You guys don't get it - LTIR is the problem

[Son of bodacious]

For all the mewling (very appropriate description of most of HFBoards posters) about bad contracts and mismanaged cap space, it's obvious that very few of you know how it works.

Big Misconception: LTIR allows you do go over the cap by the amount of the injured players contract without repercussions.

Fact: While you can add players and theoretically exceed the cap, the total compensation paid out by the team must be below the cap figure or there will be a penalty on the following year's cap. That compensation includes players on LTIR.

So here is the situation for the math challenged:
Let's say the cap is at 69M. Marc Savard still is on contract with a cap hit of 4.5M. That means that the Bruins must only pay out 64.5M to all other players including bonuses for the season. If they exceed that like last year, then they will have cap penalties. Yes contracts can be added that exceed the cap by 4.5M, but they have to save enough to be under the cap for the year.

For this year the Bruins have a 4M penalty due to bonuses. This year they can now only pay out 60.5M to players not including Savard. Yes, you could try to spend the LTIR, but you will be hit by penalties the next year. This is why there was no Boychuk replacement. They couldn't add a 3-4M player without using up LTIR. The strategy this year was try to save a bit under the cap (about 1M would be sufficient) so that they could add someone at the deadline with their LTIR allowance. This way they could go over 60.5 by 3-4M and still come in at 60.5 for the season.

This partly explains why they decided to trade Boychuk instead of dropping Kelly or any other assortment of roster players - Boychuk saved them 3.5M on the cap. Kelly only saves them 3 so another player would have to go.

Next season they get back 4M, but until Savard's contract runs out, it will always be a challenge to make the cap work.

And no, I'm not related to Chiarelli. I just get tired of the mewling across HFboards when it comes to contracts and cap management.

Click to read more...

 

[Son of bodacious]

Also it's pretty safe to say that is they had the extra 4.5M in cap space, Seguin wouldn't have been traded either.

 

[DitClapper]

Definitely Pete.

 

[ranold26]

Sorry I struck a nerve. I go to the box, two minutes feel shame.

 

[Danton Heineken]

I think this guy just learned the word "mewling" and needed to come up with an excuse to use it.

 

[Son of bodacious]

I will say that for someone that needs to preserve cap space, the Smith contract is a headscratcher. Unless he plans to trade him.

 

[CombatOnContact]

Interesting if true. Can someone please build Capgeek 2.0 and make sure all this is included

Thanks!

 

[Mount Kramer Cameras]

To mewl or not to mewl

 

[ODAAT]

For all the mewling (very appropriate description of most of HFBoards posters) about bad contracts and mismanaged cap space, it's obvious that very few of you know how it works.

Big Misconception: LTIR allows you do go over the cap by the amount of the injured players contract without repercussions.

Fact: While you can add players and theoretically exceed the cap, the total compensation paid out by the team must be below the cap figure or there will be a penalty on the following year's cap. That compensation includes players on LTIR.

So here is the situation for the math challenged:
Let's say the cap is at 69M. Marc Savard still is on contract with a cap hit of 4.5M. That means that the Bruins must only pay out 64.5M to all other players including bonuses for the season. If they exceed that like last year, then they will have cap penalties. Yes contracts can be added that exceed the cap by 4.5M, but they have to save enough to be under the cap for the year.

For this year the Bruins have a 4M penalty due to bonuses. This year they can now only pay out 60.5M to players not including Savard. Yes, you could try to spend the LTIR, but you will be hit by penalties the next year. This is why there was no Boychuk replacement. They couldn't add a 3-4M player without using up LTIR. The strategy this year was try to save a bit under the cap (about 1M would be sufficient) so that they could add someone at the deadline with their LTIR allowance. This way they could go over 60.5 by 3-4M and still come in at 60.5 for the season.

This partly explains why they decided to trade Boychuk instead of dropping Kelly or any other assortment of roster players - Boychuk saved them 3.5M on the cap. Kelly only saves them 3 so another player would have to go.

Next season they get back 4M, but until Savard's contract runs out, it will always be a challenge to make the cap work.

And no, I'm not related to Chiarelli. I just get tired of the mewling across HFboards when it comes to contracts and cap management.

it`s a fan discussion board, there will be mewling

 

[Danton Heineken]

To mewl or not to mewl

It has created quite the razzmatazz.

 

[TCDaniels]

I have to admit that I'm confused... Yes - you can count me as one of the ignorant masses.

If players on LTIR count against the cap, then why is there a LTIR? What is the benefit of it? And why are the Bruins able to spend to the Cap plus Savvy's LTIR number?

Where's Dom when you need him to dumb down things to my level?

In the meantime... I mewl.

 

[LSCII]

I think this guy just learned the word "mewling" and needed to come up with an excuse to use it.

Dammit. Now I have to go to dictionary.com and see what all the hubbub is about....

 

[ODAAT]

love reading a thread with an OP telling me/us "you guys don`t get it"

this won`t end well

 

[22Brad Park]

Slice the pie anyway you want but Chiarelli jammed team up hard.Ottawa has a Cap of 54 million and right there with Bruins.He gave out alot of dumb no trades and paid tad more then he should of too some players.And far as LTIR .Reason Bruins do not go over it is cause its money out of owners pockets .

 

[Son of bodacious]

I have to admit that I'm confused... Yes - you can count me as one of the ignorant masses.

If players on LTIR count against the cap, then why is there a LTIR? What is the benefit of it? And why are the Bruins able to spend to the Cap plus Savvy's LTIR number?

Where's Dom when you need him to dumb down things to my level?

In the meantime... I mewl.

The LTIR was designed to allow "temporary" relief to teams when injuries occur. By design they did not want any team to exceed the cap so they effectively closed that loophole.

 

[Son of bodacious]

love reading a thread with an OP telling me/us "you guys don`t get it"

this won`t end well

Perhaps that was the intent

 

[TCDaniels]

The LTIR was designed to allow "temporary" relief to teams when injuries occur. By design they did not want any team to exceed the cap so they effectively closed that loophole.

How does it work differently for temporary vs longer-term?

I mean - I was always told by EVERYONE that the Bruins were able to spend to the cap, plus Savvy's LTIR... All this time they've been spending LESS on PLAYING players than everyone has been calculating?

I know the semantics are different - when cap hits take effect, daily calculations, etc...

But I... just don't get it.

 

[Son of bodacious]

Slice the pie anyway you want but Chiarelli jammed team up hard.Ottawa has a Cap of 54 million and right there with Bruins.He gave out alot of dumb no trades and paid tad more then he should of too some players.And far as LTIR .Reason Bruins do not go over it is cause its money out of owners pockets .

Undeniably true. He could have given himself some breathing room by tougher negotiations. I believe they miscalculated anticipating a "flexible" CBA and have been in crisis mode ever since.

 

[Donnie Shulzhoffer]

Undeniably true. He could have given himself some breathing room by tougher negotiations. I believe they miscalculated anticipating a "flexible" CBA and have been in crisis mode ever since.

Then you don't get it either! Mewling at its finest.

 

[SPV]

I asked somewhere else, but could we still use a compliance buyout for Savard just to rid ourselves of this constant issue.

 

[Son of bodacious]

How does it work differently for temporary vs longer-term?

I mean - I was always told by EVERYONE that the Bruins were able to spend to the cap, plus Savvy's LTIR... All this time they've been spending LESS on PLAYING players than everyone has been calculating?

I know the semantics are different - when cap hits take effect, daily calculations, etc...

But I... just don't get it.

There is no short term relief for injuries - you have to cover them - that's why you need to be under the cap by 1-1.5M, to cover the cost of call-ups.

 

[Rubber Biscuit]

I asked somewhere else, but could we still use a compliance buyout for Savard just to rid ourselves of this constant issue.

No. .

 

[Gee Wally]

I asked somewhere else, but could we still use a compliance buyout for Savard just to rid ourselves of this constant issue.

Buyouts are gone.

 

[Son of bodacious]

I asked somewhere else, but could we still use a compliance buyout for Savard just to rid ourselves of this constant issue.

No dice! As an injured player he is entitled to his full payout. You can't buy him out. That's why Columbus traded for that horrendous contract.

BTW now the Leafs can enjoy the frustrations of managing a bigger LTIR problem!

 

[SPV]

Buyouts are gone.

oh well, guess Chia will just have to figure out some paper transactions to make it work next year. crazy that they don't have some way to fix that; seems like complete BS that they have to circumvent the cap for one day until they can use LTIR.