Prospect Info: 2014 NHL Draft / Pick #118 - Igor Shestyorkin (G) - Part II

[nyr2k2]

Might be how I read it, but Vally wasn’t saying he’s lucky and that’s why he’s excelled. He’s saying his weaknesses will get magnified 10 fold in the NHL where screened shots and traffic in front are significantly more common. By lucky, he means he’s lucky that he hasn’t had to face that all that much (relatively) and get exposed. But Igor is still so young and raw that even if what Vally said was/is true, I’m confident his positioning will improve with time and Allaire’s guidance.

I think a lot of what you're saying is correct (in the sense that that's what Vally was saying) but he did specifically make the point about getting lucky by throwing out a body part and having the puck hit you. So, you might be right, but I think he was implying an element of actual luck in making saves as well--and also the Hammond anecdote, where his success was chalked up to luck. Anyway, I don't agree with any of it. LOL.

 

[mrmovies779]

Also I know so many here scream bloody murder at me for saying it but he’s undersized. It’s an issue he’ll need to overcome. Quick Hank and now Raanta are the only 3 starters in the NHL under 6’1 or shorter.

size doesnt matter.Just ask my wife

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Valley has the same concerns I have. Zero competition for him. Hasn’t carried the bulk of games for SKA and hasn’t done much when not playing for SKA. Also I know so many here scream bloody murder at me for saying it but he’s undersized. It’s an issue he’ll need to overcome. Quick Hank and now Raanta are the only 3 starters in the NHL under 6’1 or shorter.

Obviously very talented but ALOT to prove. Valley has Georgiev ahead of him right now.

There is just so much silliness in this post

Kid has literally dominated the 2nd best hockey league in the world. And to even suggest Georgiev is ahead of him(you or Vally) is so laughable.

 

[Edge]

I mean, that sounds correct, no? It doesn't mean he won't be good here, but the style and types of shots he sees are probably fairly different.

Also I guess it's just me but I never got an unlikeable vibe from Valliquette.

He's not incorrect, per se. I just found that his comments were lacking in balance.

Yes, a 22 year old prospect is going to have to make adjustments if he hopes to succeed in the NHL.

But, what are the attributes that have made him successful thus far? What are his strengths, why is he considered a prospect and not an afterthought?

It's a preference more than anything else. I tend to prefer analyses to paint a more complete picture of the good, the bad and the unknown.

 

[Edge]

Valley has the same concerns I have. Zero competition for him. Hasn’t carried the bulk of games for SKA and hasn’t done much when not playing for SKA. Also I know so many here scream bloody murder at me for saying it but he’s undersized. It’s an issue he’ll need to overcome. Quick Hank and now Raanta are the only 3 starters in the NHL under 6’1 or shorter.

Obviously very talented but ALOT to prove. Valley has Georgiev ahead of him right now.

He's probably on the lower end of the goalie spectrum in terms of size, but I'm not sure it'll be an issue.

He's listed most places at 6'1, and there are goalies in and around that 6'1-6'2 range.

Frame wise, he's more in that Lundqvist, Fleury, Ward, Bobrovsky range.

As for the playing, that's about what you're going to see in Russia at this point.

I'd be more concerned if he also didn't have success outside of KHL as well. But he's adjusted as needed.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I have a feeling that Vally criticized Igor at least because he's buddies with Hank and possibly Georgiev and was just sticking up for them. Maybe this is too simplistic and I'm wrong. But he seemed like he had an ax to grind.

 

[kovazub94]

I think you guys are trying to read a little bit too much into what Vally was saying. In the beginning Pidto was asking him what do Shestyorkin’s pristine stats in the KHL mean. His answer essentially was that we can’t be sure (hello drafting Lindbom) because a.) KHL’s game is different so you still don’t know for sure if it will translate and b.) in a short period of time a goalie could be lucky. But these were just examples of why we can’t be sure.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Not sure why it was even brought up in here what Vally said. It was such a non issue from a guy who has never even scouted him (like me, so don't take anything i say to heart )

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Also for the record Vally didn't say that Igor has the same luck as Hammond. Seems like he's saying you need to "figure it out if Igor Shestyorkin is doing that well". Meaning you have to look more deeply and see if he's actually having the same issues Hammond did to really gauge. I don't think he's making a definitive statement one way or the other.

 

[nyr2k2]

FWIW I don't really care what Vally said and I'm not trying to make anything of it. I only posted the link and shared my thoughts to dispute the idea that Vally was being bitter about his time in the KHL, which was just a dumb assertion.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I mean, that sounds correct, no? It doesn't mean he won't be good here, but the style and types of shots he sees are probably fairly different.

Also I guess it's just me but I never got an unlikeable vibe from Valliquette.

Its deceiving more than anything. Of course he's not going to be a .940 goalie every season. Why even tell us that a worse league where the surface is different won't produce the same results? Everyone knows that. That doesn't mean he's not going to be an NHL starter and maybe a very good NHL starter. Its near unanimous that Shestyorkin is an elite goalie prospect. Its not like all these neutral analysts are being paid by Shestyorkin to compliment him. They take a lot of things into consideration, and their conclusion is that Shestyorkin is an elite goalie prospect.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Valley has the same concerns I have. Zero competition for him. Hasn’t carried the bulk of games for SKA and hasn’t done much when not playing for SKA. Also I know so many here scream bloody murder at me for saying it but he’s undersized. It’s an issue he’ll need to overcome. Quick Hank and now Raanta are the only 3 starters in the NHL under 6’1 or shorter.

Obviously very talented but ALOT to prove. Valley has Georgiev ahead of him right now.

You've campaigned for like a year or two that he's too short. That was the genesis of your argument, and you know it. Valliquette seemed to be bitter about his experience in the KHL where he sucked and he disliked the culture. I wouldn't be starting my victory lap just yet. There is nearly nothing in common with those two arguments.

 

[Kocur Dill]

I think you guys are trying to read a little bit too much into what Vally was saying. In the beginning Pidto was asking him what do Shestyorkin’s pristine stats in the KHL mean. His answer essentially was that we can’t be sure (hello drafting Lindbom) because a.) KHL’s game is different so you still don’t know for sure if it will translate and b.) in a short period of time a goalie could be lucky. But these were just examples of why we can’t be sure.

You can never be sure with goalies. It's a funny position. An Island upon itself. Only after you've accomplished something, did you actually accomplish something, only to be judged against those who have exceeded your value. It never ends.

Lehner, Markstrom, Bernier, Cechmanek, heck even Vezina winner Jim Carey to name a few. Your whole career is potential until the day you retire.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

I have a feeling that Vally criticized Igor at least because he's buddies with Hank and possibly Georgiev and was just sticking up for them. Maybe this is too simplistic and I'm wrong. But he seemed like he had an ax to grind.

I think it's probably more tempering expectations and pushing back against what most fans think, that Igor is going to step into the NHL and dominate like he does the KHL.

 

[Matz03]

What I got out of that Vally video was this, he’s never seen Shestyorkin play and that his record looks like that of single hot streak. For all the breakdown that Vally does, why not actually breakdown KHL footage and tell us if he appear legit or not?

 

[tradenashnow]

Vally is a moron. Why anybody would listen to him is mind boggling. He constantly embarrasses himself on T.V.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Vally is a moron. Why anybody would listen to him is mind boggling. He constantly embarrasses himself on T.V.

What an outrageous statement!

*looks at username* ah, never mind

 

[Inferno]

I musta interpreted the video differently.

It seemed like all valley was saying was we need 6o always temper our enthusiasm till we can see him play here. See if he's just getting lucky or really is that good.

I think that's a fair assessment. I didn't see him saying shesty was the next hamburgler....I think he was just saying...here's a guy who had a miraculous run that ended up being crap...don't assume shesty will be a good till you see him for yourself and see how he's making the saves.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I musta interpreted the video differently.

It seemed like all valley was saying was we need 6o always temper our enthusiasm till we can see him play here. See if he's just getting lucky or really is that good.

I think that's a fair assessment. I didn't see him saying shesty was the next hamburgler....I think he was just saying...here's a guy who had a miraculous run that ended up being crap...don't assume shesty will be a good till you see him for yourself and see how he's making the saves.

But it's just funny he is even saying that for someone who has never even seen him play...

Nobody is saying he's the next lundqvist, everyone is just saying he is a top goalie prospect, which he is and has proved over the last couple years.

Vally just comes across as someone bitter and probably should have passed on speaking about our prospects and stuck with the game recaps.

 

[nyr2k2]

I would like to walk back some of my comments re: the video and Vally's assessment of Shesterkin. I misheard it the first time and thought he was talking about an actual assessment of both Hammond and Shesterkin, when in fact he appears to be talking exclusively about Hammond. So, I have less of an issue with Vally's opinion here. I still do think it's ridiculous to compare what Hammnond did over 20+ games to what Shesterkin has done over multiple years and levels of competition, or even imply what Shesterkin has done could potentially be chalked up to any amount of luck. The sample size is too big for it to be luck.

And also, I still don't see how anyone can hear "bitterness" in Vally's voice or what he actually says. He seems pretty matter-of-fact to me.

 

[kovazub94]

I musta interpreted the video differently.

It seemed like all valley was saying was we need 6o always temper our enthusiasm till we can see him play here. See if he's just getting lucky or really is that good.

I think that's a fair assessment. I didn't see him saying shesty was the next hamburgler....I think he was just saying...here's a guy who had a miraculous run that ended up being crap...don't assume shesty will be a good till you see him for yourself and see how he's making the saves.

I had the same take.

 

[kovazub94]

I would like to walk back some of my comments re: the video and Vally's assessment of Shesterkin. I misheard it the first time and thought he was talking about an actual assessment of both Hammond and Shesterkin, when in fact he appears to be talking exclusively about Hammond. So, I have less of an issue with Vally's opinion here. I still do think it's ridiculous to compare what Hammnond did over 20+ games to what Shesterkin has done over multiple years and levels of competition, or even imply what Shesterkin has done could potentially be chalked up to any amount of luck. The sample size is too big for it to be luck.

And also, I still don't see how anyone can hear "bitterness" in Vally's voice or what he actually says. He seems pretty matter-of-fact to me.

No bitterness detected either, and, again, it sounded as Hammond was brought up as an examples, not comparison, of how a small sample - even as big as 20+ or more games - could not be a conclusive evidence.

 

[bobbop]

I musta interpreted the video differently.

It seemed like all valley was saying was we need 6o always temper our enthusiasm till we can see him play here. See if he's just getting lucky or really is that good.

I think that's a fair assessment. I didn't see him saying shesty was the next hamburgler....I think he was just saying...here's a guy who had a miraculous run that ended up being crap...don't assume shesty will be a good till you see him for yourself and see how he's making the saves.

This.

 

[aufheben]

Yup, definitely the dog days of the offseason.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

I musta interpreted the video differently.

It seemed like all valley was saying was we need 6o always temper our enthusiasm till we can see him play here. See if he's just getting lucky or really is that good.

I think that's a fair assessment. I didn't see him saying shesty was the next hamburgler....I think he was just saying...here's a guy who had a miraculous run that ended up being crap...don't assume shesty will be a good till you see him for yourself and see how he's making the saves.

I had the same take.

This.

So you guys all think that there is a chance that Shest just may be just getting lucky with his play? 2+ years of luck?