Zaitsev

[Goose]

Zaitsev has not looked good. There are a lot of "explanations" for his sub-par play, and maybe they're valid. Hard to argue with the fact that he hasn't looked good, however, and that's a little concerning coming from what might be a 7 year contract.

No reason to panic, but if we make it to another round and he still looks like this I might start worrying a bit.

 

[KessMeRandy]

Lead all D in ice time on a team that made the playoffs in his rookies season. Get's hurt before the playoffs and comes in cold. Hmm can't imagine what they see in him. I guess it will be puzzling when he is on the all rookie team too?

C'mon now, I think you're being a bit hard on him there OP. No Zaitsev like several other players = no playoffs.

Okay. He's 25 years old, lol. He's not going to get much better.

 

[Harold Ballard]

Okay. He's 25 years old, lol. He's not going to get much better.

Said many about Brad Marchand
..

 

[Man Bear Pig]

Said many about Brad Marchand
..

You can name many others too but, the vast majority of nhl players start peaking around 25/26. You usually won't see a massive improvement after that age range.

 

[1specter]

Okay. He's 25 years old, lol. He's not going to get much better.

He's a dman and he has never played more than about 65 games in a year (season+playoffs combined). In the past year alone, his team went to the KHL finals, then he played for Russia at the World Championships, then he was the #1D for Russia at the World Cup and then played a full season as the Leafs #2D.

There are plenty of dmen who only hit their stride in their late 20s. A lot of people in this thread will eat lots of crow in the future, I guarantee it.

 

[Nithoniniel]

He's been our worst D-man so far, but he's also coming off an injury that he shows clear signs of being bothered by. We should be careful about drawing too much conclusions from that.

You can name many others too but, the vast majority of nhl players start peaking around 25/26. You usually won't see a massive improvement after that age range.

Very true, but the majority of cases where you see late improvement it's cases where the player is coming late to the league. There's more to Zaitsev's game than he's shown us so far, and I don't think it's impossible that he'll translate it.

On the larger ice surface he was an incredibly reliable guy, always making the right decisions. With less time so far, it hasn't really been the case. Some, like Babcock, says that the NHL game slows down with experience, and if that happens we might see Zaitsev make better choices with the puck. Another part that hasn't transferred is his shot. He was terrific at finding angles and getting his shot through in KHL. Right now he doesn't seem to find the angles. If that can change, we could see another step.

There's reasons to believe he could be better. It would be wrong to make decisions taking that for granted though.

 

[firstemperor]

He hasn't been our worst. Carrick and marcinin have easily been worst. But he is struggling more with the breakout and more clean entries. He got thrown into a very fast and physical series in game 3 with little time to adjust. I don't have any particular qualms with him. Even at his worst, hes still looked like a #4 for me. I have no problem giving him 7 years of his AAV is lower because of it

 

[Pi]

I can like Zaitsev and not like the prospect of a 7 year deal. I don't think we would regret the contract but it is definitely a risk that the Leafs would be taking.

 

[Critical13]

I trust the Leafs brain trust but I would be pretty upset if this guy became a core member of the team.

 

[Daisy Jane]

i'm not sure why people are afraid of the extra two years (esp. at the cap hit).
we're paying for stability (him) and ufa years. I remember people being equally apprehensive signing Jake for 5.

the worst case scenario is here, that should he really be bad - we can trade him, or he can terminate and go back to Russia.

I'm not really seeing the risk (though - if someone can explain it from their POV, i'll be glad to give a listen).

 

[ShaneFalco]

i'm not sure why people are afraid of the extra two years (esp. at the cap hit).
we're paying for stability (him) and ufa years. I remember people being equally apprehensive signing Jake for 5.

the worst case scenario is here, that should he really be bad - we can trade him, or he can terminate and go back to Russia.

I'm not really seeing the risk (though - if someone can explain it from their POV, i'll be glad to give a listen).

Or iif it doesn't work out, Lou can have a........ conversation with him

 

[Menzinger]

i'm not sure why people are afraid of the extra two years (esp. at the cap hit).
we're paying for stability (him) and ufa years. I remember people being equally apprehensive signing Jake for 5.

the worst case scenario is here, that should he really be bad - we can trade him, or he can terminate and go back to Russia.

I'm not really seeing the risk (though - if someone can explain it from their POV, i'll be glad to give a listen).

I'm just fine with a long term deal for Zaitsev but abstractly speaking there's always risk with high salary longer term deals.

Not every contract is tradeable ie the leafs got incredibly lucky with Clarkson due to a very unique situation, but plenty of teams haven't been able to dump their mistakes like that.

 

[Nithoniniel]

He hasn't been our worst. Carrick and marcinin have easily been worst. But he is struggling more with the breakout and more clean entries. He got thrown into a very fast and physical series in game 3 with little time to adjust. I don't have any particular qualms with him. Even at his worst, hes still looked like a #4 for me. I have no problem giving him 7 years of his AAV is lower because of it

Carrick is barely playing. Hard to judge him against others. And I think Marincin has been better than Zaitsev, surprisingly enough.

 

[Gabriel426]

How much is a middle pairing Dmen cost in the open market? From my estimate it is about 4-5mil. Thus if Zaitsev gets a contract that is in that range, it should be a fair contract. Now is 7 years too long? Will Zaitsev continue to go downhill and become a bottom pairing Dmen? I really don't see that happening in 7 yrs.
there is no doubt that he is not playing as good as before, but it is not so bad that it is bottom pairing quality.

Don't let Don Cherry brainwash your head, if Zaitsev is from Toronto or Kingston, Cherry will be saying stuff like look at the way he moves the puck, his positioning, his calmness....that's a good ole Canadian boy playing the right way.....

 

[Apotheosis]

1. I still think he is playing somewhat injured. The immediate doubts going in to the series itself and whether he would play, I feel as if he was rushed back.

2. I'm not too worried about him in the long run. It was his first season in the NHL. There's a grace period. You adjust to the league and how to stop certain players. He's a mobile D and has the physicality and tools to shut down players and move the puck well.

3. I see him as a mainstay in the top 4 with Gardiner on the second pairing and potentially if Gardiner leaves, Dermott, or whoever else plays on that second pairing. He's a good, mobile compliment.

 

[firstemperor]

Carrick is barely playing. Hard to judge him against others. And I think Marincin has been better than Zaitsev, surprisingly enough.

I thought Marcinin looked good in game 4 (he looked great on the 5 on 3) but he was bad in game 5. He costed us a goal on the PP IMO- as he refused to close the gap on the shooter. And he repeated this same mistake several times throughout the game- unwilling to engage and close the gap on shooting/passing lanes....that was the difference between Caps/Leafs PK as the Caps readily get into passing lanes and will close shooting gaps quickly.

Carrick with any more minutes would look a lot worst. I haven't seen him win a puck battle to regain possession all season, let alone series- and his breakouts/entries aren't exactly good either. I think you can give some leeway to not being astute defensively but there has to be something to give with Carrick (is it upside? is it his great offensive ability (i.e. possession, breakouts, zone entries, etc.)- for me, it's none of the above...hence why he is being deployed the way he is.

I'm willing to give Marcinin a bit of a grace period as he hasn't been a regular all year. I don't think Zaitsev has looked nearly as bad as people are saying- the JVR/Marner/Bozak line has definitively looked very bad. But he hasn't been as solid as he usually is, that's for sure.

 

[Walshy7]

How much is a middle pairing Dmen cost in the open market? From my estimate it is about 4-5mil. Thus if Zaitsev gets a contract that is in that range, it should be a fair contract. Now is 7 years too long? Will Zaitsev continue to go downhill and become a bottom pairing Dmen? I really don't see that happening in 7 yrs.
there is no doubt that he is not playing as good as before, but it is not so bad that it is bottom pairing quality.

Don't let Don Cherry brainwash your head, if Zaitsev is from Toronto or Kingston, Cherry will be saying stuff like look at the way he moves the puck, his positioning, his calmness....that's a good ole Canadian boy playing the right way.....

exactly this. Earlier in the season he said something along the lines of "dont look at +- <player> is playing great" surprise surprise it was a Canadian dman.

 

[TheBigThree]

Yeah umm I hope the 7 years is a BS rumor. Really don't want to see a contract that long for a player we've only seen for 1 year. He's a offensive D that barely scores goals so I don't know. I know people ***** about plus/minus but he's still a -22

 

[Leaf Shaker]

It's very true, the Don Cherry effect is real. Even met up with some friends earlier this week and they think Zaitsev is bad and were referencing his plus minus just like Cherry.

Incredible how this senile fool gets into people's heads. He also loves to point out when Nylander makes a defensive mistake but never ever shows Marner making one even though he's made far more.

Remember his famous rant when we chose Nylander over Ritchie?

Wonder why he doesn't talk about that anymore. Of course he wouldn't. He never likes to admit he's ever wrong, which is like a lot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGpFvealXw0

 

[HandshakeLineRespect]

Man if we could ever find just a legit right shot top pairing dman we will be laughing. Doesn't have to be a Norris type guy just a legit player. Slots zaitsev properly, I don't mind carrick as a 6th and you have to think a nielsen/valiev/dermott pushes through in the next year or two.

 

[Duffman955]

Zaitsev hasnt looked good for a long time now.

Would really like a bridge deal

 

[lovemyleafs]

He was definitely not playing at 100%. He did pretty well in tonight's game.

 

[thewave]

He had a good season! I think he was concussed a little still and needs to get that checked out. Probably do some of that reaction time training Crosby did. Hope he gets 6x4m or so.

 

[Polaris1010]

Zaitsev was pretty good tonight.

Everyone played well. Just was not enough their first time in the playoffs.

 

[fahad203]

Zaitsev was pretty good tonight.

Everyone played well. Just was not enough their first time in the playoffs.

That's the thing. We played one of the best if not the best team in the league. They'll make a lot of good defender bad. Heck we made Shattenkirk look bad. Z is a good D, a good third pairing D