Speculation: Will Butcher

Jason MacIsaac · Jan 7, 2021

With Vatanen signing and Smith, Okhotiuk and Bahl all looking quite good in camp I believe there is little need for Butcher moving forward. Not sure NJ will get much given his poor year but I expect he is getting shopped as we speak. If there a comparable forward who could be moved for Butcher? Likely a change of scenery type trade.

Mrfenn92 · Jan 7, 2021

Think it might be worth just keeping him.
If the season goes bad record wise the devils have some contract year d-men that can be moved out.
Maybe a forward that makes around the same and isn’t doing to well.

Brodeur · Jan 7, 2021

Zippy316 · Jan 7, 2021

It's going to be really hard to get trades done right now, but with Hischier's injury and Bratt missing the start of the year without a contract right now, it might not be a bad idea to flip him for forward help.

If Crawford's personal break from the Devils right now ends up with him retiring, then perhaps the Devils might trade him for a reliable goaltender. Fleury is the first name that comes to mind here, I would imagine Vegas might be very keen to move his cap hit.

Devils can likely get better value for Butcher than a goaltender, but they can't afford overplaying Blackwood and ruining his development. They might just end up taking what they can get at this point.

Khelandros · Jan 7, 2021

One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

goonybird · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

Butcher was rejected by Colorado, not the other way around

"Mike: Where did the Avs go wrong? They approached the player’s agent during his junior season at DU and said the team (Patrick Roy) had no interest in signing him."

Where did the Avalanche go wrong with Will Butcher?

Khelandros · Jan 7, 2021

goonybird said:
Butcher was rejected by Colorado, not the other way around

"Mike: Where did the Avs go wrong? They approached the player’s agent during his junior season at DU and said the team (Patrick Roy) had no interest in signing him."

Where did the Avalanche go wrong with Will Butcher?

Butcher rejects Avs to become free agent

DropTheGloves · Jan 7, 2021

Zippy316 said:
It's going to be really hard to get trades done right now, but with Hischier's injury and Bratt missing the start of the year without a contract right now, it might not be a bad idea to flip him for forward help

Bah gawd is that Alex Chiasson’s music?!

No but really, Holland has been rumoured to be looking at flipping him for an LD all off-season with Klefbom out. I know the value isn’t great but it addresses a need for both teams.

goonybird · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
Butcher rejects Avs to become free agent

because they told him to get f***ed. maybe don't do that and come begging a year later. Chances were they just wanted his rights locked in to move him

This is so far from a Vesey, Wheeler (who was successful in Boston), Kerfoot (who was successful in Colorado), Hayes (who was successful in NY), etc. situation

HBK27 · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

In Butcher's defense though, didn't he want to sign with Colorado after his junior season but they didn't offer him a contract? I thought it was more a matter of him being frustrated that the Avalanche seemingly didn't want to sign him until after his senior year versus him looking for a better landing spot for an NHL future.

As far as not succeeding with the team he chose, Butcher had a phenomenal rookie season scoring 44 points in 81 games and helping NJ make their only playoff appearance since 2012. He also signed a 3 year, $11.2M contract prior to the start of last season so I'd say he's doing alright.

Zippy316 · Jan 7, 2021

DropTheGloves said:
Bah gawd is that Alex Chiasson’s music?!

No but really, Holland has been rumoured to be looking at flipping him for an LD all off-season with Klefbom out. I know the value isn’t great but it addresses a need for both teams.

Don’t really have too much interest in Chiasson but that looks like it could be a good fit for Butcher. He needs a defensive partner which Edmonton can give him with Larsson or Russell.

I would probably ask for Khiara personally as he fills more of a need than Chiasson.

Brodeur · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

Shrug, Butcher has done well enough for the Devils and landed a nice paycheck on his second contract. Blake Wheeler's had a decent enough career, I'm not sure you can discount that because he broke out after being traded from Boston. Kevin Hayes played well enough for the Rangers. New Jersey got Butcher that summer but also were on the other end of the equation with Alex Kerfoot who's done fine for himself.

Realistically the number of players that choose this route is pretty limited, hence they get an inordinate amount of focus in mid-August. Other guys use the leverage (Adam Fox, John Marino, Zack Hyman recently) to force the team to trade their rights. Fox in particular seemed like he more or less picked his location and he did pretty well.

Not sure why the expectation is raised like they need to lift multiple Cups, become perennial All-Stars, and win awards to "succeed." I personally don't like it when players opt for that route (the Devils had one of the first cases with Mike Van Ryn in 2000), but from the player's perspective it could be the difference between making 925K in the NHL versus 70K in the minors which would cascade to their next contract.

Dr Quincy · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

I'm trying to grasp the logic here.

So you think that their exercising their right has somehow caused a rip in the space time continuum that somehow causes a disturbance in the force, thus 3 or 4 years after success of some degree on one team they get dealt or are on the block?

I mean, is there some secret connection there that you are aware of that I'm not seeing? You do realize that most players, however they get to the NHL,

a) have short careers
b) change teams
c) are constantly at risk of losing their jobs

Mrfenn92 · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

Not a fan of college free agency either.
But Kevin Hayes made a nice career of it.
Probably cost him a cup but made some good money and developed into a good player.
Not a lot of guys go this route either.
And it’s legal with the cba.

DropTheGloves · Jan 7, 2021

Zippy316 said:
Don’t really have too much interest in Chiasson but that looks like it could be a good fit for Butcher. He needs a defensive partner which Edmonton can give him with Larsson or Russell.

I would probably ask for Khiara personally as he fills more of a need than Chiasson.

You can have both. Actually is cap neutral for Edmonton then.

Zippy316 · Jan 7, 2021

DropTheGloves said:
You can have both. Actually is cap neutral for Edmonton then.

Devils don’t really have space for both. They’d just be taking up roster spots that can go to a younger player. Khiara at least brings a game the Devils could use as a physical fourth liner who can play PK and chip in occasionally.

A little difficult cap wise for the Oilers admittedly but I don’t see the Devils being willing to take both.

cwede · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

Mrfenn92 said:
Not a fan of college free agency either. But Kevin Hayes made a nice career of it. Probably cost him a cup but made some good money and developed into a good player. Not a lot of guys go this route either. And it’s legal with the cba.

this topic, railing against the small handful of NCAA players who were drafted, and reach Aug 15 after their class graduates unsigned, always amuses me.

Every year there are even more Canadian Major Junior players who, either at their or team discretion, go unsigned 2 years post-draft. are re-draft eligible, but that rarely happens, and become UFA at age 20

but to Kh's point, it often goes sideways,
i was expecting D-man Luke Martin, 2017 #52overall, to sign an ELC, after 4 years at Mich and spurning Canes
- and he, only very recently, signed just an ECHL contract...

anyway, Hayes and Benning are among the recent examples I would cite as having been pretty successful - Hayes had earned #2C status w NYR, but was a Cap casualty
(Blake Wheeler was first drafted post-NCAA UFA I recall, but he, and Justin Schultz, were not exactly same situation, they withdrew from school)

Mrfenn92 · Jan 7, 2021

cwede said:
this topic, railing against the small handful of NCAA players who were drafted, and reach Aug 15 after their class graduates unsigned, always amuses me.

Every year there are even more Canadian Major Junior players who, either at their or team discretion, go unsigned 2 years post-draft. are re-draft eligible, but that rarely happens, and become UFA at age 20

but to Kh's point, it often goes sideways,
i was expecting Luke Martin, 2017 %52overall, to sign an ELC, after 4 years at Mich and spurning Canes
- and he, only very recently, signed just an ECHL contract...

anyway, Hayes and Benning are among the recent examples I would cite as having been pretty successful - Hayes had earned #2C status w NYR, but was a Cap casualty
(Blake Wheeler was first drafted post-NCAA UFA I recall, and, but he, and Justin Schultz, were not exactly same situation, they withdrew from school)

That’s why I bought up Hayes. He exercised his right under the cba.

SteveCangialosi123 · Jan 7, 2021

If we’re not getting a top 6 forward, I’d rather just keep him. A non-1st round pick wouldn’t do it for me.

Vitto79 · Jan 7, 2021

The devils have 5 ufa D
No reason not to keep Butcher who has 2 left
Still young let him play

DropTheGloves · Jan 7, 2021

Zippy316 said:
Devils don’t really have space for both. They’d just be taking up roster spots that can go to a younger player. Khiara at least brings a game the Devils could use as a physical fourth liner who can play PK and chip in occasionally.

A little difficult cap wise for the Oilers admittedly but I don’t see the Devils being willing to take both.

The Oilers can squeeze him in due to Klefbom being on LTIR but it would've been nice to bank that space is all. Khaira for Butcher is a good deal for Edmonton and they should take it if it's ever really on the table.

SJinNewJersey · Jan 7, 2021

Vitto79 said:
The devils have 5 ufa D
No reason not to keep Butcher who has 2 left
Still young let him play

We don't really count Tennis ball as one of them.

hidek91 · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

As others pointed out, Butcher has literally become millionaire due to signing with a team that had (and still has) bad defence. And he did it with below average skating, no physicality and meh shot. He's a smart player but on most teams he would be buried in AHL and would have to live off 2-way contracts.

Atoyot · Jan 7, 2021

Khelandros said:
One of these days, these College "free agents" will realize that forgoing the team that drafted you to pick your location has worked for a grand total of 0 players that have done it. I can't think of a single player that has succeeded with the team they chose.

Blake Wheeler? Adam Fox?

Also are you suggesting that they would have had more success if they hadn't? Odds are they'd just be same player they always were just on their original team.

Bankers Box · Jan 7, 2021

hidek91 said:
As others pointed out, Butcher has literally become millionaire due to signing with a team that had (and still has) bad defence. And he did it with below average skating, no physicality and meh shot. He's a smart player but on most teams he would be buried in AHL and would have to live off 2-way contracts.

Too many posters on this board are delusional. Butcher made the right decision and it worked out amazingly for him. He got himself a nice contract in the NHL and will probably end up with another ok contract after this.

Reminds me of the angry Canadian fan who said that Zegras was "gonna get his" lol. Gonna get what? A fat NHL contract and millions of dollars?

Speculation: Will Butcher

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