Why Gilbert over Beaulieu?
- Thread starter Schwang
- Start date
Bourne Endeavor
Registered User
Gilbert has been inconsistent, but I wouldn't pull him out of the lineup. Allen is the problem now, not that I think Therrien will ever do anything about it.
optimus2861
Registered User
The question is not, "Why Gilbert over Beaulieu?"
The question is, "Why Allen over anybody?" Allen is damn near as bad as Murray was, so far at least, and is in no way worth sitting our two prospects every night.
Weaver hasn't been much good this season either, and should be sitting at least 1 of every 3 games.
It's absolute madness that in the second game in back-to-back nights, Therrien dresses every one of our old fossils and lets the young guys rot.
Bergevin needs to address this sooner rather than later.
The question is, "Why Allen over anybody?" Allen is damn near as bad as Murray was, so far at least, and is in no way worth sitting our two prospects every night.
Weaver hasn't been much good this season either, and should be sitting at least 1 of every 3 games.
It's absolute madness that in the second game in back-to-back nights, Therrien dresses every one of our old fossils and lets the young guys rot.
Bergevin needs to address this sooner rather than later.
Markov4Captain
Registered User
All this organization has ever done with Beaulieu and Tinordi is shatter their confidence. Both guys have their fair share of blame to be responsible for but MT has treated them pretty badly.
Last year Tinordi makes one gaffe against Columbus that costs us the game. I don't think he ever played after that. Beaulieu makes one gaffe after the Penguins' game. Idk if he'll ever see the ice in MTL ever again. The best thing that could happen to these two (and no I'm not wishing for it) is for the team to have a few injuries on d. That's how Subban made his way onto the roster and never left. They need to be given big minutes and time to evolve. At this point I'd rather see Beaulieu and Tinordi make mistakes than watch season veterans like Gilbert and Allen make fools out of themselves on a nightly basis. It's the whole Bouillon/Murray debacle all over again. When playoff time comes around and we need one of these youngsters to step for whatever reason, MT is going to wish he had played them more throughout the season because by then it will already have been too late.
Last year Tinordi makes one gaffe against Columbus that costs us the game. I don't think he ever played after that. Beaulieu makes one gaffe after the Penguins' game. Idk if he'll ever see the ice in MTL ever again. The best thing that could happen to these two (and no I'm not wishing for it) is for the team to have a few injuries on d. That's how Subban made his way onto the roster and never left. They need to be given big minutes and time to evolve. At this point I'd rather see Beaulieu and Tinordi make mistakes than watch season veterans like Gilbert and Allen make fools out of themselves on a nightly basis. It's the whole Bouillon/Murray debacle all over again. When playoff time comes around and we need one of these youngsters to step for whatever reason, MT is going to wish he had played them more throughout the season because by then it will already have been too late.
Burke the Legend
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- Feb 22, 2012
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Beaulieu has not looked good at all so I'm not surprised to see him a scratch. I would assume he should be in Hamilton to get icetime but maybe they think it's best he sticks around to participate in team practices? I am sure he is not complaining about the NHL paycheque either.
Smokey Thompson
Registered User
Allen is only slightly better than Murray. If anything this should be "Why Allen over Tinordi"? Gilbert is actually half decent aside from his defensive gafs. He gives us a better chance at winning every game with his positive possession play and quick outlet passes.
The jury has already deliberated and ruled on Allen after 25 minutes of sporadic ice time with no set partner in a new system with new teammates. This place never changes. Chock full of pro level scouts who can make determinations in an instant.
Markov4Captain
Registered User
I'm willing to bet this is Allen in his usual form. I don't expect much improvement for him. Weaver is a better version and does a more effective job.
Pierre Dagenais
pissening
Smokey Thompson
Registered User
I'm glad Allen stepped up to Lucic vs Boston, but aside from that his skating was obviously pretty terrible and he looked like a combination of Gorges and John Scott with the puck on his stick.
Him and Weaver are both capable #6 defensemen, but nothing more. Still, it was a solid trade for playoff depth (which you can never have enough of) and considering we got rid of Bourque's 3.33m for next season.
Gilbert is quietly becoming one of the habs best dman. I'm not sure which Gilbert most are watching on here.
The better questions would be, how the hell is Allen still in the NHL and how the hell is he out there over Beaulieu or Tinordi.
You focused on the wrong guy imo OP.
The better questions would be, how the hell is Allen still in the NHL and how the hell is he out there over Beaulieu or Tinordi.
You focused on the wrong guy imo OP.
3 points in 23 games is NOT what we expected out of Gilbert.
Those are Josh Gorges numbers...
So if Gilbert is quietly becoming one of our best Dmen we are screwed...
Gilbert is much better than Beaulieu defensively at this point and Beaulieu is not bringing enough on the offensive side.
Allen is the tough clear the crease Dman that the habs wished Tinordi to be.
After 20 games neither of our young Dmen has stepped up... so in come the veterans ... that is the Therrien way.
Allen is the tough clear the crease Dman that the habs wished Tinordi to be.
After 20 games neither of our young Dmen has stepped up... so in come the veterans ... that is the Therrien way.
Gilbert is a lot better than Beaulieu right now. He's more equipped to play top 4 than Gonchar Allen or Weaver.
Beaulieu is a better skater and has more upside, but Gilbert is a finished product and Beaulieu is still a work in progress. Using him as anything more than a #5 or 6 right now makes no sense.
I was expecting more offense from Gilbert, but he's been better than I expected defensively. At 2.8 mil AAV and playing 20+ minutes he's been solid.
As somebody tweeted last week, the NHL is not a developmental league. Has nothing to do with MT, successful teams develop their young players in the AHL not NHL like the Oilers, Panthers, Buffalo etc
Most successful NHL teams let their kids play a lot of AHL games before promoting them.
Beaulieu and Tinordi were not terrible, but they didn't step up and take a spot either. At the end of the day they are better off getting 22-25 minutes a night AHL than 10-15 and press box duty in the NHL. Next year they will have to be kept due to waiver rules.
Leon Lucius Black
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- Nov 5, 2007
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I'd rather have Tinordi in the lineup than Beaulieu, Weaver and obviously Allen.
Tinordi was actually playing pretty decent and wasn't making as many mistakes as Beaulieu was. Ever since Gilbert has been playing on the third pairing he's been very solid.. he hasn't looked good on the PP however so just put Markov or Gonchar out the whole two minutes so one can play with PK.
Most people here only bring up Gilbert whenever he makes a mistake, but fail to give him credit whenever he plays good.
Tinordi was actually playing pretty decent and wasn't making as many mistakes as Beaulieu was. Ever since Gilbert has been playing on the third pairing he's been very solid.. he hasn't looked good on the PP however so just put Markov or Gonchar out the whole two minutes so one can play with PK.
Most people here only bring up Gilbert whenever he makes a mistake, but fail to give him credit whenever he plays good.
CupInSIX
My cap runneth over
So you're saying playing Allen over Beaulieu for the 2nd night in a row to get him 'comfortable' with the club was a good decision?
By your logic, Allen needed more practices with the club(even though his mistakes were mostly fundamental).
I don't think Allen is any great surprise...
It isn't fair to judge him after that NYR debacle.
But many of us have seen his play over the years and know what to expect.
Which frankly isn't really too much.
MT likes to have that 5-6 security blanket pairing that can shut down opponents and kill penalties.
I'm not convinced this is it?
He will still be using Markov and probably even Gonchar on PK....
It isn't fair to judge him after that NYR debacle.
But many of us have seen his play over the years and know what to expect.
Which frankly isn't really too much.
MT likes to have that 5-6 security blanket pairing that can shut down opponents and kill penalties.
I'm not convinced this is it?
He will still be using Markov and probably even Gonchar on PK....
They are not really similar. Nygren is mostly a PP specuialist, Gilbert can play in all situations.
Allen has been pretty solid the last few years, that's how he got 3 years and 10.5 mil from the Mighty Ducks...but he is now 34 and has had knee injuries, I'm sure MB and MT want to give him 4-6 weeks to see what he can bring before making a move or recall...same for Gonchar. Those guys were not acquired because the Habs desperately wanted them, it's the price to pay for dumping 5+ mil of cap hit in 15-16.
As pointed out above, this is very much the wrong question. These two are the team's third- and fourth- best defensemen; I think Gilbert is better than Beaulieu, but at this level and since they play on opposite sides, "who's better" is academic.
The question should be: why aren't Beaulieu and Gilbert both in over Allen and Weaver?
The question should be: why aren't Beaulieu and Gilbert both in over Allen and Weaver?
