Proposal: [WPG-EDM] Ehlers for RNH

[ChaoticOrange]

Personally I think he is a solid 2C and frankly he would look great next to Ehlers on the Jets
Ehlers is one of the most shuffled around wingers on the Jets team and hasn't played as much with Scheifele and Wheeler since Connor entered the league. Hard to be consistent when you play on a new line every couple of weeks. For two seasons there was only a handful of players in the league putting up as many points with as little icetime. Personally I think he has been mismanaged by Paul Maurice for several seasons and think if someone trades for him people will be surprised by his quality but I've ranted enough about that on the Jets board

That’s the difference with a good team like the Jets, the second tier linemates for a LW are Little and Laine. Second tier linemates here for a C are Lucic and Chiasson.

I’ve said a few times I think RNH would look really good on the Jets but we’ll never agree on a price.

 

[AnInjuredJasonZucker]

just a correction. 28 of his points came via mcdavid so he only put up 41 playing 2nd line C with those players.

Not saying he's not good but he's a 50-55 point centre. mcdavid inflates his stats.

RNH scores at a pace of 58 points per 82 over his career, which is less than the 60 per 82 pace he had before McDavid joined the team. So, about McDavid inflating his stats...

 

[ChaoticOrange]

RNH scores at a pace of 58 points per 82 over his career, which is less than the 60 per 82 pace he had before McDavid joined the team. So, about McDavid inflating his stats...

So McDavid accounts for 2 points per season for RNH? Sure. Sounds good.

 

[TS Quint]

So you think it makes more sense to make the team worse just so we dont have so much money on one line?

RNH and Draisaitl put up similar numbers away from McDavid.

Draisaitl puts up way better numbers with McDavid than RNH does.

Please explain why we should split them up again?

You understand I never said it would have worked with that dumpster fire roster last year.

As long as the Oilers are a one line team they aren’t going anywhere.

As long as Leon is McDavid’s side kick he isn’t earning his money. Leon needs to drive his own line. Much like McDavid did with Maroon, Leon needs to help other players play above their head.

 

[TS Quint]

Can someone explain to me what a this with/without chat means in respect to RNH?

How about this Spider chart:

And this Replacement chart:

Do they reflect positively on him?

Can anyone help me interpret these graphs? @ChaoticOrange maybe? You seem to have an understanding of the Oilers.

 

[MessierII]

You understand I never said it would have worked with that dumpster fire roster last year.

As long as the Oilers are a one line team they aren’t going anywhere.

As long as Leon is McDavid’s side kick he isn’t earning his money. Leon needs to drive his own line. Much like McDavid did with Maroon, Leon needs to help other players play above their head.

I don’t really care you score 50 goals and 100 points but you definitely earn your money when you do.

 

[Guffman]

Sure thing, which is why I said RNH makes a lot of sense for the Jets but we’d never come to an agreement on trade value.

I mean, if you want to remove Ehlers from the equation and replace him with a shorter term asset, “sure thing”.

 

[Gil Fisher]

Can anyone help me interpret these graphs? @ChaoticOrange maybe? You seem to have an understanding of the Oilers.

They mean:
a) Skaters were better without RNH than they were with him.
b) RNH was good with McD
c) Most skaters were better without RNH than RNH was without said skater.

 

[Jamin]

You understand I never said it would have worked with that dumpster fire roster last year.

As long as the Oilers are a one line team they aren’t going anywhere.

As long as Leon is McDavid’s side kick he isn’t earning his money. Leon needs to drive his own line. Much like McDavid did with Maroon, Leon needs to help other players play above their head.

Everyone is obsessed with him as a 2nd line center they let it ignore logic. What do 50 goal scoring wingers go for on the market? Based on what Skinner just got a 50 goal 100 point wingers would get 8.5 mil as a UFA this summer

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Can anyone help me interpret these graphs? @ChaoticOrange maybe? You seem to have an understanding of the Oilers.

Generally, it means that players that play with RNH at even strength shoot less - possibly because he’s used in more defensive situations.

RNH isn’t a volume shooter, and never has been.

Why dont we have a look at a Jet at random - oh, say, Laine. He was the worst relative shot forward on the Jets by a country mile. What does that say about him?

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I mean, if you want to remove Ehlers from the equation and replace him with a shorter term asset, “sure thing”.

No, we don’t. Hence why we’d never agree. I’m sure you’d be all over Perreault ++ or something equally awful for us, but we don’t want the lesser asset and spare parts.

 

[Jamin]

We need RNH as center. Everyone wants to give us a winger for Mcdavid but we already have one, he has 2 70+ point seasons and 1 100 point season. But he also helps take faceoffs since he is better at it. And if there is ever an injury/suspension he can fill in as 1st or 2nd line center. And he is 6'3" 200+ pounds so can handle the big pacific division teams.

Ive said it before but the team is looking for a 2nd line winger to play with RNH not to get a winger for Mcdavid. As someone else has said Oilers have 3 legit top 6 players and trading RNH for Ehlers leaves us with 3 top 6 players just without the RNH versatility.

The added term of Ehlers is nice but I would still decline

 

[MNRube]

As a neutral fan, RNH would thrive in WPG. A perfect fit.

Ehlers would be good in EDM but i dont think would improve the team like RNH would in Winnipeg.

 

[Hunter368]

No, we don’t. Hence why we’d never agree. I’m sure you’d be all over Perreault ++ or something equally awful for us, but we don’t want the lesser asset and spare parts.

The reason why you wouldn’t want pieces for Nuge is why the we wouldn’t want to exchange 6 years of Ehlers for 2 years of Nuge. It’s a gap that can’t be bridged, this offer/idea is a moot subject imo.

 

[Guffman]

No, we don’t. Hence why we’d never agree. I’m sure you’d be all over Perreault ++ or something equally awful for us, but we don’t want the lesser asset and spare parts.

The issue I am having with you is you saying this makes a lot of sense for the Jets when it clearly doesn’t. Just because a particular position is a need doesn’t mean people can throw up a bunch of nonsensical suggestions (e.g., a skilled player on a good, six year contract) and say the Jets should be all over it. That’s ridiculous.

This is why it is silly to put Ehlers and RNH together as the core pieces of the trade. It doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

seems like a good deal. Jets need a 2C, Oilers need a good winger and to get Draisaitl to solidify that 2C spot instead of on McDavid's wing.

 

[Hunter368]

The issue I am having with you is you saying this makes a lot of sense for the Jets when it clearly doesn’t. Just because a particular position is a need doesn’t mean people can throw up a bunch of nonsensical suggestions (e.g., a skilled player on a good, six year contract) and say the Jets should be all over it. That’s ridiculous.

This is why it is silly to put Ehlers and RNH together as the core pieces of the trade. It doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.

Fans and local media would be instantly calling for Chevy to be fired if he did such a dumb move. Trading 6 years of Ehlers for 2 years of Nuge is a career limiting move as a Jets GM.

Might be a different story if this idea was next summer when Nuge can discuss a contract extension.......but as of right now Nuge contract term makes it a big no from the Jets.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

The issue I am having with you is you saying this makes a lot of sense for the Jets when it clearly doesn’t. Just because a particular position is a need doesn’t mean people can throw up a bunch of nonsensical suggestions (e.g., a skilled player on a good, six year contract) and say the Jets should be all over it. That’s ridiculous.

This is why it is silly to put Ehlers and RNH together as the core pieces of the trade. It doesn’t make any sense whatsoever.

I’m saying RNH makes a lot of sense for the Jets. Ehlers, maybe not, but IMO Edmonton gets the worse player today if it should happen.

If you could turn Roslovic and spare parts into RNH you should be all over it but that’s not good for us.

 

[TS Quint]

They mean:
a) Skaters were better without RNH than they were with him.
b) RNH was good with McD
c) Most skaters were better without RNH than RNH was without said skater.

Are you sure? That doesn’t sound right from what the Oiler fans are saying.

 

[TS Quint]

Generally, it means that players that play with RNH at even strength shoot less - possibly because he’s used in more defensive situations.

RNH isn’t a volume shooter, and never has been.

Why dont we have a look at a Jet at random - oh, say, Laine. He was the worst relative shot forward on the Jets by a country mile. What does that say about him?

What does Laine have to do with this discussion? Not only that, any reasonable Jet fan will tell you Laine wasn’t all that good for the most part last year. RNH on the other hand is being portrayed as an “impact 2C” as one poster called him.

On top of that RNH isn’t a random player, he’s specifically one the players being discussed in this thread. Can we keep this on topic? If you have any stats or questions about Ehlers I’m sure people following this thread would like to hear more of what you have to say.

But thanks for the explanations to the graphs.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

What does Laine have to do with this discussion? Not only that, any reasonable Jet fan will tell you Laine wasn’t all that good for the most part last year. RNH on the other hand is being portrayed as an “impact 2C” as one poster called him.

On top of that RNH isn’t a random player, he’s specifically one the players being discussed in this thread. Can we keep this on topic? If you have any stats or questions about Ehlers I’m sure people following this thread would like to hear more of what you have to say.

But thanks for the explanations to the graphs.

Lol so you looked and didn’t like what you saw then? “Let’s keep this on topic” and “what does this have to do with our player” is the classic refrain of someone that wants to slag our player all they want but don’t you dare cast OUR boy in a negative light.

I bring up Laine because values can change in a hurry. It wasn’t too long ago Oiler fans were being laughed at for suggesting Draisaitl-Laine swaps. Like it or not, Ehlers value has taken a hit. If it’s not a fit then that’s fine but there’s some monstrously awful underrating of RNH going on here, along with the classic “but McDavid” stupidity. Do none of Kyle Connor’s points count then? He had TWO really good linemates for most of the year!

Ehlers helps us a lot less today than RNH does, and we’re not trading a 69 point forward for a 37 point one that’s not capable of playing the more important position. Twist it around all you like a we had a poster for quite a long time that could post a chart or a graph or an advanced stat that could make Martin Marincin look better than Drew Doughty - and if it’s a no all around then it’s a no all around, but the fact of the matter is, production matters.

Trading RNH for Ehlers would mean the end of McDavid and Drai being able to play together and doesn’t make us any deeper. It would be foolish of us to commit that much long term cap to a winger coming off a poor season by his standards.

 

[Guffman]

I’m saying RNH makes a lot of sense for the Jets. Ehlers, maybe not, but IMO Edmonton gets the worse player today if it should happen.

If you could turn Roslovic and spare parts into RNH you should be all over it but that’s not good for us.

Alright, let’s just agree on the following:

- RNH would be a nice acquisition for the Jets
- Trading Ehlers for RNH is completely stupid for the Jets to do at this juncture

Because of point 2, this thread is terrible. Moving on, right?

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Can anyone help me interpret these graphs? @ChaoticOrange maybe? You seem to have an understanding of the Oilers.

The second one from my understanding shows that RNH plays with RNH 100% of the time.

 

[DashingDane]

Lol so you looked and didn’t like what you saw then? “Let’s keep this on topic” and “what does this have to do with our player” is the classic refrain of someone that wants to slag our player all they want but don’t you dare cast OUR boy in a negative light.

I bring up Laine because values can change in a hurry. It wasn’t too long ago Oiler fans were being laughed at for suggesting Draisaitl-Laine swaps. Like it or not, Ehlers value has taken a hit. If it’s not a fit then that’s fine but there’s some monstrously awful underrating of RNH going on here, along with the classic “but McDavid” stupidity. Do none of Kyle Connor’s points count then? He had TWO really good linemates for most of the year!

Ehlers helps us a lot less today than RNH does, and we’re not trading a 69 point forward for a 37 point one that’s not capable of playing the more important position. Twist it around all you like a we had a poster for quite a long time that could post a chart or a graph or an advanced stat that could make Martin Marincin look better than Drew Doughty - and if it’s a no all around then it’s a no all around, but the fact of the matter is, production matters.

Trading RNH for Ehlers would mean the end of McDavid and Drai being able to play together and doesn’t make us any deeper. It would be foolish of us to commit that much long term cap to a winger coming off a poor season by his standards.

You keep posting stats without context... RNH had 10 pts more than Ehlers at 5v5 in 20 more games while playing a lot more minutes. You still haven't posted anything suggesting RNH is the better player outside a single season where Ehlers was injured with more points.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

You keep posting stats without context... RNH had 10 pts more than Ehlers at 5v5 in 20 more games while playing a lot more minutes. You still haven't posted anything suggesting RNH is the better player outside a single season where Ehlers was injured with more points.

Yes, I have, actually. RNH has a better career points per game (.71 to .66) and plays the more valuable position.