Injury Report: 2014-15 Roster Moves, Line Combos, Injury Updates, Rosterbating

[SolidusAKA]

When one guy is responsible for 4 goals in one game, you play the rookies instead. That logic has no place on this team, playing this poorly.

Do you mean in Toronto? Was Jordie that bad? It was kind of hard to tell in person. Like, you knew he sucked, but was he on the ice for 4 goals?

 

[beepeearr]

Do you mean in Toronto? Was Jordie that bad? It was kind of hard to tell in person. Like, you knew he sucked, but was he on the ice for 4 goals?

Yes, he was

 

[dechire]

Yes, he was

No, in Toronto he was on the ice for 2 goals against. In Detroit he was on for 4 I think

 

[beepeearr]

No, in Toronto he was on the ice for 2 goals against. In Detroit he was on for 4 I think

I was referring to the Detroit game

 

[dechire]

Defenseman John Klingberg was logging some big minutes when he came up to the NHL from the Texas Stars almost one month ago. But that ice time has dropped, and he played just 13:27 in Saturday’s win over Montreal. Stars coach Lindy Ruff discussed Klingberg’s ice time after Monday’s practice.

“I said this when he was going well; I didn’t want to get too far ahead,†Ruff said. “I think it hurt his game. For a couple games, he played poorly. He defended poorly, was in on a lot of scoring chances against. That was the part I referenced, we’ve got to be cautious here. We can all get excited and jump up and down, but the league will take a look at him, figure him out, which I think teams have now. They are a little more cautious and have more respect for what he can do offensively. For me, it’s just to make sure that this young defenseman stays on the right track. He’ll get better, but we gave him way too much responsibility. It led to reckless play, individual play.â€

For all of you complaining about Jordie and Klingberg here is your answer. Ruff doesn't want to give rookies big minutes. There are 3 rookies on defense. That means 2 will be given limited minutes and the other will be benched. It has literally ****ing nothing to do with Jordie being Jamie's brother. You don't have to like Ruff's stance on rookies but it's not news. He did the same thing with Val last year. I don't like Klingberg not playing on the top pair but it's obviously not something that Ruff wants to do. I'm not going to blame Jordie, Goligoski and Daley for a coaching decision even though I don't think any of those 3 deserve the minutes they get.

 

[MetalGodAOD*]

If Ruff isn't going to give the rookies more minutes even though they've earned it, then Nill needs to find another top 4 D-man to replace Jordie.

Also it's absolutely idiotic not to play your best PP asset on the PP just for the sake of limiting his minutes overall. Shelter the kid with lots of PP time and little ES time then ffs. Jeez man.

 

[dechire]

If Ruff isn't going to give the rookies more minutes even though they've earned it, then Nill needs to find another top 4 D-man to replace Jordie.

Also it's absolutely idiotic not to play your best PP asset on the PP just for the sake of limiting his minutes overall. Shelter the kid with lots of PP time and little ES them time ffs. Jeez man.

This is where I think Nill and Ruff differ on their views. After the Gonchar trade Nill was pretty clear that he wasn't planning to making a trade for another defensemen and he wanted to give Klingberg/Oleksiak/Jokipakka a shot. He did make a trade for Demers but that was more of a lateral move and didn't take any opportunities from the rookies. Ruff on the other hand has consistently been playing them in sheltered minutes aside from a few games for Klingberg. Personally I disagree with Ruff's position. As frustrated as I get with Oleksiak and Jokipakka at times the team is going to suck regardless of how many minutes they play. And Klingberg deserves to be playing at least 5 more minutes than he is currently. Unfortunately it's not something that I see changing unless Nill makes a move to force it. I think everyone on this board needs to accept that Ruff is going to keep playing Jordie over the rookies and that he plays favorites with veterans for PP time.

 

[Mr Misty]

Ruff is absolutely right, that is how you develop players. It is obvious there is plenty of slack to go around, and the temptation is to give more and more responsibility to players who look like they can handle it. Pretty quickly you reach the player's breaking point and they have a mare. Your vets can bounce back quickly because they've seen it all, but a younger player isn't yet equipped to handle letting go of bad shifts and bad games. Part of that learning process is trial by fire but too many bad games hurts your young player's confidence, so an ideal situation is to start slow, like 12 minutes, and very very slowly add to that total instead of throwing a rookie out there for 20+.

 

[beepeearr]

Ruff is absolutely right, that is how you develop players. It is obvious there is plenty of slack to go around, and the temptation is to give more and more responsibility to players who look like they can handle it. Pretty quickly you reach the player's breaking point and they have a mare. Your vets can bounce back quickly because they've seen it all, but a younger player isn't yet equipped to handle letting go of bad shifts and bad games. Part of that learning process is trial by fire but too many bad games hurts your young player's confidence, so an ideal situation is to start slow, like 12 minutes, and very very slowly add to that total instead of throwing a rookie out there for 20+.

Its not just minutes, its usage. Klingberg being taken off the PP and giving PP minutes to Jordie makes zero sense. If Klingberg doesn't get PP time next game, maybe Nill needs to bench his coach for a game, because the last thing we need is another Connauton situation where we have an offensive minded Dman who isn't given an PP time

 

[Mr Misty]

And all this bellyaching about PP time is goofy. IIRC the first unit against the Habs was a look we hadn't seen in a bit. If Spezza is on the right point of the first unit, where does Klingberg go? If the second unit is going to be garbage, it's a better bet that Demers will help stop the inevitable breakaway because he isn't as adventurous and is much more experienced.

 

[glovesave_35]

Ruff is absolutely right, that is how you develop players. It is obvious there is plenty of slack to go around, and the temptation is to give more and more responsibility to players who look like they can handle it. Pretty quickly you reach the player's breaking point and they have a mare. Your vets can bounce back quickly because they've seen it all, but a younger player isn't yet equipped to handle letting go of bad shifts and bad games. Part of that learning process is trial by fire but too many bad games hurts your young player's confidence, so an ideal situation is to start slow, like 12 minutes, and very very slowly add to that total instead of throwing a rookie out there for 20+.

That went out the door with Klingberg when he played as many minutes as he did from the get go. I understand sheltering them a bit but on this team there really aren't enough quality veterans to eat that extra time. The really bizarre thing is that when they all of a sudden decided to reign in Klingberg's minutes they took hin completely off the PP. It's back to the Daley and Goligoski show.

 

[glovesave_35]

And all this bellyaching about PP time is goofy. IIRC the first unit against the Habs was a look we hadn't seen in a bit. If Spezza is on the right point of the first unit, where does Klingberg go? If the second unit is going to be garbage, it's a better bet that Demers will help stop the inevitable breakaway because he isn't as adventurous and is much more experienced.

You play your PP QB when you have one. Klingberg doesn't deserve to have his name soiled by being referenced in the same breath as KC.

If your 2nd PP is going to be crap and you are worried about chances against just play your PK unit plus one.

Belly aching about Klingberg's lack of PP time is an entirely reasonable gripe.

 

[OttMorrow]

You play your PP QB when you have one. Klingberg doesn't deserve to have his name soiled by being referenced in the same breath as KC.

If your 2nd PP is going to be crap and you are worried about chances against just play your PK unit plus one.

Belly aching about Klingberg's lack of PP time is an entirely reasonable gripe.

Speaking of Klingberg! My Klingberg Victory Green Jersey arrives today!

Today is a good day.

 

[beepeearr]

You play your PP QB when you have one. Klingberg doesn't deserve to have his name soiled by being referenced in the same breath as KC.

If your 2nd PP is going to be crap and you are worried about chances against just play your PK unit plus one.

Belly aching about Klingberg's lack of PP time is an entirely reasonable gripe.

I know Klingberg has been miles ahead of KC, the point was simply if you have a young offensive defenseman and you choose to give him no PP time its a misuse of an asset.

Yes they went with a new setup last night, but you find a spot for someone like Klingberg who has looked good on the PP. This coaching staff found a way to put Jordie on the PP during the road trip..freaking Jordie on the PP, yet they couldn't find even a few minutes of PP time for Klingberg last game.

You didn't like the KC comparison, how about the almost non existent PP time Nuke got last year. Same guy running the PP, same issue, just with a forward

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

I will guess Ruff knows more than we do, and give him the benefit of the doubt.

Just JK's small stature might be enough to keep him from playing 20 minutes for the whole season, to worry about wearing out. Nuke seemed to wear out last year in adjusting to an 82 game schedule.

Or maybe he is right and the other teams now focus on him. His magical stats were going to go down, but he wants him to have enough success to keep his confidence up, so he shelters him a little bit so he makes more plays.

Lastly, it is also possible he is minding his vets feelings about a rookie taking over. Daley for sure has a case that he has been effective on the PP, maybe Goli too, and they wanted some of their minutes back.

All speculation or reasonable guesses as to what goes on in the locker room and coaches mind.

 

[aloonda*]

I will guess Ruff knows more than we do, and give him the benefit of the doubt.

Just JK's small stature might be enough to keep him from playing 20 minutes for the whole season, to worry about wearing out. Nuke seemed to wear out last year in adjusting to an 82 game schedule.

Or maybe he is right and the other teams now focus on him. His magical stats were going to go down, but he wants him to have enough success to keep his confidence up, so he shelters him a little bit so he makes more plays.

Lastly, it is also possible he is minding his vets feelings about a rookie taking over. Daley for sure has a case that he has been effective on the PP, maybe Goli too, and they wanted some of their minutes back.

All speculation or reasonable guesses as to what goes on in the locker room and coaches mind.

I think he is worrying too much about making people happy. Happy is when you win, not playing time.

 

[Dallasman]

Develop your rookies, don't overwork them. Oilers did this with Schultz and he's absolute crap.

I trust Ruff knows what he's doing. I don't coach in the NHL and none of us do. This team is young and developing. I'm not expecting miracles this season so bring these guys along slowly.

 

[Stars90]

I worry less about ruining Klingberg because he's played against men for so long. Young D terrify coaches though. It happens all over the league.

 

[Mr Misty]

That went out the door with Klingberg when he played as many minutes as he did from the get go. I understand sheltering them a bit but on this team there really aren't enough quality veterans to eat that extra time. The really bizarre thing is that when they all of a sudden decided to reign in Klingberg's minutes they took hin completely off the PP. It's back to the Daley and Goligoski show.

There is a difference between how many minutes is best for the Stars to win and how many is best for Klingberg to develop. If Ruff is scaling back because he realizes this is a lost season, then he is making the right choice.

You play your PP QB when you have one. Klingberg doesn't deserve to have his name soiled by being referenced in the same breath as KC.

If your 2nd PP is going to be crap and you are worried about chances against just play your PK unit plus one.

Belly aching about Klingberg's lack of PP time is an entirely reasonable gripe.

Avalanche 2:59, Leafs 4:31, Wings 2:18. 1 game of zero minutes leads to a freakout.

It isn't hard to see the 2nd unit is low reward high risk minutes. The 2nd unit won't ever score, even if it did we won't make the playoffs, Klingberg playing there could have his confidence hurt by inevitable futility and have unreasonable pressure to fix the whole thing by himself.

Klingberg doesn't need a bunch of reps of 5 on 4, we can all see he is ok at it already. What he needs is 5 on 5 minutes, so if you are going to cut back on his workload, the powerplay time is the clear choice to go.

 

[StarsTx]

If he is seen as a future pp qb type player the he should absolutely be getting time on it. I understand Daley being on it but for the life of me having Goligoski on it over Klinger is insane the way the 2 are playing.

I just don't understand the logic behind he doesn't need much 5 on 4 time this season, if he figures to be a future key component of the pp.

Maybe not being on the powerplay and cutting his minutes gives Nill better negotiating leverage, in which case, it might make a little sense,

 

[Mr Misty]

If he is seen as a future pp qb type player the he should absolutely be getting time on it. I understand Daley being on it but for the life of me having Goligoski on it over Klinger is insane the way the 2 are playing.

I just don't understand the logic behind he doesn't need much 5 on 4 time this season, if he figures to be a future key component of the pp.

Maybe not being on the powerplay and cutting his minutes gives Nill better negotiating leverage, in which case, it might make a little sense,

I sure as hell don't want a ppqb, I want a defenseman. That means giving him limited minutes but not sheltered minutes. If you want a power play specialist, you give him a bunch of oz starts and low quality competition and powerplay time and you wind up with a player who has kittens every time he is caught on an icing and is up against Crobsy or Toews. No thanks.

I am still waiting for some person to say that Klingberg on the 2nd unit wouldn't be a disaster and that we need more than one right shot on the point for each unit, because that seems to be the implicit argument that is being made here. Spezza has the same skillset as Benn and Seguin so he has to be on a point. Demers isn't going to leave the blue line, which is absolutely necessary considering how ineffectual the 2nd line is.

 

[dechire]

On a related note I have an issue with how ****ing terrible and useless the second powerplay unit is. The 1st unit hasn't been tremendously successful so why not split the resources and put one of Benn Seguin or Spezza on the second unit ? Otherwise we are literally wasting half the powerplay with a group that is never going to score

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

I think he is worrying too much about making people happy. Happy is when you win, not playing time.

Well, he certainly wasn't worried about making Hemsky happy, was he?

There is a locker room dynamic, said to be great last year. Obviously not so big this year, from results. Who knows why,

Maybe Spezza contract being bigger than out two best players (first speculation, then fact)
Hemsky not buying into work ethic

Jordie being favored (if he is) because of Jamie's status?

Rookies getting playing time?

Constant trade rumors? (granted more her than in the home office, but a few leaked out)

It could be locker room chemistry. We think it is what got Crawford booted. We know Hitch got the axe when his players stopped listening.

Or maybe its just talent, because we knew some players would slump and we know our talent level requires many career years to win (as it would be with most teams)

For whatever reason, I think we can say Jamie, Spezza, Hemsky, Nuke (IR), Scevior, Cole, Horcoff, Peverly (IR) are not playing up to their top potential right now.

On D, other than Klingberg to start his career, and Nemeth who is on IR, every other D is not playing to potential. Not even playing as well as our best stretches last year. Maybe they just reverted to form.

All goalies have slumped from a little to a lot.

 

[Troy McClure]

Some of this comes from the team finally winning after a bad stretch. It's rare for coaches to change the lineup after a win like that. I suspect Hemsky being out is more about rewarding the lineup that won than it is further punishing Hemsky.

 

[Hull Fan]

There's being responsible about developing Klingberg right and stupidly ridiculous regarding his play time. Ruff went from completely overboard 25+ minutes to utterly Pejorative Slured 13 minutes in the span of 10 games. There is such a thing as a happy medium. Yeah Klingberg had a rough patch, that happens to anyone rookie or not, that should not be an excuse to drastically cut his minutes and play Daley, Goligoski, or Jodie ****ing Benn more.

He should be seeing 20 minutes a night plus PP time. If they want to cut back then don't put him out on the kill unless we're taking 7 penalties that night.

Ruff isn't alone in his fear of rookies but he's being stupid because his vets have continuously failed all year long and his rookies are actually showing they're ready for ice time and responsibility. They'll make mistakes but trusting them and putting them out there helps them grow. See the difference in Oleksiak's game now vs the beginning of the season. There should never be some kind of arbitrary quota or limit to the number of rookies you ice in any one game or situation. Play your best players and it will work out in the end.