Why doesn't Hamilton have an OHL Team?

[hockeykid87]

If the Bulls move, I'll feel bad for the people in Belleville.

What else is there to do in that town? I lived there for the majority of 4 years, and outside of drinking and the Bulls, there isn't much to hang around there for.

 

[Evil Doctor]

With Erie out who would be the other possibilities of other oHL teams moving?

The Otters are not out. In fact I guarantee that it will be the Erie Otters, it's the only logical reason for the AHL Bulldogs being forced out two years early. The Katz/Bassen lawsuit, the historical connection of the franchise, the OHL's desire to be back in Hamilton, the division the Otters play in are all a confluence of events forcing the relocation.

 

[buzzworthy]

Evil Doctor (the name says it all), where do you get your information? OK, so the Otters move. Hamilton has not had success supporting the OHL. If one of the 12 interested parties do buy and move the Otters, another OHL team will take its place. Check the current attendance figures, good Doctor. Erie is 5th, and may end up 3rd in attendance in the OHL. How well are some of the other franchises doing attendance-wise? I don't believe you. Someone will save the Otters.

 

[OHLArenaGuide]

I don't have any inside information on this, but it's a fact that sometimes even teams that are well supported move because of reasons beyond their control. St John's lost the baby Leafs years ago even though they drew remarkably well, because costs were still high and the Leafs wanted their affiliate closer to home. With the Bassin/Katz lawsuit ongoing, the Bulldogs leaving and the fact the Otters played in Hamilton for 30 years already and have a historical connection there, I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if they move. All that it means is that Erie would be a good potential market for another team if the OHL was looking to expand, or if the Steelheads or Bulls were looking to move.

 

[noobie1]

Evil Doctor (the name says it all), where do you get your information? OK, so the Otters move. Hamilton has not had success supporting the OHL. If one of the 12 interested parties do buy and move the Otters, another OHL team will take its place. Check the current attendance figures, good Doctor. Erie is 5th, and may end up 3rd in attendance in the OHL. How well are some of the other franchises doing attendance-wise? I don't believe you. Someone will save the Otters.

Here is my take, take it for what its worth. Erie's attendance is 5th in the league right now because there is someone named Mcdavid playing their... Heard he is pretty good
Without McDavid, Erie still has a decent Attendance record, but averages maybe 1000 less then the current. This will be looked at when buyers are looking at viability.
Also, which goes for any possible team looking to sell is the current Lawsuit hanging over every team and the league. until that is settled. any buyers are going to be very weary. As any numbers and figures will be irrelevant if a team is paying out a lawsuit and then restructuring how they pay players etc....

 

[buzzworthy]

Well, gentlemen, I appreciate your input. I will put that in my metaphorical pipe and smoke it. If Erie moves I think that another team will be here to take their place. I still think that Bassin will keep the team here for 1 more year. Money talks, and he will take the best offer. Correct me if I am wrong, but Hamilton wants an NHL franchise for an NHL sized arena and, for a city that size, has not supported their OHL teams very well. Their current attendance average in the AHL is 4,069 which is hardly a ringing endorsement of support for a city that size. So, we shall see. Erie's arena is top tier and their fan base is coming back after Bassin's train wreck of several years ago. Granted, McDavid probably accounts for 1,000 over normal, but if they have a decent team, they will still be a top 5 draw.

 

[EON]

The Otters are not out. In fact I guarantee that it will be the Erie Otters, it's the only logical reason for the AHL Bulldogs being forced out two years early. The Katz/Bassen lawsuit, the historical connection of the franchise, the OHL's desire to be back in Hamilton, the division the Otters play in are all a confluence of events forcing the relocation.

whoops

 

[Evil Doctor]

whoops

Well colour me surprised!

 

[noobie1]

it would be sad to see them move, but i think Belleville is becoming more of a reality... I don't think they can continue operating in the same building for to much longer.

uh oh, sorry Belleville Fans hope this was not my fault!!!

 

[EON]

Well colour me surprised!

all of your logic made sense, but Erie has one massive advantage over Belleville: arena

 

[ckg927]

The Otters are not out. In fact I guarantee that it will be the Erie Otters, it's the only logical reason for the AHL Bulldogs being forced out two years early. The Katz/Bassen lawsuit, the historical connection of the franchise, the OHL's desire to be back in Hamilton, the division the Otters play in are all a confluence of events forcing the relocation.

Cue the Dragnet theme music. Start with the DUM DA DUMB DUMB part.

(In all seriousness, no one expected this news...)

 

[ckg927]

all of your logic made sense, but Erie has one massive advantage over Belleville: arena

And one that looks brand-new; never mind it first opened in 1983!

 

[h10*]

Here is my take, take it for what its worth. Erie's attendance is 5th in the league right now because there is someone named Mcdavid playing their... Heard he is pretty good
Without McDavid, Erie still has a decent Attendance record, but averages maybe 1000 less then the current. This will be looked at when buyers are looking at viability.
Also, which goes for any possible team looking to sell is the current Lawsuit hanging over every team and the league. until that is settled. any buyers are going to be very weary. As any numbers and figures will be irrelevant if a team is paying out a lawsuit and then restructuring how they pay players etc....

Mcdavid has definitely accounted for recent attendance rates.... But that is because the team is winning because of him.
If Erie is a middle of the pack team they have shown to be 6th-9th in attendance with about 3500-4000 a game.
If Erie struggles (don't make the playoffs) they usually are 10-15th in attendance or about 2800-3500.
(Their worst year with attendance rate was 14th or about 2800 in 2011-2012 when they won 10 games)
If Erie has a top team they usually are 4th-6th in attendance or about 4000-4900.

The numbers speak for themselves prior to Mcdavid. If Erie wins 45-50 games and he isn't on the team they still would have 4500+ in attendance average. My guess is that if they could continue to win more consistenly and not have terrible seasons 1 out of every 3 years they would draw closer to 5000 in their top years (or win the team is winning a majority of games) because more fans would stick around. But the thing about Erie that strikes me more is that they have shown pretty good support of 3000-3200 average attendance for a season even when they have only won 15-25 games for that year. That's pretty solid. If you win here the fans will certainly come. If you have 1-2 rebuild years you can still draw decent crowds until you start winning again.

 

[buzzworthy]

Hockeye, you summed it up very well. I think that some of the band wagon fans will return because of the good experiences at the game and the good return on their investment. Our arena is a gem, concessions are reasonable, and I am convinced the Otters are here to stay. To be frank, where else could they go? There aren't any other viable places in Ontario, and the OHL has 2 franchises there that are bleeding big time. I haven't studied the AHL/ECHL situation carefully, but when that all shakes out, there may be an opening somewhere else here in the NE for a team.

 

[noobie1]

Mcdavid has definitely accounted for recent attendance rates.... But that is because the team is winning because of him.
If Erie is a middle of the pack team they have shown to be 6th-9th in attendance with about 3500-4000 a game.
If Erie struggles (don't make the playoffs) they usually are 10-15th in attendance or about 2800-3500.
(Their worst year with attendance rate was 14th or about 2800 in 2011-2012 when they won 10 games)
If Erie has a top team they usually are 4th-6th in attendance or about 4000-4900.

The numbers speak for themselves prior to Mcdavid. If Erie wins 45-50 games and he isn't on the team they still would have 4500+ in attendance average. My guess is that if they could continue to win more consistenly and not have terrible seasons 1 out of every 3 years they would draw closer to 5000 in their top years (or win the team is winning a majority of games) because more fans would stick around. But the thing about Erie that strikes me more is that they have shown pretty good support of 3000-3200 average attendance for a season even when they have only won 15-25 games for that year. That's pretty solid. If you win here the fans will certainly come. If you have 1-2 rebuild years you can still draw decent crowds until you start winning again.

My fear for Erie based on that would be, the cupboard is really empty after this year for a number of years. That will make it quite difficult to ice a strong team. Not impossible, but very hard. Hopefully with the rink and a good recent experience the fans will continue to support the team while they go through some rough years ahead.

 

[h10*]

My fear for Erie based on that would be, the cupboard is really empty after this year for a number of years. That will make it quite difficult to ice a strong team. Not impossible, but very hard. Hopefully with the rink and a good recent experience the fans will continue to support the team while they go through some rough years ahead.

Currently yes it is. But can't imagine Erie trying to go for it next year. Personally I would hope around the trade deadline that they sell off with the likes of Strome, Dermott, Darren Raddysh, etc.
they should be able to get 4-5 second/third round picks back plus maybe a young player. Depends on how much they want to "rebuild" and make some trades. I would hope they at least move Strome as he could fetch a lot.

It will be time to rebuild and look towards 2-3 years down the road again so the cupboard should be back to normal in a year or 2

 

[HamiltonOHL]

Hockeye, you summed it up very well. I think that some of the band wagon fans will return because of the good experiences at the game and the good return on their investment. Our arena is a gem, concessions are reasonable, and I am convinced the Otters are here to stay. To be frank, where else could they go? There aren't any other viable places in Ontario, and the OHL has 2 franchises there that are bleeding big time. I haven't studied the AHL/ECHL situation carefully, but when that all shakes out, there may be an opening somewhere else here in the NE for a team.

what teams are Bleeding dry?

 

[SSMHoundsFan]

what teams are Bleeding dry?

Sudbury and Peterborough come to mind, Mississauga perhaps also

 

[ckg927]

Sudbury and Peterborough come to mind, Mississauga perhaps also

Doesn't Sudbury have someone(or a group)stepping in to purchase the team?

 

[noobie1]

Doesn't Sudbury have someone(or a group)stepping in to purchase the team?

And to be fair, I think Sudbury is in the position they are solely due to misteps and things the owner has done to get him into the current position. Ownership change and i believe Sudbury is back to a profitable enterprise.

 

[SSMHoundsFan]

Doesn't Sudbury have someone(or a group)stepping in to purchase the team?

I hope so, that's the rumours anyways..

 

[From Up Top]

Doesn't Sudbury have someone(or a group)stepping in to purchase the team?

Those are the rumours, but based on the Belleville situation, I wouldn't be surprised if this same thing happens a year from now but with the Wolves.

The numbers being thrown around for the franchise have been a little outrageous, and continue to get rejected. I think it all depends on what Sudbury city council decides to do with the arena will seal the teams fate in the Nickel City.

 

[SSMHoundsFan]

Those are the rumours, but based on the Belleville situation, I wouldn't be surprised if this same thing happens a year from now but with the Wolves.

The numbers being thrown around for the franchise have been a little outrageous, and continue to get rejected. I think it all depends on what Sudbury city council decides to do with the arena will seal the teams fate in the Nickel City.

This ^

Would hate to lose our Northern rivals because council can't get their heads out of their ass and do something about the arena, in addition to the team finding a capable owner to run them.....would be curious to know how many Wolves fans chose to renew/buy season tickets for next season after this year's s***show