Who won the Subban/Weber trade?

[General Disarray]

Habs did the right thing by trading Subban. But they should have traded for someone younger.

Having said that, it's hard to argue against them being the winner. They have a #1 D while Nashville traded Subban for picks.

 

[Drifting]

Habs did the right thing by trading Subban. But they should have traded for someone younger.

Having said that, it's hard to argue against them being the winner. They have a #1 D while Nashville traded Subban for picks.

They traded Subban for picks, prospects and cap space that they used for Matt Duchene. I understand as a Habs fan suffering under the delusion that Bergevin is leading the Habs back to glory that you might not comprehend that the Habs would also be better off with those picks, prospects and Duchene than they are with Weber.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

I'm just here for the questionable Subban takes.

You can't win with players "like" Subban, obviously

 

[Miller Time]

Nashville AINEC.

 

[TT1]

Subban is always behind the play and he cant skate. He's also bad in 1v1 coverage vs bigger/stronger players. On top of that hes despised by the majority of his teammates.

I'm not saying that Weber is a speedster but at least he has elite hockey IQ which allows him to stay ahead of plays and make good decisions.

7.8M for Weber right now is peanuts given his lvl of play, he carries a top pairing vs elite opposition. Nashville will have to deal with the final years of his contract due to te recapture penalty. He wont be getting paid any actual money so hes most likely gonna retire before his contract is up. That's Nashville's problem, not ours. Want him back to avoid the cap penalty? Pay up.

Anyone who says this wasnt a win for us doesnt understand shit about hockey. Even Weber's advanced stats are far better than Subban's.. and that was after he came back from a year long injury.

Sorry for sounding like a know it all elitist (as usual) but its the truth. Stop bullshiting yourselves.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Habs would also be better off with those picks, prospects and Duchene than they are with Weber.

No, they wouldn't. [mod]

 

[varsaku]

Nashville clearly. They turned Weber into Duchene and a couple of picks. While habs are stuck with an aging Weber with decreasing trade value.

 

[FerrisRox]

Imagine if the trade never went through? Weber with Ellis, Josi, Ekholm, etc? Subban with Petry, Mete, Chiarot, etc?

Nashville won.

I thought this was pretty well established.

 

[BrokenFace]

I didn't realize that they hadn't built a from strong drafting and player development team for over a decade to only make it to the finals because of Subban. Thank you for informing me.

Subban was a positive part of that building process. You can tell because Subban's seasons in Nashville were some of their best in franchise history and he was getting lots of minutes throughout that period.

You're welcome for informing you.

 

[Soundgarden]

Subban is always behind the play and he cant skate. He's also bad in 1v1 coverage vs bigger/stronger players. On top of that hes despised by the majority of his teammates.

Lol, no.

 

[qqaz]

They traded Subban for picks, prospects and cap space that they used for Matt Duchene. I understand as a Habs fan suffering under the delusion that Bergevin is leading the Habs back to glory that you might not comprehend that the Habs would also be better off with those picks, prospects and Duchene than they are with Weber.

So just by virtue of having cap space, a team get's a free Matt Duchene? I don't think so. That's not how it works.

That's silly logic. Cap space is an asset, it's true. But you can't pretend like every organization could and would have used it the same. It has different value to different teams at different times. Arizona had the cap space, but they didn't get Matt Duchene.

Also, Hall for Larsson wasn't a win for Edmonton because they got a bunch of cap space. They lost the trade because the value they got back was dismal, even when you include the cap space. Trading a good player for nothing isn't a good move, just because you get cap space when they're gone.

You can't tell me that Nashville did a great job trading Subban, because the value they got, even including the cap space, wasn't good enough.

 

[Soundgarden]

So just by virtue of having cap space, a team get's a free Matt Duchene? I don't think so. That's not how it works.

That's silly logic. Cap space is an asset, it's true. But you can't pretend like every organization could and would have used it the same. It has different value to different teams at different times. Arizona had the cap space, but they didn't get Matt Duchene.

Also, Hall for Larsson wasn't a win for Edmonton because they got a bunch of cap space. They lost the trade because the value they got back was dismal, even when you include the cap space. Trading a good player for nothing isn't a good move, just because you get cap space when they're gone.

You can't tell me that Nashville did a great job trading Subban, because the value they got, even including the cap space, wasn't good enough.

I'm sorry, but unless you were living under a rock the past three months I don't see how you could think that Duchene was going to go anywhere else but Nashville. They courted each other for like three years.

I think you've got a point in most cases, like when Boston fans tell you that the Joe Thornton trade was worth it because they got Zdeno Chara seven months after the fact, but I think you're wrong on this one. The deal was made knowing Duchene would be with us.

 

[qqaz]

I'm sorry, but unless you were living under a rock the past three months I don't see how you could think that Duchene was going to go anywhere else but Nashville. They courted each other for like three years.

I think you've got a point in most cases, like when Boston fans tell you that the Joe Thornton trade was worth it because they got Zdeno Chara seven months after the fact, but I think you're wrong on this one. The deal was made knowing Duchene would be with us.

I think you misunderstood part of my point. I apologise if I was unclear.

The post I quoted said that Montreal would have been better off with picks and Duchene than with Weber. But that only makes sense if Montreal had any hope of ever landing Duchene, which we agree they did not.

As for Nashville making room, there still should have been a better way to get the cap space than liquidating a satar player for a poor return. Getting full value for Subban should have been possible. That mistake isn't justified just because they had a good player lined up using the same money.

 

[Soundgarden]

I think you misunderstood part of my point. I apologise if I was unclear.

The post I quoted said that Montreal would have been better off with picks and Duchene than with Weber. But that only makes sense if Montreal had any hope of ever landing Duchene, which we agree they did not.

As for Nashville making room, there still should have been a better way to get the cap space than liquidating a satar player for a poor return. Getting full value for Subban should have been possible. That mistake isn't justified just because they had a good player lined up using the same money.

I see, my mistake.

 

[qqaz]

I see, my mistake.

No worries! I should have worded the point better the first time.

I’m not saying Nashville did a good or bad job trading Subban to NJ. What I’m saying is that the idea that the Habs won the Subban/Weber trade because Nashville traded Subban to NJ is non-sensical.

I agree. The fact Subban was later traded, in itself, isn't a good reason to say that Montreal won the trade. I'm not even sure that they did win.

Seems top me that both teams did pretty well. Montreal is (and should be) happy with Weber, and it's turned out better than originally expected. Nashville has moved on to fix an area of weakness, since the deal wasn't the slam dunk it first appeared to be.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

Just wait until one of those 2nd picks Nashville got from New Jersey turns into a top pairing defenseman...

 

[General Disarray]

They traded Subban for picks, prospects and cap space that they used for Matt Duchene. I understand as a Habs fan suffering under the delusion that Bergevin is leading the Habs back to glory that you might not comprehend that the Habs would also be better off with those picks, prospects and Duchene than they are with Weber.

I'm not a Habs fan.

Saying a trade is good because it gave them cap space is dumb. That would be like Jets fans saying the Trouba return was good because it gave them cap space to resign their RFAs (assuming they do). It doesn't change the fact that the return is poor.

 

[gorangers0525]

Subban is always behind the play and he cant skate. He's also bad in 1v1 coverage vs bigger/stronger players. On top of that hes despised by the majority of his teammates.

I'm not saying that Weber is a speedster but at least he has elite hockey IQ which allows him to stay ahead of plays and make good decisions.

7.8M for Weber right now is peanuts given his lvl of play, he carries a top pairing vs elite opposition. Nashville will have to deal with the final years of his contract due to te recapture penalty. He wont be getting paid any actual money so hes most likely gonna retire before his contract is up. That's Nashville's problem, not ours. Want him back to avoid the cap penalty? Pay up.

Anyone who says this wasnt a win for us doesnt understand **** about hockey. Even Weber's advanced stats are far better than Subban's.. and that was after he came back from a year long injury.

Sorry for sounding like a know it all elitist (as usual) but its the truth. Stop bull****ing yourselves.

Elite hockey IQ and better (far better) advanced stats lmao.

Weber's been a mediocre top pair defenseman for almost half a decade already. Subban didn't have a great 18-19 season, but he was easily a top 3 defenseman the preceding year, something Weber hasn't been in many years...if ever.


The ONLY way Nash loses this trade is if they end up stuck with a huge recapture penalty.

 

[Sharks2020]

Both. Although MTL hasn't had much success, it isn't because of Weber. Weber is a strength to their team and the newest captain. Subban did a ton for Nashville including getting them to a cup final appearance.

I agree with this

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

They traded Subban for picks, prospects and cap space that they used for Matt Duchene. I understand as a Habs fan suffering under the delusion that Bergevin is leading the Habs back to glory that you might not comprehend that the Habs would also be better off with those picks, prospects and Duchene than they are with Weber.

That person is a leafs fan.

Those prospects and picks suck.

Montreal had the space to sign Duchene and they weren't able to, so Montreal would be out a dman and no Duchene.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Preds they freed up the money.

Habs could be f***ed without a buy out a contract free card

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Preds they freed up the money.

Habs could be ****ed without a buy out a contract free card

He'll likely go on LTIR. If he retires Nashville gets slightly f***ed.

 

[glenngineer]

I won because I got to see both of them play for my favorite team.

 

[Fixxer]

Both teams.
Some Montreal players had a sigh of relief when Subban left and got Weber instead.
Nashville were disappointed by Weber in the playoffs and traded him for Subban who's younger and more energetic.

Subban may have high upside.. but he's a wild horse and his personality rubs people off the wrong way after some time..
Weber declined but he still has High hockey IQ and his Elite shot.
The difference between their shot. Subban, more accurate and strong, but not as much as Weber.
Weber shots off target a lot but when it'S on target, what do you see...
I think they've very different, but similar value. One for One was great IMO.