2017-2018 Minnesota Wild General Discussion III

[Digitalbooya]

The Wild had at least 4 great chances to end the game in OT. So that argument can go both ways.

 

[The Enemy Within]

Well definitely should be a good show tonight against one of the class in the division.

I really hope this goes well for us. I need something to cheer me up on this Saturday night.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Whoops.

 

[Nharris31]

I have tried to be positive with this team but it is making me mad. Especially the descions they have made lately.
Foligno on the powerplay instead of letting Kunin get more than one chance there.
Not giving Eriksson-Ek and Kunin a chance at all to play with Coyle instead of playing with Winnik. Intsaed send them down without giving them a chance at all to play without an offensive player.I mean Eriksson-Ek has had virtually no help (imagine how much better he could have been if he had Coyle and Parise on his wings. Instead of Foligno,Stewart and Winnik) I can understand sending them done if they have tried all of these options and they didn’t work but the problem is they didn’t try it at all.
Playing Quincey at all
No Nino in overtime at all?
It makes mad because these are decisions that could be made easily but no.

 

[57special]

I think that they want Ek and Kunin to develop offensively in the AHL getting top line minutes. Hopefully they are both top sixers in the future, but Kunin was fumbling away prime scoring chances in front of the net, and Ek can't win a FO to save his life.

I share your frustrations with the new acquisitions. The Buffalo trade looks to be awful, and the bet that Dumba is more valuable than Tuch and Haula not so good either. Dumba still has a chance to become something good. I hold little hope for Ennis and Foligno.

The Quincey/ Folin thing baffles me. It's not like Folin was great, but he was a RHD. Quincey gets 1.25M?

 

[Nharris31]

I think that they want Ek and Kunin to develop offensively in the AHL getting top line minutes. Hopefully they are both top sixers in the future, but Kunin was fumbling away prime scoring chances in front of the net, and Ek can't win a FO to save his life.

I share your frustrations with the new acquisitions. The Buffalo trade looks to be awful, and the bet that Dumba is more valuable than Tuch and Haula not so good either. Dumba still has a chance to become something good. I hold little hope for Ennis and Foligno.

The Quincey/ Folin thing baffles me. It's not like Folin was great, but he was a RHD. Quincey gets 1.25M?

At least Kunin actually got scoring chances. They can develop in the NHL just but them with offensive players. You can’t really think the linemates Coyle has played with are better linemates than what Kunin and Eriksson-Ek can provide.

 

[57special]

Yeah, I want them back up, but a few games playing first line down in the AHL won't hurt, and might help them.

 

[Nharris31]

Kunin and Eriksson-Ek where pretty good defensively when they where up here just saying. They also shot the puck. Occasionally.

 

[Wild11MN]

This team badly needs another competent defenseman. And I have no idea where it's going to get one.

 

[Bazeek]

This team badly needs another competent defenseman. And I have no idea where it's going to get one.

I'd still bet we grab Prosser once he inevitably hits waivers. That doesn't really meet the "competent defenseman" threshold, but I still think it happens.

 

[57special]

You know you're in trouble when adding Nate Prosser to your roster is a good thing. He doesn't play in STL, and is only there to wash Yeo's car.

 

[nickschultzfan]

I think that they want Ek and Kunin to develop offensively in the AHL getting top line minutes. Hopefully they are both top sixers in the future, but Kunin was fumbling away prime scoring chances in front of the net, and Ek can't win a FO to save his life.

I share your frustrations with the new acquisitions. The Buffalo trade looks to be awful, and the bet that Dumba is more valuable than Tuch and Haula not so good either. Dumba still has a chance to become something good. I hold little hope for Ennis and Foligno.

The Quincey/ Folin thing baffles me. It's not like Folin was great, but he was a RHD. Quincey gets 1.25M?

The numbers are actual worse than you think. The Wild actual RAISED their cap hit by all the moves to save Dumba instead of doing nothing but housekeeping.

Scandella/Pominville/Depth Forward (i.e. Winnik/Mitchell) -> Olofsson/Ennis/Foligno = ~2.06 mil cap saved with moves

Dumba (2.55) -> Sent to Vegas, replaced by Reilly/Olofsson (0.725) = ~1.85 mil cap saved
Folin (~9.25) -> re-signed over Quincey (1.25) = ~ 0.2 mil cap saved
Prosser (0.65) -> re-signed over Reilly/Olofsson making squad = 0.075 mil cap saved
Total = ~2.125 mil cap saved if status quo maintained

In other words, the saving Dumba cost the team its entire blueline depth, Tuch, Pominville, Haula's trade value, and about $100k in cap space.

 

[Wild11MN]

The asset of Dumba was too much to give up for nothing. A young, offensive RHD that has shown spurts of fantastic play.

I understand that that statement seems foolish with his play so far this year, but if Dumba ended up taking a big step forward, Fletcher would be crucified for allowing him to walk for nothing.

 

[Nharris31]

The asset of Dumba was too much to give up for nothing. A young, offensive RHD that has shown spurts of fantastic play.

I understand that that statement seems foolish with his play so far this year, but if Dumba ended up taking a big step forward, Fletcher would be crucified for allowing him to walk for nothing.

Dumba is struggling no doubt. But part of is he is taking heat for Fletcher making a bad trade with Buffalo they’re had to be other ways to make cap room.

 

[razor8]

Hi, long time lurker, first time poster.

I've been following the Wild since 2009. The way I see it is that the main problem why the Wild have been a mediocre team for so long is that the team lacks a game breaker type. Koivu, Staal, Granlund, Zucker, Niederraiter are good players, but not really the types that will carry you to the finals.

I mean come on, if Zucker is your best goal scorer with 13 and Stewart is fourth with 7 goals, then you're in real trouble. Without Zucker going beast mode three games in a row, this team would already be f***ed. Unfortunately I don't see them making the playoffs this year. I also don't see Granlund repeating last seasons great performance. What happened?

 

[Wild11MN]

Hi, long time lurker, first time poster.

Welcome to the boards!

 

[razor8]

Welcome to the boards!

Thank you very much! I'm from Finland by the way, so if I write something that doesn't make any sense in English, that's why!

 

[Nharris31]

The NHL were getting punched in the back of the head is not penalty on most nights. But Squirting the water bottle is frowned upon.

 

[nickschultzfan]

The asset of Dumba was too much to give up for nothing. A young, offensive RHD that has shown spurts of fantastic play.

I understand that that statement seems foolish with his play so far this year, but if Dumba ended up taking a big step forward, Fletcher would be crucified for allowing him to walk for nothing.

I don't understand your argument at all because Vegas was taking somebody from the Wild regardless.

That's like your ex-wife being awarded your apartment or your car in the divorce, and you tell her to take the apartment, which is worth more, because the car "was too much to give up for nothing."

 

[tomgilbertfan]

This article is fairly relevant

Down Goes Brown: The 20 stages of realizing your NHL team is terrible


Just the stages:

Stage 1: Opening-night optimism
Stage 2: The first signs of a problem
Stage 3: Constantly repeating that it’s still early
Stage 4: Mild annoyance at everyone who’s being negative
Stage 5: The team reels off a few wins in a row
Stage 6: The sudden interest in analytics
Stage 7: The point of no return
Stage 8: Blaming the injuries
Stage 9: Blaming the media
Stage 10: Blaming yourself
Stage 11: Mild annoyance at everyone who’s being positive
Stage 12: Slowly talking yourself into the comeback
Stage 13: The soul-crushing loss
Stage 14: Fire everyone
Stage 15: Getting a little too invested in the top pick of next year’s draft
Stage 16: Remembering that the draft lottery exists
Step 17: The moral dilemma
Stage 18: Actively cheering against your own team
Stage 19: The meaningless win streak just to spite you
Stage 20: The ray of hope

 

[Wild11MN]

I don't understand your argument at all because Vegas was taking somebody from the Wild regardless.

That's like your ex-wife being awarded your apartment or your car in the divorce, and you tell her to take the apartment, which is worth more, because the car "was too much to give up for nothing."

Why would you give up a more valuable asset when you could give up a lesser one?

It's not a clear-cut answer to say that either side is correct. Cap space was unknown at the time because Nino and Granlund hadn't signed yet. You never know who Vegas wanted or what trades were discussed.

 

[nickschultzfan]

Why would you give up a more valuable asset when you could give up a lesser one?

It's not a clear-cut answer to say that either side is correct. Cap space was unknown at the time because Nino and Granlund hadn't signed yet. You never know who Vegas wanted or what trades were discussed.

We actually do know with 100% certainty that Vegas was going to take only one of Dumba, Scandella, Zucker, or Staal. A loss in one regard is a gain in another - where that extra cap space could be used to re-sign Granlund and Nino. That has been clear for a year.

But for some reason Fletcher couldn't just accept that as a fact of life. He twisted and turned to avoid shedding cap in the expansion draft, which just meant that was a problem he was then going to have to solve immediately after. And every team in the league knew it. Which is why we got 7.5 million in 4th liners for Scandella and Pominville.

 

[57special]

Losing Parise, Pominville, and Haula and replacing them with Ennis, Foligno, and Winnik turned out bad? Who could have predicted that?

Replacing Scandella with Quincey is a down grade? DUH! Scandella has been BUF's #1 Dman this year.

The scary thing is that Zucker and Nino are playing great, Staal, Granlund and Coyle are well above average, and Koivu is still vg. We can't reasonably expect them to get much better as a group.

The only cavalry coming over the hill are(possibly);

- a healthy Parise

- a developing Ek and Kunin

I think Reilly is doomed to be a LH Dumba clone with lesser tools. Hope I'm wrong. Olofsson...I think he is going to be OK, in the long run.

 

[Bazeek]

We actually do know with 100% certainty that Vegas was going to take only one of Dumba, Scandella, Zucker, or Staal. A loss in one regard is a gain in another - where that extra cap space could be used to re-sign Granlund and Nino. That has been clear for a year.

But for some reason Fletcher couldn't just accept that as a fact of life. He twisted and turned to avoid shedding cap in the expansion draft, which just meant that was a problem he was then going to have to solve immediately after. And every team in the league knew it. Which is why we got 7.5 million in 4th liners for Scandella and Pominville.

I find it hard to swallow the idea that there was an obvious solution to this offseason staring Fletcher in the face in May and he did his absolute best to avoid it. Maybe that's just cluelessness on my part.

Part of the problem was that the two players most likely to be selected were Dumba and Zucker, who were also on the cheapest contracts. If either had been taken, we'd still have needed to shed cap to sign the Granlund and Nino extensions. If they had taken Dumba, trading off Scandella is harder because that leaves you with 3 top-4 defensemen. If Vegas had taken Zucker it may have been easier to trade Scandella for cap space, but you lose one of your best bang-for-buck forwards when the next season is going to be tight as it is. If Vegas takes Staal we're really boned because we're back to 1 top-6 center in an aging Koivu. If they had taken Scandella it seems like it would have worked out okay, but the chances of him being taken seem low.

There are "maybes" for every one of these scenarios. If we lose Dumba and trade Scandella, maybe we rely on a re-signed Folin to pair with Brodin on the second pairing? If we lose Zucker, maybe we just bring up Tuch? If we lose Staal, maybe we're the ones trading for Brayden Schenn? But the answers to those questions are a lot clearer in November than they were in May. Even now there's a lot of "there must have been better options out there" speculation with little to support it other than unmet expectations. Every option that we know about carried its share of risk. The one Fletcher took has panned out poorly, but the others only look better with the benefit of hindsight. At least to me. And they all still hinge on "maybes."

 

[gphr513]

This article is fairly relevant

Down Goes Brown: The 20 stages of realizing your NHL team is terrible


Just the stages:

I lol'd at this one:

Stage 5: The team reels off a few wins in a row
See? They just won three straight. They have points in five of their last eight. You knew it was too early to worry about any of this stuff.
Just a few days ago, everyone was freaking out about how they were falling out of the playoff race. But then they’ve been playing better ever since, and now if you check the standings they’ve gained… uh… one point.
Wait, that can’t be right. How can you win games and barely gain any ground? Stupid loser point. At this rate, your team isn’t getting back into the playoff race until… oh. Oh no.
Maybe it wasn’t too early after all.