2014 NHL Re-Draft

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Aladyyn

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They're all extremely close and I'd kill to have any of the three but Reinhart's most common linemates were O'Reilly and Kane. Those are both fantastic guys to have on your line. Larkin's were Zetterberg and Abdelkader. Nylander's were Hyman and Parenteau. Scoring .6p ppg with those guys is incredible. Combine that with him being a top 5 AHL player at 19, I believe his offensive upside is higher than the others. Again, I'd love to have any of them on NJ.



Ya, I like Bennett a lot too and think he can easily move up. I have to look at their usage but he could easily have been in Larkin and Reinhart territory (scoring wise) if he did get difficult assignments.

Every player on the Sabres benefits from playing with Reinhart more than the other way around. Nylander also got a lot easier deployments whereas Reinhart faced hard competition when playing with ROR. Going by points put up in 22 games (very inconsistently btw) shouldn't make him jump over Reinhart and Draisaitl. Those are 2 forwards that I think every list should have above Nylander atm.
 

BB88

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Jan 19, 2015
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Pastrnak has been impressive, but I think it's relevant that he's played consistently with Krejci (and usually Eriksson), so he's had a good opportunity to put up some good numbers this year.

When Ehlers went from the 3rd line with defensive players to the 1st line his scoring sky-rocketed. For young players, opportunity has a lot to due with scoring success.

Pasta was also playing against top opposition lines, with bottom5 defense, he was benched for every mistake he made and wasn't used in 4-4/OT/pp situations really, something we didn't like with Julien.
That's not getting the max out of Pasta and your lineup.

Krejci is also going to get surgery for his hip, he played most of the 2nd half injured and at the start of 2016 missed weeks due to shoulder injury. He was pretty bad on the 2nd half.

Broke something blocking a shot?

That'll get you called soft by some fanbases.

Yep, blocking a one timer means x player being soft, it is amazing isn't it.
By the way he played 2 games after that.

Would it help, if I removed that one sentence?

I dont think he should be higher than 8-9 personally.

And as I said, I cant take a broken leg into consideration, when my list is based of how I think they have performed, and not their potential.

If it was off potential, my list would look different.

To rehash, I think Pasta looked better last season, and I think other players have looked better. Not taking his broken limb into consideration, and I do agree that, that is not fair. Youll get me to admit as much :) But, this list is not about fair. At least not mine.

I just wanted to challenge you on that view, you don't have to change that :laugh:
 

QuietContrarian

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May 28, 2008
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I just wanted to challenge you on that view, you don't have to change that :laugh:

It was a rhetorical question :)

I try not to edit posts too much just to look better. I wrote what I wrote.

Hope my answers make a little more sense now then.

btw, I dont find Pasta soft at all.
 

QuietContrarian

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Reinhart>Draisaitl

fight me

I agree Reinhart is getting severly underrated by sooooo many posters..:help:

Id take him over any player not named Ekblad, he is a guy you want on a winners team! He is a leader and has so many assets to his game.
 

TheLeastOfTheBunch

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Yea but if that's the case Bennett should be quite a bit higher than 8. Also as was mentioned, most of these guys had a similar stretch, it means squat.

Same could be said for a number of those guys though..

Of course, so why the need for an explanation if the potential is there? Just as how McCann is rated a bit behind guys who aren't even in the NHL yet. It's all a guessing game right now.
 

Aladyyn

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Apr 6, 2015
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I agree Reinhart is getting severly underrated by sooooo many posters..:help:

Id take him over any player not named Ekblad, he is a guy you want on a winners team! He is a leader and has so many assets to his game.

He didn't have the buzz creating hot streak at the beginning of the season like Larkin and Draisaitl did in the first half of the season and he plays for the Sabres, which most people outside of the fanbase don't care much about, so it's kinda understandable. He's been exactly as advertised, incredibly smart and makes everyone around him better. Some people might be surprised when he "breaks out" next year :).
 

Atomos2

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Reinhart is the only guy I clearly take over Nylander. I guess Ekblad's ahead of him too, but I'm not buying the hype he's getting so I'll take a rain check on that analysis. Ekblad has had one great season, followed by one good season playing against other teams 3rd lines.

Reinhart

Ekblad
Nylander
the rest
 

Aladyyn

they praying for the death of a rockstar
Apr 6, 2015
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Of course, so why the need for an explanation if the potential is there? Just as how McCann is rated a bit behind guys who aren't even in the NHL yet. It's all a guessing game right now.

Because Reinhart and Draisaitl have as much potential as him AND have been better in the NHL.
 

QuietContrarian

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May 28, 2008
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Reinhart is the only guy I clearly take over Nylander. I guess Ekblad's ahead of him too, but I'm not buying the hype he's getting so I'll take a rain check on that analysis. Ekblad has had one great season, followed by one good season playing against other teams 3rd lines.

Reinhart

Ekblad
Nylander
the rest

I think we are beyond "hype" at this point though...
 

TheLeastOfTheBunch

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Because Reinhart and Draisaitl have as much potential as him AND have been better in the NHL.

You're assuming that poster doesn't think Nylander has a higher potential than those two. This isn't a hard concept, it's very much predictions with these lists, just as it is with your list as well. Enough time hasn't passed to be concrete about anyone, especially guys who haven't had a good sample of games yet at the NHL level.
 

Pyromaniac

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May 29, 2012
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Because Reinhart and Draisaitl have as much potential as him AND have been better in the NHL.

This is purely subjective. I have Reinhart lower than Ehlers, Nylander, Bennett and Draisatl (in no particular order). I don't believe that he has as high a ceiling as the others. Ehlers is #2 on my list.
 

Brewins

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Apr 23, 2015
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Would it help, if I removed that one sentence?

I dont think he should be higher than 8-9 personally.

And as I said, I cant take a broken leg into consideration, when my list is based of how I think they have performed, and not their potential.

If it was off potential, my list would look different.

To rehash, I think Pasta looked better last season, and I think other players have looked better. Not taking his broken limb into consideration, and I do agree that, that is not fair. Youll get me to admit as much :) But, this list is not about fair. At least not mine.

This year I can agree, he didn't seem as flashy and electric sometimes, but made things happen everywhere.
 

MPStoEberletoHall*

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Reinhart is the only guy I clearly take over Nylander. I guess Ekblad's ahead of him too, but I'm not buying the hype he's getting so I'll take a rain check on that analysis. Ekblad has had one great season, followed by one good season playing against other teams 3rd lines.

Reinhart

Ekblad
Nylander
the rest

Hahahahahaha what is this s***
 

QuietContrarian

Registered User
May 28, 2008
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This year I can agree, he didn't seem as flashy and electric sometimes, but made things happen everywhere.

And thats all I meant.

He probably did, but as I said, subjectiveness is bound, since I have watched some players more than others. Pasta being one of the players I watched the least.

I have no problem admitting that my list is up for discussion :)

Hahahahahaha what is this s***

Take no notice buddy.

Obvious bias is obvious :D
 

WetcoastOrca

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Jun 3, 2011
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Reinhart is the only guy I clearly take over Nylander. I guess Ekblad's ahead of him too, but I'm not buying the hype he's getting so I'll take a rain check on that analysis. Ekblad has had one great season, followed by one good season playing against other teams 3rd lines.

Reinhart

Ekblad
Nylander
the rest

:laugh:
Holy cow! Post of the day.
 

Paxon

202* Stanley Cup Champions
Jul 13, 2003
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Rochester, NY
That's a matter of personal opinion.

It should and does go without saying that any expressed judgment of players' potential is a matter of opinion or is, at least, quite impossible to discern as objective fact. If you disagree with his opinion, say so (and why).
 

BayStreetBully

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Oct 25, 2007
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It should and does go without saying that any expressed judgment of players' potential is a matter of opinion or is, at least, quite impossible to discern as objective fact. If you disagree with his opinion, say so (and why).

I am not the one taking issue with Nylander ahead of similarly-ranked prospects. I thought the explanation for Poster A putting Nylander at #2 based on potential was quite reasonable. If the Poster B continues to take issue with that by saying things like "I think everyone should have Reinhart and Draisaitl over Nylander" and "X and Y have much more potential than Z", then it is unnecessary for me to repeat Poster A's explanation at that point. My reply was in line with the progression of discussion.
 

93LEAFS

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Nov 7, 2009
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I take Nylander 2nd, and obviously there is a slight homerish tint to it. But at the time he was viewed as having the highest offensive ceiling in the draft (some viewed Bennett, and possibly Ehlers as being equal), but having arguably the most risk associated with it. He caused a massive divide among alot of scouts who questioned how he was handled, the influence of his dad, his ability to start using teammates more and whether he was better at center or the wing. Since the draft he has answered most of those questions, he has worked hard with the Leafs coaches in all aspects, has shown he is best at center at both the AHL and NHL level. He is strong on faceoffs, has great anticipation, is great at finding teammates (although he can still hold on to the puck a little too long, like most young skill guys) and is deadly in the offensive zone. His defence while it will never be Selke level, is still competent, and he can be a deadly player if used in a proper manner. For example, Patrick Kane and Pannarin this year both had offensive zone starts above 65% which is insane. Its the main reason I hope we get Matthews, as I would love to see Nylander deployed long term like this. No one outside of Draisaitl has proven as much as Nylander this year in regards to being able to play center at the NHL level this year.

Past Ekblad, you can make legitimate claims that any of the top forwards should be anywhere in the 2-9 ranks. going from Reinhart, Draisaitl, Bennett, Nylander, Ehlers, Fabbri, Pastrnak.

Here are my ranking's not including Nylander on how I judged their seasons

1: Fabbri- did everything asked with the minutes provided, was not shielded in zone starts, and was never consistently given minutes with top players, although was on a strong lineup

2: Reinhart-Proved he was adaptable to any situation or role put in. Struggled at the dot when put there, but when used on the wing was an excellent complimentary player to either ROR or Eichel, proving much better than Evander Kane. Very smart all around game, skating is still a slight worry, and he didn't display what was supposed to be his bread and butter which was his supposed amazing vision and passing. That may of been due to sabres lacking elite scoring. Instead though, he showed a willingness to stand in front of the goalie, screen them, take a beating of pucks and defenders to create more goals. If this is a long term aspect of his game, and he never moves to center, but shows more of his elite vision, you have a high quality power winger who can do everything.

3. Draisaitl- Showed an ability to see the game at an elite level, improved his skating and looks to be a center long term. Amazing ES numbers, but was not that great on the PP which is a mystery. I do feel he benefited massively in regards to statistics by playing with Taylor Hall at the beginning of the year when Taylor Hall was playing like a top 15 player league wide. His splits from his games last year, to his games pre-all star break and then post all-star break are massivly different. In his first 40 games this year he was almost a PPG player, in his second 32 he was below .5ppg. Amazing skill, needs more consistency

4. Larkin- Insane speed, with an amazing start. His first 30 games were elite, reflected by his all star game choice, but were clearly unsustainable. Some blame this on the rookie wall and being an NCAA player, and maybe a factor in regards to the size of regression but not the cause. Extremely sheltered all year (just look at zone starts), playing primarily on the wing, with an HHOF capable player in Zetterberg. Was hardly used at centre, and its doubtful his OSIH% stays at the rate it did this year. Can easily put up more points next year, but will have to create more chances, in arguably tougher situations (with no Datsyuk challenging the wings depth), he can depend on the conversion rate staying the same.

5.: Ehlers-Amazing speed, truly gamebreaking. Produced amazing in the second half when played with top line players, struggled when used further down the line up. Can't be the focus of his own line, but when played with Schiefele or Wheeler could easily be a 60 point player next year and 30-30 threat. Went extremely cold at one point

6: Pastrnak-Played a key role on a team challenging for the playoffs, but again battled injuries which has always been a worry for him. Would of been placed higher if this wasn't the 3rd year in a row he has face injury problems. One of the most talented players at the WJC. For the B's sake hopefully his injuries are more a fluke than a long term problem.

7: Bennett-Flashed game breaking skills at point, but a real up and down year, who struggled immensely at points. Still on the slight side if he intends to try to play the game he does, which will be worrisome. Was used as both a winger and center, with more time being spent on the wing, with balanced mixture of usage in regards to zone starts. Did not live up to the summer hype after his solid first round series. Alot of positives (flashes of game breaking skill, plays hard, very aware), mixed with negatives (may be best suited to the wing, game is extremely hard on his body couldn't get a top 6 spot for a long period of time on a bottom 5 team) leaving a lot unanswered going forward.

As for the two Canucks. Never should of been up, McCann had a great start, then disappeared, has elite skating but I don't see a first line player. Virtanen, outside of a stretch post WJC, his year was a disaster, either played dumb or without interest. Both appeared to have their work ethic challenged by team leadership, and Virtanen oddly wasn't even supported by his teammates when facing suspension, eventhough it came with the risk of labelling him a repeat offender. Both should learn a thing from watching the Sedin's and Horvat about how to improve and dedication. Right now I'd clearly take McCann over Virtanen, but it looks like a wasted development for both, and both could be in Utica to start the year. I would take Brock Boeser over both long term.
 

Paxon

202* Stanley Cup Champions
Jul 13, 2003
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I am not the one taking issue with Nylander ahead of similarly-ranked prospects. I thought the explanation for Poster A putting Nylander at #2 based on potential was quite reasonable. If the Poster B continues to take issue with that by saying things like "I think everyone should have Reinhart and Draisaitl over Nylander" and "X and Y have much more potential than Z", then it is unnecessary for me to repeat Poster A's explanation at that point. My reply was in line with the progression of discussion.

I understand where you are coming from, but it is a dismissive way to frame a response to describe a post within what is clearly a discussion of opinions as being "just an opinion". I think I can fairly assume you're not describing your own comments or those you agree with that way. The post he was responding to was also just an opinion. If you were to say "I disagree. Nylander does have more potential so I agree with the other ranking despite NHL experience to this point" it'd also be just an opinion. I'm not trying to make a big deal of it, but these threads go smoother when people are a bit more conscious of how they disagree with others. Personally I think they, as well as Bennett, Ehlers, and Larkin, all have at least fairly similar potential but it's reasonable to believe one of them has more, because in reality it must be the case even if it can't ever really be proven, even in 30 years time, as anything more than opinion.
 

MPStoEberletoHall*

Guest
Funny, how Nylander is only top 3 when it comes to Leaf fans. I have absolutely no problem at all saying Reinhart & Ekblad are better than Draisaitl.
 

BayStreetBully

Registered User
Oct 25, 2007
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I understand where you are coming from, but it is a dismissive way to frame a response to describe a post within what is clearly a discussion of opinions as being "just an opinion". I think I can fairly assume you're not describing your own comments or those you agree with that way. The post he was responding to was also just an opinion. If you were to say "I disagree. Nylander does have more potential so I agree with the other ranking despite NHL experience to this point" it'd also be just an opinion. I'm not trying to make a big deal of it, but these threads go smoother when people are a bit more conscious of how they disagree with others. Personally I think they, as well as Bennett, Ehlers, and Larkin, all have at least fairly similar potential but it's reasonable to believe one of them has more, because in reality it must be the case even if it can't ever really be proven, even in 30 years time, as anything more than opinion.

I appreciate your response. You are right in your assumption. I wasn't describing my own comments with my post. I don't even believe Nylander is at #2. However, I respect when someone believes that, and believe others should be respectful too, without getting their digs with undertones. Personally, I have Reinhart, Draisaitl, Bennett, Nylander, Ehlers and Larkin all generally within the same group, as none have distinguished themselves apart as of yet.

So I suppose I could have just not posted at all, since I wasn't really adding anything productive to the thread. It was just a response to someone with an already dismissive frame of mind. I agree with the general sentiment when this thread was updated yesterday- it's a great draft. I enjoyed the positivity of this thread yesterday.
 
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