness of it all, but at the end of the day it appears to be a choice made by the schools. The CHL is not going to welch on their deal with the players and a school is not going to tell a stud recruit that they can't get an AFA because they have the package. The recruit would just go elsewhere.
I think I'm more than done with this topic. Thanks to all who contributed.
"(and a stupid one in my opinion)."
Edit: Never imply that someone is stupid.
Does it give some schools an advantage? Probably/Possibly, but other schools are allowed to offer AFA's as well.
Not quite the same, but I think back a few years when I was at UofA campus. Almost every building has some oil company name on it. That's money the school didn't have to spend so they could perhaps give more AFA's. I realize that capital spending is a separate pot, but you get my drift.
They also "owned" a couple of houses where the hockey players lived. I don't know the arrangement but am pretty certain the buildings were owned by the school. That could be considered an advantage.
We can go around the circle, wringing our hands about the unfairness of it all, but at the end of the day it appears to be a choice made by the schools. The CHL is not going to welch on their deal with the players and a school is not going to tell a stud recruit that they can't get an AFA because they have the package. The recruit would just go elsewhere.
I think I'm more than done with this topic. Thanks to all who contributed.
"(and a stupid one in my opinion)."
Edit: Never imply that someone is stupid.
FreddyFoyle
Registered User
I disagree. Insinuating that there is something untoward going on in the AUS when the Major Junior education packages have absolutely nothing to do with AFA's smacks more of trolling than debating.
FreddyFoyle
Registered User
But I will agree it is good for USports when someone other than UNB or Alberta wins the University Cup. Just like Carleton shouldn't win basketball every year.
Drummer
Better Red than Dead
I think Insider's point is - having two groups contribute to a student athlete's tuition to a value 2x Tuition defeats the purpose of offering an AFA as they already have tuition covered (by the CHL). That said - I don't believe the student athlete should be punished for this nor should they be bared from receiving other funds from the Awards Office.
The process is for the CHL & Athletics Department to transfer their funds to the student athlete's account after which the school reimburses the student the balance. As a result - the Finance Department is 'washing' the money and both groups are assured that the funds have been used to cover the student's tuition. The Awards department works the same way if the student athlete was fortunate enough to receive an award that had a financial value.
Every USPORTS institution can offer AFA's - some max-out, other's don't. It's their call, but it's unfair to be critical of the AUS if they have chosen to take full advantage of the program. Could it be tweaked - maybe.
There are other costs to attend school (8 months of rent, utilities, food and travel). Even if there is balance of tuition returned to the athlete - it's just going to cover these expenses and if they have a nest egg when their done - bonus.
The process is for the CHL & Athletics Department to transfer their funds to the student athlete's account after which the school reimburses the student the balance. As a result - the Finance Department is 'washing' the money and both groups are assured that the funds have been used to cover the student's tuition. The Awards department works the same way if the student athlete was fortunate enough to receive an award that had a financial value.
Every USPORTS institution can offer AFA's - some max-out, other's don't. It's their call, but it's unfair to be critical of the AUS if they have chosen to take full advantage of the program. Could it be tweaked - maybe.
There are other costs to attend school (8 months of rent, utilities, food and travel). Even if there is balance of tuition returned to the athlete - it's just going to cover these expenses and if they have a nest egg when their done - bonus.
FreddyFoyle
Registered User
Except that in at least one AUS school the CHL education program money does NOT flow through the Awards office or Finance. Maybe it did at one time, but not anymore. The cheque goes directly to the student-athlete; it is not touched or 'white washed' by the university.
AUS Fan
Registered User
"The cheque goes directly to the student-athlete; it is not touched or 'white washed' by the university."
The term you're looking for is "Laundered".
The term you're looking for is "Laundered".
Drummer
Better Red than Dead
Sure - if the School wants to place the onus on the student to be responsible (which it does for all other students) - fine. They may not want to be part of the 'washing'.
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