Speculation: 2016-17 ★ Trade Proposals and Speculation ★

[Dallasman]

Why would he sign for that here? Players take less because they like their situation or because they want to win. None of us can speak to the former but there are better bets for the Cup than Dallas if he's going to be that cheap.

And you don't know what Patrick Sharp is thinking so you're speculating too.

If it's true that he doesn't want to keep moving his family around, maybe he does sign something like that here after he has whatever surgery he's to have this offseason. He may realize that he won't make a lot out on the FA market because of his age and potentially his surgery keeping him out for a bit.

I won't be sad if he leaves but I won't be overly upset if he signs a friendly deal to stay in Dallas too. A 2 year/$4mill contract wouldn't hurt at all. I'd rather have him over Hemsky.

 

[Mr Misty]

And you don't know what Patrick Sharp is thinking so you're speculating too.

If it's true that he doesn't want to keep moving his family around, maybe he does sign something like that here after he has whatever surgery he's to have this offseason. He may realize that he won't make a lot out on the FA market because of his age and potentially his surgery keeping him out for a bit.

I won't be sad if he leaves but I won't be overly upset if he signs a friendly deal to stay in Dallas too. A 2 year/$4mill contract wouldn't hurt at all. I'd rather have him over Hemsky.

It's not speculation to say there are going to be bigger offers for a player with his resume than 1x1 nor is it speculation to say that Chicago, Pittsburgh, and Washington would be more stable places to go for that price if he wants to win. And it certainly isn't speculation to say this team is a mess that's about to get a top 10 pick and a new coach.

If we can't come up with a solid reason why he might take less to be here, it is reasonable to expect that he won't.

 

[Dallasman]

It's not speculation to say there are going to be bigger offers for a player with his resume than 1x1 nor is it speculation to say that Chicago, Pittsburgh, and Washington would be more stable places to go for that price if he wants to win. And it certainly isn't speculation to say this team is a mess that's about to get a top 10 pick and a new coach.

If we can't come up with a solid reason why he might take less to be here, it is reasonable to expect that he won't.

Actually, it is considering you have no idea what Sharp is thinking. Neither do I but you ARE speculating on what he may or may not do or what may or may not happen.

I know what you're saying and all that but it's too early to tell how it'll play out this offseason.

 

[Troy McClure]

It's not speculation to say there are going to be bigger offers for a player with his resume than 1x1 nor is it speculation to say that Chicago, Pittsburgh, and Washington would be more stable places to go for that price if he wants to win. And it certainly isn't speculation to say this team is a mess that's about to get a top 10 pick and a new coach.

If we can't come up with a solid reason why he might take less to be here, it is reasonable to expect that he won't.

I completely agree that someone is going to overpay for Sharp because of his resume. Given the cap room and holes in the roster, I wouldn't be surprised if Nill was the one to do it.

My guess is no team will get anything close to satisfactory bang for the buck from him, but that's the nature of free agency, especially these days where so little desirable talent makes it to UFA.

 

[Mr Misty]

I come back to Whitney season 2 which was Nill season 1. I don't think Sharp is on that track for 18-19, but it should be something they consider.

 

[Mr Misty]

Actually, it is considering you have no idea what Sharp is thinking. Neither do I but you ARE speculating on what he may or may not do or what may or may not happen.

I know what you're saying and all that but it's too early to tell how it'll play out this offseason.

You are arguing that because we do not know the answer, all possibilities are equally valid. It should be obvious that this is nonsense.

I can't imagine what your purpose is, but we absolutely can come up with reasons why he would favor some teams over others, and Dallas doesn't appear to have a strong position. Not sure why this is controversial.

 

[Dallasman]

You are arguing that because we do not know the answer, all possibilities are equally valid. It should be obvious that this is nonsense.

I can't imagine what your purpose is, but we absolutely can come up with reasons why he would favor some teams over others, and Dallas doesn't appear to have a strong position. Not sure why this is controversial.

Not arguing, trying to have a conversation with you about the possibilities that exist for him.

 

[Mr Misty]

Not arguing, trying to have a conversation with you about the possibilities that exist for him.

Well you are doing a horrible job of "not arguing" in this post, and just as bad a job of talking about "possibilities."

If you are convinced there won't be a market for Sharp, I suggest you explain why you think that so we can weigh the evidence pro and con. I will point out 2 reasons why I disagree:
1. Wages are sticky. Eaves signed for 1.15m following a 27 in 47 season which is a 47 point pace. The following year he went 17 in 54 for a 26 point pace and signed for 1m. Players don't just go from making almost 6m to 1m.
2. 75m in cap space and 13-14 new forward jobs are being created by Vegas. More money to spend on lower quality players should cause us to revise our wage estimates upward.

 

[Dallasman]

Well you are doing a horrible job of "not arguing" in this post, and just as bad a job of talking about "possibilities."

If you are convinced there won't be a market for Sharp, I suggest you explain why you think that so we can weigh the evidence pro and con. I will point out 2 reasons why I disagree:
1. Wages are sticky. Eaves signed for 1.15m following a 27 in 47 season which is a 47 point pace. The following year he went 17 in 54 for a 26 point pace and signed for 1m. Players don't just go from making almost 6m to 1m.
2. 75m in cap space and 13-14 new forward jobs are being created by Vegas. More money to spend on lower quality players should cause us to revise our wage estimates upward.

Older vet who will be coming off of some kind of surgery this offseason. Not sure what yet but if it's, say, hip surgery, that could diminish his value as those take 3-4 months to recover from, depending on when he has surgery. That's speculative on my part because we don't know what he's injured with at this time.

He MAY NOT want to move his family again, which I have stated before and which you failed to see because you're focused on what you think is right, therefore I'm wrong in your eyes.

Those are two reasons why I see a veteran like Sharp staying where he is and not signing for a big contract.

 

[Mr Misty]

Older vet who will be coming off of some kind of surgery this offseason. Not sure what yet but if it's, say, hip surgery, that could diminish his value as those take 3-4 months to recover from, depending on when he has surgery. That's speculative on my part because we don't know what he's injured with at this time.

He MAY NOT want to move his family again, which I have stated before and which you failed to see because you're focused on what you think is right, therefore I'm wrong in your eyes.

Those are two reasons why I see a veteran like Sharp staying where he is and not signing for a big contract.

A season ending injury as of the deadline could take 2 months to recover or 4 months or 6. None of those would mean missing NHL games next year. If we look at the set of all injuries, there are many more 6 week- 6 month recovery injuries than 6 month pluses, and most of those long recovery ones are not play through-able.

"He may like Dallas" is not a way to build a team. There's nothing to be gained by bringing it up specifically because we have tons of evidence that athletes are motivated by money and winning. The only thing I "failed to see" is the usefulness in responding to a position that can be neither right nor wrong.

Imagine it is 6 months in the future. We will absolutely know things about Sharp's value then because he will either have a contract or not. We will absolutely not know anything about how much he doesn't want to move his family. It is unclear why you insist on making the effort to argue while simultaneously being so focused on something we don't know, we can't know, and we won't know.

 

[Dallasman]

A season ending injury as of the deadline could take 2 months to recover or 4 months or 6. None of those would mean missing NHL games next year. If we look at the set of all injuries, there are many more 6 week- 6 month recovery injuries than 6 month pluses, and most of those long recovery ones are not play through-able.

"He may like Dallas" is not a way to build a team. There's nothing to be gained by bringing it up specifically because we have tons of evidence that athletes are motivated by money and winning. The only thing I "failed to see" is the usefulness in responding to a position that can be neither right nor wrong.

Imagine it is 6 months in the future. We will absolutely know things about Sharp's value then because he will either have a contract or not. We will absolutely not know anything about how much he doesn't want to move his family. It is unclear why you insist on making the effort to argue while simultaneously being so focused on something we don't know, we can't know, and we won't know.

And YOU truly don't know what his motivations are either. You are speculating like I am. So basically we're going back and forth on speculation to be honest with you.

 

[Magic Mittens]

I can definitely see Nill offering Sharp a contract and then letting him see what's out there first. We're weak on the Wings next season and still have a couple unknowns with Nuke and Janmark. I'd say there's a good chance either Sharp or Hemsky back next year

 

[Mr Misty]

And YOU truly don't know what his motivations are either. You are speculating like I am. So basically we're going back and forth on speculation to be honest with you.

As I said before, you are making the argument that you personally don't know so all arguments are equally valid. Again, you are responding to me, shouting even, that you don't know so all of this is pointless. All your shouting, all of your responses, all pointless. Nobody can know anything, shouting and shouting. I wouldn't spend so much effort telling people my ideas were pointless, it seems like a dreadful waste of time, but each of us has their own unique way.

If you truly believe that nobody knows anything and all are equally correct, you have a major problem with your stationary family hypothesis. If all outcomes have the same chance, then he will choose to play elsewhere (30/31)= 97% of the time. Choosing not to move his family will be tied for the least likely choice he can make, and it is far more likely he will choose to play for a team because they have red sweaters than it is he will choose to stay in Dallas. In fact he probably wants to move his family about 30x more than he wants to stay in Dallas.

 

[Dallasman]

As I said before, you are making the argument that you personally don't know so all arguments are equally valid. Again, you are responding to me, shouting even, that you don't know so all of this is pointless. All your shouting, all of your responses, all pointless. Nobody can know anything, shouting and shouting. I wouldn't spend so much effort telling people my ideas were pointless, it seems like a dreadful waste of time, but each of us has their own unique way.

If you truly believe that nobody knows anything and all are equally correct, you have a major problem with your stationary family hypothesis. If all outcomes have the same chance, then he will choose to play elsewhere (30/31)= 97% of the time. Choosing not to move his family will be tied for the least likely choice he can make, and it is far more likely he will choose to play for a team because they have red sweaters than it is he will choose to stay in Dallas. In fact he probably wants to move his family about 30x more than he wants to stay in Dallas.

You're right, I'm wrong. Is that what you want me to say? You know the title of this thread is SPECULATION, right? Hence, I am speculating, just like you.

Get off your high horse man. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't make my SPECULATION any more right or wrong then yours.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Dallas Man,

If it makes you feel any better, Misty trolled me the last time I posted on Sharp. No need for endless back and forth with that kind of guy......just try to ignore it and focus on other posters.....and speculation.

 

[Mr Misty]

You're right, I'm wrong. Is that what you want me to say? You know the title of this thread is SPECULATION, right? Hence, I am speculating, just like you.

Get off your high horse man. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't make my SPECULATION any more right or wrong then yours.

I'm really not sure where you are coming from here. I didn't start this, you did. And philosophically you are wrong. Your main point seems to be that all opinions are equally valid, which is ludicrous. I have already presented evidence that we can use to predict Sharp's future behavior. The lure of money or glory is greater than the lure of a color scheme or the desire to live near a Tim Hortons. But you want these factors to be given equal weight because we don't know for sure. Bananas.

You have very excitedly pointed out that he may not want to move his family several times now. The obvious response to this would be, what if he really wants to move his family? What does this exchange accomplish? Nothing. We can learn nothing from it and nobody gains anything, it is a total waste of time. I hope this is clear to you now.

Meanwhile, we will soon have hard information about where he signs and for how much. These are interesting factors to me because they can be measured, unlike the family stuff which I ignored. You seem to take this personally, but I don't care about that reason because it can't be measured and proved or disproved. It is impossible to disagree with something like that by definition. Meanwhile, we can make a case for this team or that team based on cap space, roster, and competitiveness. If you really think that logic has no place here I don't understand why you invest your time and effort starting this thing in the first place.

 

[Satan]

tldr

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Spezza (at $4.875 million with retained salary, same as Vatanen).
Honka


Nick Ritchie
Vatanen

-Expansion draft. Ducks can't protect all their defenseman, while they have an extra forward slot.
-Duck fans seem pretty united in thinking Vatanen will be traded (or at least they'll look at moving him).
-Ducks likely want a winger, Spezza is capable in that role.

 

[Mr Misty]

Spezza (at $4.875 million with retained salary, same as Vatanen).
Honka


Nick Ritchie
Vatanen

-Expansion draft. Ducks can't protect all their defenseman, while they have an extra forward slot.
-Duck fans seem pretty united in thinking Vatanen will be traded (or at least they'll look at moving him).
-Ducks likely want a winger, Spezza is capable in that role.

If they want a winger, why are they trading Ritchie?

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

If they want a winger, why are they trading Ritchie?

Spezza is better

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Look at Abilify logo....obvious he wants a brother pair back on the Stars.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

I miss you Jordie

 

[Mr Misty]

Spezza is better

Why not just stop then at Spezza for Vatanen? They've got prospects on defense already.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Why not just stop then at Spezza for Vatanen? They've got prospects on defense already.

Okay, I'll stop and just offer Spezza for Vatanen.

----

Unrelated note, now I need to come up with an idea to trade Honka for a similarly aged player at a different position in the hypothetical event that we trade Spezza for Vatanen.

Anybody got any ideas? Somebody like Nick Ritchie perhaps, certainly doesn't have to be him though.

 

[Mr Misty]

Okay, I'll stop and just offer Spezza for Vatanen.

----

Unrelated note, now I need to come up with an idea to trade Honka for a similarly aged player at a different position in the hypothetical event that we trade Spezza for Vatanen.

Anybody got any ideas? Somebody like Nick Ritchie perhaps, certainly doesn't have to be him though.

Why trade Honka at all? I don't think one Sami Vatanen fixes this defense.