MakeOttawaGreatAgain
Illest guy in town!
- Feb 28, 2007
- 4,054
- 268
Inferiority complex or what?
I know. They were just ...well okay if that's what you think.What's worse is that neither Mendes nor Shawn Simpson bothered to put up an argument. Simpson agreed with O'Neill when he said that Sundin was elite and Alfredsson isn't. O'Neill said that the HOF should be reserved for the elite....what a dumbass
Biased as it is. Both players are very close.
One bias is starting age. Sundin was plainly a lot better then Alfie when they were younger. A lot. Sundin picked first overall and I think needed to miss his first year due to Military committment, not because he was not NHL ready. Alfredsson... Undrafted. Drafted in second year of eligibility.
However Alfredsson was undeniably better as an older player. From about 2003... Alfredsson is a better player. Certainly better post lockout year. Alfredsson has the best playoffs in 2007 of either.
Sundin is superior internationally (though Alfie was always great). Sundin is the best Swede ever internationally... Over Forsberg and Lidstrom even.
Healthwise it is Sundin. Both Alfie and Sundin were consistent their whole careers... But for awhile Alfie kept missing significant chunks if seasons.
It is very close overall. Sundin easily is better under 30 years old and Alfie better after 30.
I can see why most pick Sundin overall. There is am argument either way. Both are clearly HHOFers.
I would take 2005-2008 Alfie over any year of Sundin though.
As a Swede, I don't count that much into what's written in first post. For most Swedes Mats was the better player, the more prolific skater and the player with a better career. Mats scored big goals in WC that is deeply remembered by us. The way he scored the goals, the way he skated down the wing with a majestic force from a very young age carved out the view we have of him. Daniel was a heck of a player, no doubts. But Mats had that very "it"
One other aspect of why Mats is considered the bigger hero is that World Championships had much bigger value in beginning of 90s than later. Russians were still dominating, national team still had a core of players that people in Sweden could identify with and the country more or less was on held when Tre Kronor played in the later stage of tournies.
So the legend of Mats is not only because how he played the game, it's the timing of how important national team was and I can add that Peter Forsberg very soon became an icon as well, leaving Alfie the odd man out.
As a Swede, I don't count that much into what's written in first post. For most Swedes Mats was the better player, the more prolific skater and the player with a better career. Mats scored big goals in WC that is deeply remembered by us. The way he scored the goals, the way he skated down the wing with a majestic force from a very young age carved out the view we have of him. Daniel was a heck of a player, no doubts. But Mats had that very "it"
One other aspect of why Mats is considered the bigger hero is that World Championships had much bigger value in beginning of 90s than later. Russians were still dominating, national team still had a core of players that people in Sweden could identify with and the country more or less was on held when Tre Kronor played in the later stage of tournies.
So the legend of Mats is not only because how he played the game, it's the timing of how important national team was and I can add that Peter Forsberg very soon became an icon as well, leaving Alfie the odd man out.
As a Swede, I don't count that much into what's written in first post. For most Swedes Mats was the better player, the more prolific skater and the player with a better career. Mats scored big goals in WC that is deeply remembered by us. The way he scored the goals, the way he skated down the wing with a majestic force from a very young age carved out the view we have of him. Daniel was a heck of a player, no doubts. But Mats had that very "it"
One other aspect of why Mats is considered the bigger hero is that World Championships had much bigger value in beginning of 90s than later. Russians were still dominating, national team still had a core of players that people in Sweden could identify with and the country more or less was on held when Tre Kronor played in the later stage of tournies.
So the legend of Mats is not only because how he played the game, it's the timing of how important national team was and I can add that Peter Forsberg very soon became an icon as well, leaving Alfie the odd man out.
Shawn Simpson is a dumb egoist. He just talks to hear himself talk. He contradicts his own opinions 2 weeks later.
I appreciate your standpoint coming from a swede, but your analogy of why Mats is "better" than Alfredsson because of the WC falls flat when you consider the reason that Mats was available for the WC was his inability to do anything of substance on a big budget team when it mattered most. In North America, anyways, reputations are made in April to June. I did not feel that Sundin was a first ballot Hall of Famer, nor do I feel Alfredsson is. I think media being Toronto centric had a lot to do with him getting in so quickly and ahead of more deserving players.
Forsberg and Alfie weren't around as much because they were busy trying to lead and win Stanley Cups, but Alfie in his prime, in 2006 was much more effective than Sundin in securing that Gold Medal.
For the record I think Sundin is the more skilled player, but I think the better player is Alfredsson. No one questioned his work ethic in the manner Sundin was. No one questioned his desire in Ottawa. It was an issue for Sundin in Toronto. Toronto fans I think if they are being completely honest, will freely admit that he was not universally loved in the manner Alfie was. I don't understand how a highly talented and skilled player like Sundin could not break out of that 70 point mould for so many years.
Sundin was a better leader. He oozes leadership.