Why have the Devils always struggled with attendance?
- Thread starter Hockeyholic
- Start date
There are many factors.
What hurts them the most is the perception that downtown Newark is unsafe and that has scared off many fans from wealthier suburbs who went to the Meadowlands.
What hurts them the most is the perception that downtown Newark is unsafe and that has scared off many fans from wealthier suburbs who went to the Meadowlands.
Location location location. The biggest problem with them was where they put the team, in North Jersey especially Bergen County (where they were located when they were winning the cups) is a RANGERS stronghold as is most of North Jersey and alot of central nj. This along with the Meadowlands being located off the ever congested NJ Turnpike , Route 3 and Route 21 also didn't help either. Getting to games by public transit at the time was basically non existent as no trains go to the Meadowlands and going by bus was just as bad as by car. The name New Jersey didn't really help either as its not a big market name like New York, Philadelphia,Boston etc etc etc. Since they've moved to Newark its gotten a bit better as the area has been revitalized along with the Ironbound(Portuguese) neighborhood being close by with lots of good restaurants and bars, and a major rail hub right next to the arena. However the teams on ice product has dwindled until this season.
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BigBadBruins7708
Registered User
because in sports, NY and Philly pro teams basically own NJ
Rangers had a 60 year head start on them
Philly had a 15 year head start, and had already had an iconic run with the late 70s Broad Street Bullies.
Same reason why Hartford failed. You cant compete in CT against the NY and Boston teams. The state is already decided and isnt going to drop decades of supporting teams for a new local franchise
Hockeyholic
Registered User
Many fans didn't go to the Meadowlands either. Obviously, others have pointed out reasons why.
It's certainly a crowded marketplace. To some degree, Anaheim is similar in that they've been competitive for the last decade but don't draw as well as they should. Even though they've been in the league for nearly 25 years, they're maybe just now getting a generation of fans who grew up with them and have expendable cash.
Growing up in southern California, the Ducks were a bit of stepchild when they came into the league; The Disney connection didn't help either. I can imagine the number of Kings fans who lived in Orange County who weren't going to change their allegiance. The start of the Devils franchise was before my time, but they relocated to New Jersey right in the midst of the Islanders dynasty as well.
As for the boring label with the Devils, they were an offensive powerhouse during the Arnott years. At least for me, those teams were fun to watch. In Moneyball, there's an excerpt where Oakland's ticket sales correlated more with winning more than other factors. I'd be curious if that principle held the same for hockey.
Big Phil
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Yes, location is a factor. Ask Ottawa. Whoever thought building a hockey arena out in the boonies away from downtown Ottawa was NOT a genius.
As for Jersey, there are other factors too. Just for starters here are some Devils' stats:
- Never had a 100 point scorer
- Franchise leader in assists in a season is Scott Stevens, with 60
You are probably getting the point here. The Devils weren't just boring to watch when they were winning Cups, they never have had that easy to attract player the fans wanted to see. Go back to 1983 when they were born, think of a time the Devils were fun to watch. I can't. Obviously great teams when they won, that were built around Brodeur and the defense with Stevens being the crown jewel. But even Niedermayer had handcuffs on him in Jersey and you never really got to see him fly. There was a "scoring by committee" forward corps since, well, always.
Maybe if Kovalchuk had stuck around there would have been some excitement about this team but there isn't. Perhaps going forward Hall can change this.
As for Jersey, there are other factors too. Just for starters here are some Devils' stats:
- Never had a 100 point scorer
- Franchise leader in assists in a season is Scott Stevens, with 60
You are probably getting the point here. The Devils weren't just boring to watch when they were winning Cups, they never have had that easy to attract player the fans wanted to see. Go back to 1983 when they were born, think of a time the Devils were fun to watch. I can't. Obviously great teams when they won, that were built around Brodeur and the defense with Stevens being the crown jewel. But even Niedermayer had handcuffs on him in Jersey and you never really got to see him fly. There was a "scoring by committee" forward corps since, well, always.
Maybe if Kovalchuk had stuck around there would have been some excitement about this team but there isn't. Perhaps going forward Hall can change this.
vadim sharifijanov
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- Oct 10, 2007
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i'm not urban planner, but it must be more than a coincidence that the attendance disasters of phoenix, florida, and now ottawa are all because some rich guys teamed up with a bunch of scummy developers to try to turn some podunk suburb into a new metro area.
new jersey (and for that matter long island/brooklyn) is probably a more complicated situation because of the weird geography of greater new york. but i remember one time i was on the turnpike, lost of course, and saw the meadowlands exit and thought to myself, man i can't imagine being a season ticket holder and driving to games here.
new jersey (and for that matter long island/brooklyn) is probably a more complicated situation because of the weird geography of greater new york. but i remember one time i was on the turnpike, lost of course, and saw the meadowlands exit and thought to myself, man i can't imagine being a season ticket holder and driving to games here.
McGarnagle
Yes.
- Aug 5, 2017
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The offensive ability of the 90s Devils is underrated. Richer was legit, they had a young Bill Guerin, eventually they had Mogilny, and by the time Arnott and Gomez were out there they could hang with other teams.
Plus, local fans support their team whether they play defensive or offensive hockey as long as they win.
The simple answer to this is 1. Meadowlands and 2. Market overlap.
North Jersey was already Rangers territory when they moved in, plus the Isles weren't too far away and were at their peak. Loyalties were divided there. The Meadowlands are not near any organic center of population. It was just an open space off the Turnpike. In my limited experience driving through NJ, traffic up there can really suck - especially around the time of day you'd be going to a weekday game.
Newark is likely way better for them, though they have had some down years since moving there, aside from the 2012 run.
Plus, local fans support their team whether they play defensive or offensive hockey as long as they win.
The simple answer to this is 1. Meadowlands and 2. Market overlap.
North Jersey was already Rangers territory when they moved in, plus the Isles weren't too far away and were at their peak. Loyalties were divided there. The Meadowlands are not near any organic center of population. It was just an open space off the Turnpike. In my limited experience driving through NJ, traffic up there can really suck - especially around the time of day you'd be going to a weekday game.
Newark is likely way better for them, though they have had some down years since moving there, aside from the 2012 run.
vadim sharifijanov
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LeafsNation75
Registered User
It's funny how you mention all that because I remember when I was in New York City on vacation in May 2003, I was at the Empire State Building and I remember seeing the Meadowlands from way up there.
Devils Dominion
Now we Plummet
They drew over 17k for at least one season in the Meadowlands, which was a huge 19k arena and made crowds of 15-16k look smaller than they were.
I believe attendance is around 90% capacity this season and their tickets prices are quite high so they gross a lot more revenue than teams in other markets that draw more fans.
I believe attendance is around 90% capacity this season and their tickets prices are quite high so they gross a lot more revenue than teams in other markets that draw more fans.
Devils Dominion
Now we Plummet
While that may have been true in 2007/2009 it is no longer an issue for the masses in NJ.
Prudential Center is one of the busiest arenas in the country and people from all over Jersey, including the wealthier suburbs where I reside, go to The Rock for Devils games and a host of other varying shows and concerts without hesitation because it's proven to be a very safe area on event nights (or even just during the day since it's in the central business district),
It's really a non-issue aside from a small amount of paranoid folks who won't go to any big city.
Plus, lots of big developer money is on its way and the area is getting better by the year.
Iron Mike Sharpe
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- Dec 6, 2017
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I always had the impression that the Devils had a very rabid fan base.
The Meadowlands location was picked partly because of easy access to Westchester County, NY where many of the Giants season ticket holders are from.
PATH, NJ Jersey Transit, and Amtrak are only 2 blocks away.
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
Its a shame that the team started to stink right as they finally moved to the new arena.
NJ also has a cultural thing where some suburbanites avoid urban areas like the plague, which counteracts some of the benefits of the new (IMO much better) location in Newark.
NJ also has a cultural thing where some suburbanites avoid urban areas like the plague, which counteracts some of the benefits of the new (IMO much better) location in Newark.
agentblack
Registered User
I remember watching this and i guess they acutally used game 1 as a reference point which i never saw cause the 94 cup run was before my time as a fan. When NHL vault (RIP) became available they had the whole series and i watched gm 1 and im like "oh hey that was in Seinfeld"
Better Call Sal
Salnalysis
It most definitely had a lot to do with market saturation at least initially. Came to NJ right in the middle of the Islander dynasty and in an area that was predominantly Ranger fans. The team going through the Mickey Mouse era as well was not exactly helpful towards bringing fans in initially.
I think that the Devils' overall fanbase is on the younger side because it likely started to grow during the dynasty eras. Now, that group of fans who grew up watching them during their best years are in their 20s-30s and have the disposable income to make it out to games and the benefit of public transportation, so once the team gets back on track I think you'll see more frequent sellouts.
Average capacity this year was around 92% and the games had great crowds during the lead up to clinching the playoffs, with the home playoff game crowds being the most vibrant in quite some time. Yes, attendance is not perfect but the team is perfectly fine when it comes to their crowds and I think it'll continue improving with the current state of the team.
I think that the Devils' overall fanbase is on the younger side because it likely started to grow during the dynasty eras. Now, that group of fans who grew up watching them during their best years are in their 20s-30s and have the disposable income to make it out to games and the benefit of public transportation, so once the team gets back on track I think you'll see more frequent sellouts.
Average capacity this year was around 92% and the games had great crowds during the lead up to clinching the playoffs, with the home playoff game crowds being the most vibrant in quite some time. Yes, attendance is not perfect but the team is perfectly fine when it comes to their crowds and I think it'll continue improving with the current state of the team.
Jim MacDonald
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As I'm reading all these I'm wondering if the Devils home games in the 94 conference finals felt more like road games? Wondering if the crowd was like 50/50 split on Rangers fans and Devils fans? Man that would suck as a Devils player 
vadim sharifijanov
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- Oct 10, 2007
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As I'm reading all these I'm wondering if the Devils home games in the 94 conference finals felt more like road games? Wondering if the crowd was like 50/50 split on Rangers fans and Devils fans? Man that would suck as a Devils player
bruce driver, john maclean, bobby holik all signed with the rangers when they became UFAs. coincidence?
EpochLink
Canucks and Jets fan
I thought the location was a little strange.
When I think of East Rutherford, New Jersey back in the day I always thought of Giants Stadium first and foremost.
I didn't understand it when I was a kid until I learned years later why the Giants/Jets played there.
When I think of East Rutherford, New Jersey back in the day I always thought of Giants Stadium first and foremost.
I didn't understand it when I was a kid until I learned years later why the Giants/Jets played there.
YEM
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I'm a Flyers fan but I love the Devils arena and location
my fav in the entire Northeast, easy to get to, great public transportation options a few seconds away, and they've really seen some great buildup around the arena area [dinosaur BBQ]
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
You're talking about their new arena of course. Back when the team was winning championships, their arena was in an area very poorly served by public transportation, with no restaurants or anything else walking distance.
The Meadowlands (or as I affectionately refer to it - the toxic swamp) was catered almost exclusively to the "drive in - park - watch game - drive home" crowd.
