Worst Trade in the Doug Wilson Era

[Pinkfloyd]

His bad bad season (I assume his first) was negated by an incredible playoff run and a Stanley cup final. I absolutely believe Pavs would still be a shark if it weren’t for EK. Two different players he and Marleau.

Two different players but I don’t think DW not wanting to sign either to three years changes if Karlsson isn’t acquired.

 

[TheBeard]

Two different players but I don’t think DW not wanting to sign either to three years changes if Karlsson isn’t acquired.

I do. I thought it then and Pavs has shown it was the right move. Dude had more than half as many goals on the PP as the entire Sharks team did. It’s no coincidence the PP died when he left.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

I do. I thought it then and Pavs has shown it was the right move. Dude had more than half as many goals on the PP as the entire Sharks team did. It’s no coincidence the PP died when he left.

Pavs proving him wrong doesn’t change the reality that he still wouldn’t give him that 3rd year. Once DW sets his term, he’s not going to waver from it.

 

[TheBeard]

Pavs proving him wrong doesn’t change the reality that he still wouldn’t give him that 3rd year. Once DW sets his term, he’s not going to waver from it.

I know, but it doesn’t take Bob McKenzie to know the reason the team died wasn’t primarily Jones so much as it was removing Pavs and extending EK. Hindsight and all though so moot,

 

[tiburon12]

His bad bad season (I assume his first) was negated by an incredible playoff run and a Stanley cup final. I absolutely believe Pavs would still be a shark if it weren’t for EK. Two different players he and Marleau.

And that playoff run only happens because of a pandemic. Pavs was bad last season because he had no time to properly recover and train for the upcoming season. The shutdown provided him that time.

 

[OrrNumber4]

I mean, the right answer (in perfect hindsight) would have been to fold the tent in 2018. Don't re-sign Kane, don't go for Karlsson, and let go of Pavelski. Start the rebuild.

 

[CupfortheSharks]

I do. I thought it then and Pavs has shown it was the right move. Dude had more than half as many goals on the PP as the entire Sharks team did. It’s no coincidence the PP died when he left.

If it was either Pavelski or Karlsson, how do you explain DW offering Pavs a 2 year deal while signing Karlsson? I hate Karlsson, but he isn’t the reason Pavelski wasn’t signed.

 

[TheBeard]

And that playoff run only happens because of a pandemic. Pavs was bad last season because he had no time to properly recover and train for the upcoming season. The shutdown provided him that time.

I’m confused. Leading into that season there was no covid and hence it was a normal offseason. He just started slow and never found his groove.

 

[TheBeard]

If it was either Pavelski or Karlsson, how do you explain DW offering Pavs a 2 year deal while signing Karlsson? I hate Karlsson, but he isn’t the reason Pavelski wasn’t signed.

correct me if I’m wrong but the Pavs signing happened before Karlsson resigned, right? Would they have offered a third year had they already not had a deal with Karlsson in place?

 

[Pinkfloyd]

correct me if I’m wrong but the Pavs signing happened before Karlsson resigned, right? Would they have offered a third year had they already not had a deal with Karlsson in place?

Karlsson signed on June 17. Pavs signed July 1.

 

[TheBeard]

Karlsson signed on June 17. Pavs signed July 1.

Hence the correct me if I’m wrong. Lol.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Hence the correct me if I’m wrong. Lol.

No worries. Everything is a blur these days lol

 

[OrrNumber4]

If it was either Pavelski or Karlsson, how do you explain DW offering Pavs a 2 year deal while signing Karlsson? I hate Karlsson, but he isn’t the reason Pavelski wasn’t signed.

IIRC, it was a 2-year deal for 5 million/season. That's not a serious offer.

correct me if I’m wrong but the Pavs signing happened before Karlsson resigned, right? Would they have offered a third year had they already not had a deal with Karlsson in place?

Karlsson signing was pre-UFA period.

 

[tiburon12]

I’m confused. Leading into that season there was no covid and hence it was a normal offseason. He just started slow and never found his groove.

Yea, so Pavs had those two head injuries (Eakin + Pietrangelo) to recover from and definitely didn't have enough time to fully recover and train before the 19/20 season. He was pretty slow and lacked the dynamic, smart play he was known for. But, "the pause" gave him a good 4 months of recovery that he wouldn't have otherwise had.

Had the 19/20 season gone on uninterrupted, it would a be a long shot to assume Pavs would have replicated what he did in the Bubble.

 

[Pavelski2112]

IIRC, it was a 2-year deal for 5 million/season. That's not a serious offer.

It's the same thing they did with Marleau, and that ended up working out for them later on. 7mil/3yr is a lot to swallow for a guy who was about to turn 35.

 

[TheBeard]

Yea, so Pavs had those two head injuries (Eakin + Pietrangelo) to recover from and definitely didn't have enough time to fully recover and train before the 19/20 season. He was pretty slow and lacked the dynamic, smart play he was known for. But, "the pause" gave him a good 4 months of recovery that he wouldn't have otherwise had.

Had the 19/20 season gone on uninterrupted, it would a be a long shot to assume Pavs would have replicated what he did in the Bubble.

He was coming on strong at the end. He basically doubled his goal total in February (6) so he was finding his stride. I think the biggest detriment was that his game was largely contingent on chemistry. Point shots purposely wide for deflections etc. but I’ll concede that it probably did take some time to get acclimated and the injuries plus the late end to the season didn’t help.

 

[TheBeard]

It's the same thing they did with Marleau, and that ended up working out for them later on. 7mil/3yr is a lot to swallow for a guy who was about to turn 35.

The difference is that Marleau was already in a very clear decline where as Pavs was coming off his best season in terms of Goals Per Game.

 

[tiburon12]

He was coming on strong at the end. He basically doubled his goal total in February (6) so he was finding his stride. I think the biggest detriment was that his game was largely contingent on chemistry. Point shots purposely wide for deflections etc. but I’ll concede that it probably did take some time to get acclimated and the injuries plus the late end to the season didn’t help.

Yea but he ended the season with 1g 2a in his last 10.

Chemistry definitely plays a role, and the Dallas coaching change was a thing too. But he looked like a different player in the Bubble.

I really think the shutdown saved his season, and maybe his career. Does he have the season he did this year without all that extra time off to recover? I'm not so sure. Those head injuries were really bad

 

[TheBeard]

Yea but he ended the season with 1g 2a in his last 10.

Chemistry definitely plays a role, and the Dallas coaching change was a thing too. But he looked like a different player in the Bubble.

I really think the shutdown saved his season, and maybe his career. Does he have the season he did this year without all that extra time off to recover? I'm not so sure. Those head injuries were really bad

Considering he’d shown no signs of slowing down I chalked it up to just a rough transition to a team that was a defense-first one. This year proved that.

 

[Mr Fahrenheit]

Considering he’d shown no signs of slowing down I chalked it up to just a rough transition to a team that was a defense-first one. This year proved that.

Pavelski? No signs of slowing?

 

[TheBeard]

Pavelski? No signs of slowing?

Slowing down.

 

[DisbeliefInDW]

Yea no idea where the bad season logic came from lol. Him a Perry were the only reason they made it to the SCF. Even at the time Pavelski was a better bet for 3 years than EK at 8.

 

[DisbeliefInDW]

If it was either Pavelski or Karlsson, how do you explain DW offering Pavs a 2 year deal while signing Karlsson? I hate Karlsson, but he isn’t the reason Pavelski wasn’t signed.

He absolutely is. It was literally Karlsson or Pavelski. There was no scenario where both could've been here unless Doug moved out salary, which is the last thing he would've done. He wanted Karlsson more, so thats what he did. Simple as that.

 

[Pavelski2112]

Yea no idea where the bad season logic came from lol. Him a Perry were the only reason they made it to the SCF. Even at the time Pavelski was a better bet for 3 years than EK at 8.

On a much better team with far more talent. Khudobin was a huge part of that run as well. That said, Pavelski didn't have a great regular season by his standards; in fact, it was pretty much his worst since joining the league. Even Karlsson scored more than him in 10 less games.

I think there is merit to the idea that the break before the playoffs was good for him, but it was looking like signing Joe to that contract was a bad idea before then.

 

[DisbeliefInDW]

On a much better team with far more talent. Khudobin was a huge part of that run as well. That said, Pavelski didn't have a great regular season by his standards; in fact, it was pretty much his worst since joining the league. Even Karlsson scored more than him in 10 less games.

I think there is merit to the idea that the break before the playoffs was good for him, but it was looking like signing Joe to that contract was a bad idea before then.

Even then, worst case you ride out 3 (or 2 afterwards) hard seasons instead of 8(7). It was pretty clear cut that EK wasn't going to be more beneficial than Pavs was when the contracts were signed. Signing EK (also) made them have to let Nyquist/Donskoi go. Signing Karlsson (also) forced them to let both Nyquist/Donskoi go.