Player Discussion: Winnipeg Jets Defense

[GumbyCan2]

So is the narrative demelo is as good as Pionk or our best D?

Hope not! Not dissing on Demelo, per se but...Pionk is clearly our leading Dman.

 

[Heldig]

So, any ideas what broke Morrissey?

Injuries? He always looks hurt. Or was it that Buff and Trouba made him look a lot better than he is?

 

[Whileee]

So, any ideas what broke Morrissey?

Injuries? He always looks hurt. Or was it that Buff and Trouba made him look a lot better than he is?

Well, right now playing RD with Beaulieu is probably driving him crazy.

 

[VictoriaJetsFan]

I can't see how any defenceman in the world does not look worse after going from Trouba/Buff to Beaulieu....

 

[Jets4Life]

Beaulieu is going to give me a heart attack before the end of the season. Please place him on the taxi squad, and being up either Stanley, Heinola, or Samberg.

 

[JetsFan815]

Whatever DeMelo did to get into the doghouse must be really bad if PoMo is still sticking with BooBoo as Morrissey's d partner after these last 2 games.

 

[WolfHouse]

Crazy how every game Beaulieu plays on our top pairing we are gemmed in to our own end all game - just gives the other team momentum and fks the rest of our D

Toronto won’t be kind to this D lineup

 

[10Ducky10]

JMo DD 24 minutes
Forbort Poink 24 minutes
Stan the Man Poolman/Niku 12 minutes

 

[voyageur]

Well, right now playing RD with Beaulieu is probably driving him crazy.

To be fair Morrissey hasn't looked good with De Melo or Poolman either this year.

The only thing I can be thinking is that we are riding Beaulieu as a place holder for a trade.

Maybe we trade for a half retained David Savard, which approaching the halfway point quickly, would only cost about $1 million, who has worse advanced stats, and a worse PK ratio, but is 25 lbs heavier. That's a buy low, like maybe returning our 3rd round pick, obtained for Roslovic.

I also wouldn't mind seeing Niku move up with Morrissey, since he's probably the most comfortable of all of our d-men playing his offside, and there's a chance that you could turn this pairing into a dual layered attack, with each d-man able to join the rush. At least for the homestand.

If we're winning with a $1.25 million defenseman in our top pairing, we're a lot better off than teams that are paying $3.5 million for a top pairing d-man, such as Benny, and getting worse special teams results out of him. Because we can improve at the position, at a fraction of the cost. It's just a matter of timing.

 

[Hulide]

Whatever DeMelo did to get into the doghouse must be really bad if PoMo is still sticking with BooBoo as Morrissey's d partner after these last 2 games.

Dont get kids!!!!

 

[puck stoppa]

To be fair Morrissey hasn't looked good with De Melo or Poolman either this year.

The only thing I can be thinking is that we are riding Beaulieu as a place holder for a trade.

Maybe we trade for a half retained David Savard, which approaching the halfway point quickly, would only cost about $1 million, who has worse advanced stats, and a worse PK ratio, but is 25 lbs heavier. That's a buy low, like maybe returning our 3rd round pick, obtained for Roslovic.

I also wouldn't mind seeing Niku move up with Morrissey, since he's probably the most comfortable of all of our d-men playing his offside, and there's a chance that you could turn this pairing into a dual layered attack, with each d-man able to join the rush. At least for the homestand.

If we're winning with a $1.25 million defenseman in our top pairing, we're a lot better off than teams that are paying $3.5 million for a top pairing d-man, such as Benny, and getting worse special teams results out of him. Because we can improve at the position, at a fraction of the cost. It's just a matter of timing.

Morrisseys best game was with Heinola, a smart puck mover. The one thing that’s different for me is that his skating always looked effortless and now it’s not, did he put on too much muscle during the long off season again?

 

[lanky]

Whatever DeMelo did to get into the doghouse must be really bad if PoMo is still sticking with BooBoo as Morrissey's d partner after these last 2 games.

I don't think he's in the dog house. I think that since the Flames tossed us around last summer Maurice has been obsessed with pairing a big guy with JMo. Poolman has filled that role pretty well but between covid and this injury, he hasn't been in the lineup enough.

Forbort-Pionk is another big-little pair that has thankfully worked out really well.

 

[DRW204]

So, any ideas what broke Morrissey?

Injuries? He always looks hurt. Or was it that Buff and Trouba made him look a lot better than he is?

trouba and him had a innate chemistry that we are missing. also the whole team played better defensively in 17-18

id like to see

Morrissey-Demelo
Forbort-Pionk
Stanley-Poolman

if no heinola or samberg

didn't have a chance to watch the last 2 games, but not surprised niku is the worst dman in shot attempt differential. even worse than Beaulieu.

 

[bob77]

So Drew Doughty wins the Norris in 2015-16 with Muzzin as his partner. Derek Forbort plays 14 Kings games in first half of season on the 3rd pair, and then spends the entire second half in minors.

In 2016-17, Drew begins the season with McNabb as his partner, and then McNabb breaks his collarbone around game 9 or so. Sutter moves Forbort from 3rd pair to 1st and plays there the rest of the season, even after McNabb returns. At season end the Kings protect Forbort not McNabb.

In 2017-18, Forbort and Doughty are paired the whole season and make the playoffs only to lose to McNabb Knights. Forbort is injured and misses the series. Doughty this year had what many people consider his best year ever, 10 g 50 assists, and plus 23. The Kings also lead the league in PK with Forbort on number 1 unit.

Forbort has spent most of his career on a top pairing, and you can number the current pairs anyway you like, but Pionk and Forbort are the top pairing. Also, Forbort has spent far more minutes than any of our other D defending the leagues top forwards.
So when all of a sudden Pionk is having his best year ever, it should not be a complete surprise that it also involves Forbort. For D like Doughty, Pionk, etc. Forbort is somewhat of a stabilizing force for them to play with. Forbort is more than content to defer other aspects of the game to these players, like offense and breakout decisions. Forbort is like the guy in basketball who always gives the ball back to the point guard to run the offense. Besides he’s no good at it anyway. What makes him different than your average partner a guy like Pionk or Doughty could be stuck with is that Forbort knows he sucks at it. He tries to play within himself. In that light, both Pionk and Forbort bring something different to the table, and their chemistry seems to be working well. IMO.

 

[DRW204]

So Drew Doughty wins the Norris in 2015-16 with Muzzin as his partner. Derek Forbort plays 14 Kings games in first half of season on the 3rd pair, and then spends the entire second half in minors.

In 2016-17, Drew begins the season with McNabb as his partner, and then McNabb breaks his collarbone around game 9 or so. Sutter moves Forbort from 3rd pair to 1st and plays there the rest of the season, even after McNabb returns. At season end the Kings protect Forbort not McNabb.

In 2017-18, Forbort and Doughty are paired the whole season and make the playoffs only to lose to McNabb Knights. Forbort is injured and misses the series. Doughty this year had what many people consider his best year ever, 10 g 50 assists, and plus 23. The Kings also lead the league in PK with Forbort on number 1 unit.

Forbort has spent most of his career on a top pairing, and you can number the current pairs anyway you like, but Pionk and Forbort are the top pairing. Also, Forbort has spent far more minutes than any of our other D defending the leagues top forwards.
So when all of a sudden Pionk is having his best year ever, it should not be a complete surprise that it also involves Forbort. For D like Doughty, Pionk, etc. Forbort is somewhat of a stabilizing force for them to play with. Forbort is more than content to defer other aspects of the game to these players, like offense and breakout decisions. Forbort is like the guy in basketball who always gives the ball back to the point guard to run the offense. Besides he’s no good at it anyway. What makes him different than your average partner a guy like Pionk or Doughty could be stuck with is that Forbort knows he sucks at it. He tries to play within himself. In that light, both Pionk and Forbort bring something different to the table, and their chemistry seems to be working well. IMO.

i remember thinking about Forbort as a trade target years ago. analytics guys argued he was carried by doughty..... how's doughty been w/o him now (but for real...)

 

[garret9]

To be fair Morrissey hasn't looked good with De Melo or Poolman either this year.

The only thing I can be thinking is that we are riding Beaulieu as a place holder for a trade.

Maybe we trade for a half retained David Savard, which approaching the halfway point quickly, would only cost about $1 million, who has worse advanced stats, and a worse PK ratio, but is 25 lbs heavier. That's a buy low, like maybe returning our 3rd round pick, obtained for Roslovic.

I also wouldn't mind seeing Niku move up with Morrissey, since he's probably the most comfortable of all of our d-men playing his offside, and there's a chance that you could turn this pairing into a dual layered attack, with each d-man able to join the rush. At least for the homestand.

If we're winning with a $1.25 million defenseman in our top pairing, we're a lot better off than teams that are paying $3.5 million for a top pairing d-man, such as Benny, and getting worse special teams results out of him. Because we can improve at the position, at a fraction of the cost. It's just a matter of timing.

Jets best Corsi% as a pair so far this season with more than 10 mins played together:

Morrissey-DeMelo @ 53%

I won't read too much into xG or at all at goal differential at such extremely small samples

 

[garret9]

i remember thinking about Forbort as a trade target years ago. analytics guys argued he was carried by doughty..... how's doughty been w/o him now (but for real...)

I'm doubtful analytics guys argued he's carried by Doughty since most analytics guys argue that Doughty has been slightly overrated in his good years, and has straight up not even trying in his bad years but running of reputation.

 

[Duke749]

Whatever DeMelo did to get into the doghouse must be really bad if PoMo is still sticking with BooBoo as Morrissey's d partner after these last 2 games.

As bad as Morrissey and Booboo is, i wouldn’t dare run Booboo and Niku together. Right NOW Demelo is likely there to help with Niku.

 

[DRW204]

I'm doubtful analytics guys argued he's carried by Doughty since most analytics guys argue that Doughty hasn't been slightly overrated in his good years, and has straight up not even trying in his bad years but running of reputation.

assuming you mean has been slightly overrated?

idk iirc was bringing up forbort and ppl arguing brendan smith cuz he had better fancier stats (think this was 2017?). it was a few years ago so memory is a bit hazy haha

anyway, forbort has been great for his cost this year.

As bad as Morrissey and Booboo is, i wouldn’t dare run Booboo and Niku together. Right NOW Demelo is likely there to help with Niku.

demelo can't do anything with that anchor. we need stanley and heinola in for niku and beau. unfortunately, think it's a business decision heinola is not on the nhl roster.

if that's the case, put demelo with Morrissey, get stanley-poolman 3rd pair. we can't keep trotting beaulieu out there. just can't.

 

[MardyBum]

So, any ideas what broke Morrissey?

Injuries? He always looks hurt. Or was it that Buff and Trouba made him look a lot better than he is?

He needs a healthy dose of Demelo or call up Samberg/Heinola and yolo.

So maybe next year he can be fixed. Maybe.

 

[voyageur]

assuming you mean has been slightly overrated?

idk iirc was bringing up forbort and ppl arguing brendan smith cuz he had better fancier stats (think this was 2017?). it was a few years ago so memory is a bit hazy haha

anyway, forbort has been great for his cost this year.


demelo can't do anything with that anchor. we need stanley and heinola in for niku and beau. unfortunately, think it's a business decision heinola is not on the nhl roster.

if that's the case, put demelo with Morrissey, get stanley-poolman 3rd pair. we can't keep trotting beaulieu out there. just can't.

I think we can start to run 7 d-men and move some of our ELC d-men around, once Chevy waives Forsberg, and creates that roster space.

To date we've been able to match every team in the division, I think Edmonton has proven to be our most even matchup, with the defense we have. To get past Edmonton and Toronto we're going to need some help though.

If we go with the current roster, we'll definitely need Beaulieu for the PK, because Toronto in particular is shredding teams with their PP, and Edmonton looks like a dangerous PP team too.

I think the answer still lies in running 7 d-men, around Morrissey-Pionk-De Melo on different pairs, and sliding players in and out, though Forbort-Pionk seem the safest pairing we have. Add Heinola to the mix, and I think we'll have a positive 5 on 5 impact, but we need to maintain good special teams to get to the top. Unfortunately as no one internally seems poised to replace Boo Boo, though maybe Poolman can if he gets healthy, and that's not really a rookie job, when the end game of a shortened season is points, the Jets may have to look elsewhere if they want to replace Beaulieu in the lineup.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I think we can start to run 7 d-men and move some of our ELC d-men around, once Chevy waives Forsberg, and creates that roster space.

To date we've been able to match every team in the division, I think Edmonton has proven to be our most even matchup, with the defense we have. To get past Edmonton and Toronto we're going to need some help though.

If we go with the current roster, we'll definitely need Beaulieu for the PK, because Toronto in particular is shredding teams with their PP, and Edmonton looks like a dangerous PP team too.

I think the answer still lies in running 7 d-men, around Morrissey-Pionk-De Melo on different pairs, and sliding players in and out, though Forbort-Pionk seem the safest pairing we have. Add Heinola to the mix, and I think we'll have a positive 5 on 5 impact, but we need to maintain good special teams to get to the top. Unfortunately as no one internally seems poised to replace Boo Boo, though maybe Poolman can if he gets healthy, and that's not really a rookie job, when the end game of a shortened season is points, the Jets may have to look elsewhere if they want to replace Beaulieu in the lineup.

I'd rather run 3 forwards and one D on our pk than having beaulieu in the line up.

 

[DRW204]

I'm not sure what your infatuation is with Beaulieu and his pk abilities and what it stems from. What on ice measures show he's proficient at pk and irreplaceable ? I really don't see anything all that special relative to the rest of the team.

I think we can start to run 7 d-men and move some of our ELC d-men around, once Chevy waives Forsberg, and creates that roster space.

To date we've been able to match every team in the division, I think Edmonton has proven to be our most even matchup, with the defense we have. To get past Edmonton and Toronto we're going to need some help though.

If we go with the current roster, we'll definitely need Beaulieu for the PK, because Toronto in particular is shredding teams with their PP, and Edmonton looks like a dangerous PP team too.

I think the answer still lies in running 7 d-men, around Morrissey-Pionk-De Melo on different pairs, and sliding players in and out, though Forbort-Pionk seem the safest pairing we have. Add Heinola to the mix, and I think we'll have a positive 5 on 5 impact, but we need to maintain good special teams to get to the top. Unfortunately as no one internally seems poised to replace Boo Boo, though maybe Poolman can if he gets healthy, and that's not really a rookie job, when the end game of a shortened season is points, the Jets may have to look elsewhere if they want to replace Beaulieu in the lineup.

 

[Ducky10]

Boo Boo played 24 minutes.....

 

[FeatherHead]

If this team had even one true stud d-man, they’d be scary. If they had a top 2 that was defensively what their top 3 are offensively, they’d be a prohibitive favorite to win the cup.

I think they have what it takes to get out of the division. But once it boils down to Tampa, Vegas, and Boston...going to be some tough sledding.