Why can't Detroit win a shootout?

[Jackets Fan]

And that's bad for hockey? Shootout is a complete joke.

Yeah, you would totally still be saying this if the Wings were 6-1 inn the SO instead of 1-6

Seriously, with the way the way Bobrovsky and Howard were playing, that game would have went on forever. Save the super long OT for the playoffs.
Also, who the hell wants to see a tie? And really, when it comes down to it, isn't hockey really about the shooter versus the goalie anyway?

EVERY team practices the shootout. Some teams are good at them, others aren't. Same with everything else. Every team practices the powerplay. Some have a good PP, others don't.

 

[Curufinwe]

1-6 in the shootout this season. Howard looks incredible for 65 minutes and then turns into a sieve 1 on 1.

Flyers are 0-8 in 2014.

 

[Nordique]

Best goaltending duel of of the season so far. That game was intense, most entertaining 0-0 game I've seen in a long while.

 

[DeYarmond Edison]

Best goaltending duel of of the season so far. That game was intense, most entertaining 0-0 game I've seen in a long while.

This. Definitely had a playoff vibe to it with those goalie performances. Keep it up #lumbus.. I wanna see them make the post-season.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

It should also be pointed out that Howard's last 4 wins required him to stop every single shot.

The last time the Red Wings scored more than one shootout goal with Howard in net: April 2012.

True - the number of 1s and 0s in the left-hand side of that chart is staggering.

And it's a cliche, but it's only a cliche because it's true: "You can't win if you don't score".

 

[DeYarmond Edison]

True - the number of 1s and 0s in the left-hand side of that chart is staggering.

And it's a cliche, but it's only a cliche because it's true: "You can't win if you don't score".

Yep.

With some of the breakaway plays we've seen our skill players execute (Nyquist/Tatar/etc) in regulation it becomes even more frustrating. They just can't seem to get it done 1v1. Other than Datsyuk.

 

[PenguinMario]

True - the number of 1s and 0s in the left-hand side of that chart is staggering.

And it's a cliche, but it's only a cliche because it's true: "You can't win if you don't score".

This seems pretty easy to decide.

League average percentage for shooters is .333, and goalie save percentage is .666. Detroit's shooters are .210 this season, and -.123 relatively. Howard is .266 this season, and -.400.

So no one on that team is doing themselves any favors, and it's possible that Howard is facing a lot of strong shooters. But it seems pretty clear that he's most of the problem. To put it another way, Detroit's shooters rank 24th of 30, but Howard is 54th of 57, and dead last among goalies who have seen more than 15 shots.

 

[ZDH]

Last night he couldve poked checked at least 2 of those attempts. If its going in anyways might as well be super aggressive.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Yeah, you would totally still be saying this if the Wings were 6-1 inn the SO instead of 1-6

Seriously, with the way the way Bobrovsky and Howard were playing, that game would have went on forever. Save the super long OT for the playoffs.
Also, who the hell wants to see a tie? And really, when it comes down to it, isn't hockey really about the shooter versus the goalie anyway?

EVERY team practices the shootout. Some teams are good at them, others aren't. Same with everything else. Every team practices the powerplay. Some have a good PP, others don't.

No, it isn't, because there's a lot of other guys you have to contend with before you ever get to the goalie. There's no slowing down to a near stop and dekeing 20 times.

Obviously you can't keep playing endless OT in the regular season. I'm okay with ties if neither team manages to win the game playing hockey. I grew up watching it that way and it's how the game has been for most of its existence.

And to be clear I've hated the shootout since long before the Wings stunk at it.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

This seems pretty easy to decide.

League average percentage for shooters is .333, and goalie save percentage is .666. Detroit's shooters are .210 this season, and -.123 relatively. Howard is .266 this season, and -.400.

It's actually about 32% success rate this year (admittedly this helps your case, but I'm more of a numbers guy than a case guy).

So no one on that team is doing themselves any favors, and it's possible that Howard is facing a lot of strong shooters. But it seems pretty clear that he's most of the problem. To put it another way, Detroit's shooters rank 24th of 30, but Howard is 54th of 57, and dead last among goalies who have seen more than 15 shots.

True, but that's a sample size artifact (as I mentioned above). Howard has shown no historical tendencies towards poor shootout play.

 

[BF3]

Also, who the hell wants to see a tie?

I'd much rather have ties. Just go to a 3 points for a win and 1 point for a tie and don't even have OT. No reason for OT during the regular season.

Will never happen because apparently Anerican fans need a winner even if it was decided by the head coaches thumb wrestling at center ice.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

I'd much rather have ties. Just go to a 3 points for a win and 1 point for a tie and don't even have OT. No reason for OT during the regular season.

Will never happen because apparently Anerican fans need a winner even if it was decided by the head coaches thumb wrestling at center ice.

It's not just that fans need a winner.

The loser point gives the league false parity so the standings are much closer than they otherwise would be. Owners love it because it keeps their team in the playoff hunt deeper into the season, so they keep selling tickets.

 

[gdsmack267]

Because howard hates my fantasy team

 

[TheOtherOne]

I don't get why people are obsessed with pinpointing "the main issue" or "the biggest problem".

Jimmy lets in every goal, and our shooters never score any goals. Those are equally relevant problems that both exist at the same time. You can admit that without being forced to choose which is more important.

 

[tfong]

Howard is terrible in shootouts is why.

 

[PenguinMario]

It's actually about 32% success rate this year (admittedly this helps your case, but I'm more of a numbers guy than a case guy).



True, but that's a sample size artifact (as I mentioned above). Howard has shown no historical tendencies towards poor shootout play.

I don't disagree - he's actually slightly above average over his career - but I don't think it really absolves him. Regardless of how well everyone on Detroit normally performs or will perform in the future, the majority of the blame for the shootout woes to date rests on the goaltender.

Put it this way - if he regresses to his historical mean and the shooters stay where they are, Detroit is going to win a lot more shootouts. But vice-versa? That's an extra shot made every few games, and maybe an extra win or two over their current pace.

 

[DeYarmond Edison]

I don't get why people are obsessed with pinpointing "the main issue" or "the biggest problem".

Jimmy lets in every goal, and our shooters never score any goals. Those are equally relevant problems that both exist at the same time. You can admit that without being forced to choose which is more important.

I don't disagree - he's actually slightly above average over his career - but I don't think it really absolves him. Regardless of how well everyone on Detroit normally performs or will perform in the future, the majority of the blame for the shootout woes to date rests on the goaltender.

Fair enough. I don't think anybody is trying to absolve him. My point is if the shooters start stepping up, Howard will be able to play with more confidence. Going into a shootout knowing he has to stop every shot certainly won't help his performance. He's not exactly known for his mental stability.

 

[PenguinMario]

Fair enough. I don't think anybody is trying to absolve him. My point is if the shooters start stepping up, Howard will be able to play with more confidence. Going into a shootout knowing he has to stop every shot certainly won't help his performance.

That's entirely possible. It could butterfly a lot of different ways, but they're mostly positive.

He's not exactly known for his mental stability.

As a Pens fan, I'm not familiar with unstable goaltenders.

 

[icKx]

Last night he couldve poked checked at least 2 of those attempts. If its going in anyways might as well be super aggressive.

Not to say you aren't right, but Howard lives and dies by his glove and pads. His glove was great last night.

You can't expect a guy to suddenly change up his style in the SO.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

It should also be pointed out that Howard's last 4 wins required him to stop every single shot.

The last time the Red Wings scored more than one shootout goal with Howard in net: April 2012.

Wow. I knew our shooters had been struggling lately, but I didn't realise it was this bad.

I don't get why people are obsessed with pinpointing "the main issue" or "the biggest problem".

Because too many Wings fans look to blame everything on Howard. We lose games 1-0 and Howard gets the blame (that's not to see he doesn't shoulder a large portion of the blame for the SO problems).

 

[donghabs98]

The Wings are this season's Devils I guess.

 

[Invictus12]

most red wings fans will tell you the man between the pipes

As horrible as he has been in shootouts, we don't score much goals either...

 

[Dotter]

Yeah, you would totally still be saying this if the Wings were 6-1 inn the SO instead of 1-6

Seriously, with the way the way Bobrovsky and Howard were playing, that game would have went on forever. Save the super long OT for the playoffs.
Also, who the hell wants to see a tie? And really, when it comes down to it, isn't hockey really about the shooter versus the goalie anyway?

EVERY team practices the shootout. Some teams are good at them, others aren't. Same with everything else. Every team practices the powerplay. Some have a good PP, others don't.

They should have shootouts in the playoffs then. And then teams would be more interested in drafting shootout specialists and goalies. That would change it from a gimmick to real hockey.

As of right now, we don't know if shootouts will be here in 5 years.

jm2c

 

[Jackets Fan]

They should have shootouts in the playoffs then. And then teams would be more interested in drafting shootout specialists and goalies. That would change it from a gimmick to real hockey.

As of right now, we don't know if shootouts will be here in 5 years.

jm2c

There's a ton more games played in the regular season, than there is during the post season. Would you be fine with, let's say, a meaningless game between 2 bottom feeders going to triple OT? I doubt it. In the playoffs, it's different. There's way more on the line.

The shootout makes sense, because it helps avoid super long games, and ties. Do you have a better solution?

 

[Dotter]

Do you have a better solution?

That's an objective question. I was happy with the game and point system pre-2005. You can find 10 other people who would prefer 10 other solutions.