Whos 1-10?

[Moskau]

1. Ovechkin
2. Lehtonen
3. Malkin
4. Zherdev
5. Fleury
6. Phaneuf
7. Suter
8. Vanek
9. Horton
10. Michalek

 

[Lionel Hutz]

1. Ovechkin
2. Lehtonen
3. Malkin
4. Zherdev
5. Fleury
6. Phaneuf
7. Suter
8. Vanek
9. Horton
10. Michalek

I like this order.

 

[Lionel Hutz]

Fleury in my view was lucky to go 1st overall and won't in my view be a franchise netminder.

I think he'll be a solid starting goalie. I don't think he'll be this hyped Hall of Famer, but a solid starter. And you know what? That's fine with a pick up there. The Pens haven't had luck drafting a goalie in a while, anyway so kudos to them.

I respectfully disagree guys, I think he'll live up to it down the road. Whether or not Lhetonen will be better I have no idea, but I don't think we'll be disapointed in Fleury himself.

 

[Mess]

Kyle Wellwood better be in that group after his Top Rookie scoring season in the AHL and his 5 goal game this season recently ..

If he is not Get HF Managment on the Phone right now ..

 

[craig1]

I think he'll be a solid starting goalie. I don't think he'll be this hyped Hall of Famer, but a solid starter. And you know what? That's fine with a pick up there. The Pens haven't had luck drafting a goalie in a while, anyway so kudos to them.

Really? Seems to me that drafting Patrick Lalime and Caron recently, not to metion Chiodo (to go with MAF) is decent goalie drafting. They picked up a backup in Aubin a few years back also.

Just a solid starter? You must not really watch him much.......

As for it being consensus that KL is better.....no, it's not consensus. Most of the time, it's a fairly even split between the two when it comes to whom is the better prospect.

 

[craig1]

For the pens i can understand why they took him as they do need a decent goalie but he wasn't the best player available in the 03 draft. He should have fairly good NHL career but he is being hyped way too much.

Again, the Pens already had a solid prospect in Caron, with fast developing ones over in Europe like Duba. Don't forget, they had Hedberg in net as the starter. They drafted MAF because he is a rare and special talent, period.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Really? Seems to me that drafting Patrick Lalime and Caron recently, not to metion Chiodo (to go with MAF) is decent goalie drafting. They picked up a backup in Aubin a few years back also.

Just a solid starter? You must not really watch him much.......

As for it being consensus that KL is better.....no, it's not consensus. Most of the time, it's a fairly even split between the two when it comes to whom is the better prospect.

Caron or Chiodo should both be solid back-ups, IMO. Not much more, really.

I'm talking about luck with a high goalie pick who THEY developed into a bonafide starter.

 

[Lionel Hutz]

Caron or Chiodo should both be solid back-ups, IMO. Not much more, really.

I'm talking about luck with a high goalie pick who THEY developed into a bonafide starter.

Caron and especially Chiodo have shown that they may be more than solid backups.

To my knowledge, its been a very long time since the Pens took a goalie high (87, 96), so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

 

[craig1]

Caron or Chiodo should both be solid back-ups, IMO. Not much more, really.

I'm talking about luck with a high goalie pick who THEY developed into a bonafide starter.

Before MAF, they had only drafted one goalie higher than the 3rd round since 1976! (Hillier, 1996) It's not like they can't develop high goalie picks.

As for Caron, he looks to be a middle eschelon starter in the league. Not a superstar, but serviceable as a starter. At the time, the Pens had a need for scoring, and quite a few solid goalie prospects. They traded up because of their opinion of MAF, not just to fill an immediate need.


EDIT: To be exact, a lot of fans here were wanting NZ at the time to fill the need for scoring.

 

[chris39bong]

It changes the fact that he AT THIS POINT does not belong in the top 50 prospect list, only put him back there when he comes back and shows that he can still play. How can you be sure he will ever be 100% again with 2 injuries on the same knee in one season? And even if he does come back, he lost over a season of hockey, don't you think that will have some effect on his game? How do you justify him being in the top 10 I have no idea.

His two knee surguries doesn't change the fact that, at this point, he still has the ability/potential that ranks somewhere in the top 5-10 prospects in the world. Both knee surguries were complete successes. The doctors said he should make a 100% recovery after the 2nd surgery. DW said within the past week that Michalek will be a "bull" for the team in the future. The health of his knee, especially for such a young player, who recovered from the first knee surgury much faster than expected, isn't the issue here.

The main issue for Michalek is missing a season. Having not played for almost a year does hurt, but it won't affect Michalek as much as a guy like R.J. Umberger (who also recently missed a year). Michalek and every other top prospect on this list already have the skillset to play in the NHL, but the main thing that prevents them from playing in the NHL right after being drafted is their maturity (physically and mentally), understanding of the game, defensive systems, positional play, play without the puck, and so on. Michalek definately will be rusty when he comes back. In fact, it took him 3 or 4 games with the Barons last year before he started dominating again. He should be even more rusty this time around. But the good thing about Michalek is that he was the most NHL ready player in his draft class. He's physically mature at 6'2'', 220. He's older and more mature than most players in his draft class. And most of all, he's probably understands the game better than any other prospect from the 2003 draft. His knowledge of the game, defensive awareness, and play without the puck is on par with guys like Lehtonen and Sundstrom. It's something that at this point of a players career, you can't really teach anymore. It's the result of the combinaton in natural skill and of proper coaching throughtout a players youth. Michalek won't have any trouble playing in the NHL. At worst he'll be a big, fast, two-way 2nd liner with above average offensive skills. At best, he'll be a similar player offensively to Hossa but better all around. That's why he still deserves to be in the HF's top 10 list.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Caron and especially Chiodo have shown that they may be more than solid backups.

To my knowledge, its been a very long time since the Pens took a goalie high (87, 96), so I'm not sure what you're getting at.

Caron wasn't great last year. He had like a .889%. That's not very good, IMO and didn't show me much more than back-up calibur play. And Chiodo -- the jury is still out on him. He can either be a Jason Labarbera (where he dominates the AHL but plays mediocre in the NHL) or something more.

And don't base what he did off one season so far since that's all he's had.

The jury is out on both, but only Chiodo has a hope of being a lesser starter IMO.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I respectfully disagree guys, I think he'll live up to it down the road. Whether or not Lhetonen will be better I have no idea, but I don't think we'll be disapointed in Fleury himself.

You're disagreeing that he might not be a franchise goalie? I said I doubt he'll be this Hall of Fame franchise goalie he's been hyped up to be. You're telling me you think you doubt that he won't achieve that?

(I'm not being hostile, I just really don't think you worded that right.)

 

[aragorn]

Alexander Kaigorodov

What is the thinking out there about Kaigorodov (Sens) who is 2nd in the Russian Super League in scoring ahead of the 3 Russian superstars everybody has on their list here and Ilya Kovalchuck for that matter? I know there has been very little hype on him and he isn't even listed in the top 100. In fact he is in 5th place on the Sens list behind another fellow Russian Mirnov who only has 10 points in the Russian league.

It is hard to argue with the lists and the names here but that doesn't change the fact that Kaigorodov is 2nd leading scorer in a league filled with NHLers. I guess a lot of people including the Sens never thought that Martin St. Louis would amount to much either. I'm quite sure he never made any of these lists in his draft year.

 

[Know Your Enemy]

1.Lehtonen

 

[Prucha73]

His two knee surguries doesn't change the fact that, at this point, he still has the ability/potential that ranks somewhere in the top 5-10 prospects in the world. Both knee surguries were complete successes. The doctors said he should make a 100% recovery after the 2nd surgery. DW said within the past week that Michalek will be a "bull" for the team in the future. The health of his knee, especially for such a young player, who recovered from the first knee surgury much faster than expected, isn't the issue here.

The main issue for Michalek is missing a season. Having not played for almost a year does hurt, but it won't affect Michalek as much as a guy like R.J. Umberger (who also recently missed a year). Michalek and every other top prospect on this list already have the skillset to play in the NHL, but the main thing that prevents them from playing in the NHL right after being drafted is their maturity (physically and mentally), understanding of the game, defensive systems, positional play, play without the puck, and so on. Michalek definately will be rusty when he comes back. In fact, it took him 3 or 4 games with the Barons last year before he started dominating again. He should be even more rusty this time around. But the good thing about Michalek is that he was the most NHL ready player in his draft class. He's physically mature at 6'2'', 220. He's older and more mature than most players in his draft class. And most of all, he's probably understands the game better than any other prospect from the 2003 draft. His knowledge of the game, defensive awareness, and play without the puck is on par with guys like Lehtonen and Sundstrom. It's something that at this point of a players career, you can't really teach anymore. It's the result of the combinaton in natural skill and of proper coaching throughtout a players youth. Michalek won't have any trouble playing in the NHL. At worst he'll be a big, fast, two-way 2nd liner with above average offensive skills. At best, he'll be a similar player offensively to Hossa but better all around. That's why he still deserves to be in the HF's top 10 list.

He will probably be a Radek Bonk type of player, and I am not saying he is a bad prospect, but in general if any prospect who missed a whole season and got 2 major knee injuries from which he is still rehabing makes the top 50 list, then it really shows how useless these top 50 lists are. His knee will only get weaker with every injury and surgery, just look at Pavel Bure. Also look how long it takes for players to come back from similar surgeries, back into their grove. Radek Dvorak had a brutal year after his knee operation.

 

[X-SHARKIE]

I saw Michalek last year in the AHL and then this year I saw Thomas Vanek.

Michalek all around skills at the AHL level IMO were more impressive then Vaneks.

Top 10 prospect. I'm surprised Parise isn't though I love that guy.

 

[X-SHARKIE]

He will probably be a Radek Bonk type of player, and I am not saying he is a bad prospect, but in general if any prospect who missed a whole season and got 2 major knee injuries from which he is still rehabing makes the top 50 list, then it really shows how useless thes top 50 lists are. His knee will only get weaker with every injury and surgery, just look at Pavel Bure. Also look how long it takes for players to come back from similar surgeries, back into their grove. Radek Dvorak had a brutal year after his knee operation.

It's tough to call, Michalek played great after his first surgery so why wouldnt he after his second.

For every successfull rehab there is a bad one, and vice versa, we'll just have to waite and see.

 

[William H Bonney]

I saw Michalek last year in the AHL and then this year I saw Thomas Vanek.

Michalek all around skills at the AHL level IMO were more impressive then Vaneks.

Top 10 prospect. I'm surprised Parise isn't though I love that guy.

I'm surprised as well to see Vanek in the top 10 still.

 

[Slats432]

What is the thinking out there about Kaigorodov (Sens) who is 2nd in the Russian Super League in scoring ahead of the 3 Russian superstars everybody has on their list here and Ilya Kovalchuck for that matter? I know there has been very little hype on him and he isn't even listed in the top 100. In fact he is in 5th place on the Sens list behind another fellow Russian Mirnov who only has 10 points in the Russian league.

It is hard to argue with the lists and the names here but that doesn't change the fact that Kaigorodov is 2nd leading scorer in a league filled with NHLers. I guess a lot of people including the Sens never thought that Martin St. Louis would amount to much either. I'm quite sure he never made any of these lists in his draft year.

The rankings were based to the start of this season. Kaigorodov's start to the season wasn't a factor in his non ranking.

 

[McThome]

I will also second that I think Lehtonen is the best prospect still. I mean this guy has Patrick Roy potential. Ovechkin doesn't have Mario Lemieux or Wayne Gretzky potential I don't think.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

I will also second that I think Lehtonen is the best prospect still. I mean this guy has Patrick Roy potential. Ovechkin doesn't have Mario Lemieux or Wayne Gretzky potential I don't think.

No way this kid has that much potential... Yes he has alot, but I don't even think he has Glenn Hall potential(which is pretty darn hard to get). People are seriously overrating him. Here is my top 10, unbias as possible.

1)Kesler-Next Gretzky, easily.
2)Auld-Has potential to be better than Patrick Roy. Some great talent here...
3)King-Any doubt, that he will easily be better than Howe, and Lindros?
4)Koltsov-Bobby Orr who?
5)Cory Scheider-Next Terry Sawchuk, will be great, but overshadowed by Auld.
6)Ilya Krikunov-Mario Lemieux who?
7)Evgeny Gladskikh-Mike Bossy will pay for knocking us out of the playoffs.
8)Brett Skinner-Who is this Paul Coffey we're talking about?
9)Marc-Andre Bernier-See Schneider, except he's going to be overshadowed by King
10)Kari Lehtonen-Happy?

Try beating this list...

 

[McThome]

No way this kid has that much potential? Au contraire i can't recal the last goalie prospect even close to as good as him. He's absolutely dominated EVERY SINGLE LEVEL, including his short stint in the NHL. It is very much in his range of potential to end up as the best ever European goalie to come to play in the NHL.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

No way this kid has that much potential? Au contraire i can't recal the last goalie prospect even close to as good as him. He's absolutely dominated EVERY SINGLE LEVEL, including his short stint in the NHL. It is very much in his range of potential to end up as the best ever European goalie to come to play in the NHL.

You must remember Marc-Andre Fleury before his bad games. He dominated not just a few games, but a bunch! Fleury then wore down, and just couldn't take no more. It's sick, how someone's rating can change because of a bad game. If anyone has a Patrick Roy potential it has to be Marc-Andre Fleury.

 

[McThome]

You must remember Marc-Andre Fleury before his bad games. He dominated not just a few games, but a bunch! Fleury then wore down, and just couldn't take no more. It's sick, how someone's rating can change because of a bad game. If anyone has a Patrick Roy potential it has to be Marc-Andre Fleury.

"a" implies singular. He was extremely sub-par the entire WJC. Then, he returned to his team in the Q where he had a decent end to the regular season but was completely outplayed by Deslauriers.

Lehtonen is noted as being a big game goalie (a la Roy) Fleury is more of a Curtis Joseph to this point if you need to compare him to somebody.

 

[Russian_fanatic]

"a" implies singular. He was extremely sub-par the entire WJC. Then, he returned to his team in the Q where he had a decent end to the regular season but was completely outplayed by Deslauriers.

Lehtonen is noted as being a big game goalie (a la Roy) Fleury is more of a Curtis Joseph to this point if you need to compare him to somebody.

Mind you Clemmensen is a 6-2, and 205 in weight, and in 4 games he had a sv% of .952 and a GAA of 1.00. Also not mentioning that he had 2 shutouts in 4 games.