What should be done?

[Peter Sidorkiewicz]

With regards to trading a core player, these are my thoughts.

Cory - No way. Its so hard to get a top 10 goaltender in this league. It would be madness to trade him. Besides I don't see Cory as a core player, he belongs with in the franchise level with Taylor Hall.

Greene - Our defense is bad as it is. Trading Greene will make things far too worse. He is our captain as well. We need as much leadership as we can on this team.

Henrique - No. He is a goal scorer and has youth on his side. There are other more suitable candidates in Cammy and Zajac.

Cammy - Yes. I consider Cammy a core player and he doesn't deserve to be roped into the lessor players category. That being said he is streaky scorer and injury prone so he may soon fall off the cliff like Michael Ryder did. He should be on the trade block for a 1st rounder.

Zajac - Yes. Especially considering how good his season has been to date. Maximise his value now and perhaps get a 1st rounder. If we get 1sts for Cammy and Zajac, it would put us in a good position to head into the draft with 3 1st rounders. I also feel that trading Zajac will fast track Zacha's development. Especially if becomes Hall's new centerman.

 

[Edmonton East]

I do not understand the viewpoint of trading multiple important players for assets, but keeping Cory. It does not make sense to me.

 

[John Pedro]

Trade core players. This core sucks and unless they can find a McDavid out of nowhere we are never going to be a cup contender (That's the goal, right? not just be a WC team who'll get destroyed in the playoffs) with guys like Greene, Zajac and Henrique as our best players.

I'd keep Cory for now cause his value must be at its lowest.

 

[Tundra]

Trade core players. This core sucks and unless they can find a McDavid out of nowhere we are never going to be a cup contender with guys like Greene, Zajac and Henrique as our best players.

I'd keep Cory for now cause his value must be at its lowest.

Besides Schneider and Hall, all of those mentioned are secondary players on good teams. That's how little talent is here.

 

[John Pedro]

Besides Schneider and Hall, all of those mentioned are secondary players on good teams. That's how little talent is here.

Unfortunately, you're right. Zajac and Henrique are probably third liners on any good team. Greene would be a solid #2 or a really good #3 on a good team.

 

[Tundra]

Unfortunately, you're right. Zajac and Henrique are probably third liners on any good team. Greene would be a solid #2 or a really good #3 on a good team.

Henrique could be a top six winger due to his shot, but he's ill suited for center at the upper levels. Zajac would be a great third line center for a prospective cup team because he is defensively responsible and can work along the boards. Greene would be a complimentary piece for a team solidifying their top 3.

 

[VoidCreature]

What I would do:

Keep Hynes and all staff.

Keep
G: Schneider, Kinkaid

D: Greene, Severson, Santini, Lovejoy, Moore, Auvitu

F: Hall, Henrique, Cammalleri, Zajac, Palmieri, Wood, Lappin, Fiddler, McLeod, Bastian, Speers, Gignac


All players in organization not listed I would definitely be willing to move. Zacha, Blackwood obviously being the most noteworthy. Blandisi, Jacobs, Quenneville, Joey Anderson all for sale too.


Ride out the season. Get a high draft pick. (Hopefully, Patrick or that Finnish defenseman)
Use cap space to sign a quality defenseman. (Shattenkirk?)
Use expansion draft to pry a defenseman or scoring winger from somebody for lesser than market value. (Fowler, Brodin, Silfverberg, Ryan Ellis, etc.)

Use Zacha + Blackwood to try to acquire a true #1 center. Duchene?

This is the exact opposite of what we should do. Guys like Zacha, Blackwood and Anderson are our lifeblood. The old core is dead. We need a new one.

The guy I would be most keen on trading is Cammalleri, assuming we can get a decent return.

Greene might be next in line. Trading him would decimate our blue line even further in the short term, but clearly it's not even close to good enough as it is.

Basically, focus on players who can be part of the solution long term. Long term being 4-5 years from now and beyond. I don't think that's how long the rebuild will take, but once it's complete we need to have quality players we can move forward with, not guys on their last legs.

I also want to be clear I don't want to trade someone like Cammy or Greene just to trade them. If we're getting **** all back there's obviously no point. But if we can significantly improve our chances down the road by sacrificing the present, I think that's what we have to do.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

This is the exact opposite of what we should do. Guys like Zacha, Blackwood and Anderson are our lifeblood. The old core is dead. We need a new one.

The guy I would be most keen on trading is Cammalleri, assuming we can get a decent return.

Greene might be next in line. Trading him would decimate our blue line even further in the short term, but clearly it's not even close to good enough as it is.

Basically, focus on players who can be part of the solution long term. Long term being 4-5 years from now and beyond. I don't think that's how long the rebuild will take, but once it's complete we need to have quality players we can move forward with, not guys on their last legs.

I also want to be clear I don't want to trade someone like Cammy or Greene just to trade them. If we're getting **** all back there's obviously no point. But if we can significantly improve our chances down the road by sacrificing the present, I think that's what we have to do.

Talk about overreacting. Team has had a rough 20 game stretch. one month ago when we were 9-3-3 you were probably saying we're gonna go deep in the playoffs this season.
Did the 2010-2011 team need a new core? Was that core dead? Not at all. Just had a rough 50 or so games. It happens.

I just don't like Zacha's game at all. I think he's gonna be like a Jordan Staal type player. So if we can use him to acquire a sick Center or defenseman then I want to do it.

 

[VoidCreature]

Talk about overreacting. Team has had a rough 20 game stretch. one month ago when we were 9-3-3 you were probably saying we're gonna go deep in the playoffs this season.
Did the 2010-2011 team need a new core? Was that core dead? Not at all. Just had a rough 50 or so games. It happens.

I just don't like Zacha's game at all. I think he's gonna be like a Jordan Staal type player. So if we can use him to acquire a sick Center or defenseman then I want to do it.

That team and this one are completely different. We made the playoffs comfortably the year before with a lesser team, and then we made them the year after. JMac literally neutered that squad. We saw last year that Hynes can coach a competitive team. At the start of the year we were fine. He didn't suddenly regress to the nth degree 15 games into his second year. I though we were a bubble team this year, but I was optimistic it would be a bubble in. I never thought we'd go anywhere in the playoffs. Clearly I was right about that part, and wrong about the rest.

This team just isn't good enough. It's not just about making the playoffs, either. We should be trying to win a Stanley Cup. The team we went to the finals with in 2012 is dead. It's never coming back. Lou tried to build it back up through free agency, it didn't work. We need new players. Young players. If Zacha turns into Jordan Staal it would be a disappointment, but Staal is still a very valuable player. In that scenario Zacha would be the next Zajac. He has his detractors, but Zajac has been fantastic for us.

Remember that Zacha is 19. He loves it here. He can be a core piece for the next 15 years. That's the kind of time frame of success I want the new core to be able to provide.

 

[tr83]

If Shero REALLY likes Hynes and is happy with him, maybe they do a Randy Carlysle. Fire him now and bring him back at another time (that is if he's not coaching elsewhere).

 

[Darkauron]

As much as I wouldnt mind seeing Hynes fired, I dont expect it to happen even if we go like 0-13. I think Shero knows that they are underperforming compared to what they should be, but that he also knows that the team wouldnt be great even.

I do feel like something should be done to at least make a message. Whether it is a minor trade, large trade, or even sitting someone like Greene (even though I know it is a very bad idea but would send a message) they need do something.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Giving up on Zacha already or wanting to trade him such a stupid stupid idea. Anyway...

I'd look to move Greene for a 1st and eat salary if need be. I'd also be open to moving Cammalleri if a deal made sense. I'd listen to offers on Cory and Henrique and only if blown away, would pull the trigger. Definitely would move PAP at the deadline for a pick as well. Definitely would look to take advantage of expansion too and grab a defenseman like Brodin, etc. if possible.

Then at the draft, we could keep the picks we acquired and build up our system, or we could use them to trade up, or package them with a prospect to get a player. The last option would fit a retool better than a full rebuild. I'd also look at acquiring a cap dump if it made sense. An overpaid but quality defenseman/center would be fine here, we have so much cap space. Obviously make a huge push for Shattenkirk as well.

 

[Devils Dominion]

Zacha has shown glimpses but he's simply not ready now.

 

[MadDevil]

At this point I'd say just do what we did last year. Ride it out, maybe see if we can get something for a guy like Parenteau (not sure he's worth much but I doubt he's in the long term plan), get a decent draft pick, and look to make a move on defense. Shero has filled holes up front the last two summers, now it's time to address the defense.

I still think the majority of our problems lie more with personnel. The defense isn't very good, most of the forwards we brought in are exactly known for their defensive play, and if you're trying to open it up and getting players thinking offense they're probably going to make more mistakes. I think some of what's going on will normalize and we won't be so bad. Whether Shero is going to have the patience to stick with Hynes through it remains to be seen. If this spirals into a 12 game losing streak, he might be forced to fire him. But then one of the criticisms of him in Pittsburgh was that he stuck by Bylsma too long, so I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

 

[Bleedred]

I'm still not for firing Hynes yet

I also don't understand what he's supposed to be good at either.

He has not shown the ability to coach any kind of possession game, nor a two way game at all. It's either one or the other. Like good offense with terrible defense (getting outshot 49-30 by Pittsburgh), poor defense and no offense to speak of (outshot 49-21 by Montreal and 31-19 by the Rangers and first game of the season against the Panthers), or decent defense with no offense. That pretty much describes last year and quite a few games this year.

There were a couple of good games here and there with a strong two way game, like the first Buffalo game and the game in Dallas. Very few and far between.

And his lineup decisions for the Ottawa game rank even higher than some of Pete's greatest hits.

 

[MadDevil]

When you're not a very good team you're probably not going to be good both on offense and defense. We chose defense last year because of the roster. This year we tried to open it up with newer players. It worked for a while, now it's not. The problem now is this team isn't really built to play the way we did last year anymore. There's no reliable minute eating top pairing to lean on. Our elite goalie is playing the worst hockey of his career. I'm not sure going into turtle mode the whole game is going to be any more effective than what we're doing now.

As for Hynes, I'd like to see what he can do with a team whose #3 and #4 defensemen aren't Ben Lovejoy and John Moore.

 

[Bleedred]

When you're not a very good team you're probably not going to be good both on offense and defense. We chose defense last year because of the roster. This year we tried to open it up with newer players. It worked for a while, now it's not. The problem now is this team isn't really built to play the way we did last year anymore. There's no reliable minute eating top pairing to lean on. Our elite goalie is playing the worst hockey of his career. I'm not sure going into turtle mode the whole game is going to be any more effective than what we're doing now.

As for Hynes, I'd like to see what he can do with a team whose #3 and #4 defensemen aren't Ben Lovejoy and John Moore.

I think he's at fault for leaning on Moore so heavily. Not just this year but last year too.

There's probably not many NHL head coaches that can get this roster into the playoffs, but there's no way that I think Hynes is keeping this team from being worse than it really is. So while he might not be a bad coach, I've seen nothing to tell me he's a really good coach either.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

Firing Hynes is absolutely not the answer. If by game 30 of next season, we still aren't showing signs of improvement, then I say its time to maybe consider a coaching change. The problem with the team this year is the underperforming Cory Schneider and the fact that the team has not ONE top pairing defenseman. We have two #3s in Severson and Greene, a #5 in Lovejoy, and a #6 in Moore. Merrill and Quincey are garbage. And in addition to that, Palmieri is having a rough go, Bennett hasn't been good, Zacha hasn't been good.

 

[MadDevil]

I think he's at fault for leaning on Moore so heavily. Not just this year but last year too.

There's probably not many NHL head coaches that can get this roster into the playoffs, but there's no way that I think Hynes is keeping this team from being worse than it really is. So while he might not be a bad coach, I've seen nothing to tell me he's a really good coach either.

Who else is he going to lean on though? Merrill? Quincey? Auvitu?

 

[Bleedred]

Who else is he going to lean on though? Merrill? Quincey? Auvitu?

I think Quincey is probably better than Moore, Moore is the worst defenseman on the team.

I'm not sure why they love him so much, aside from the fact that he's the second best defenseman at producing offense, and his offense isn't even THAT great or anything special.

 

[Devils Dominion]

Convert Moore to forward.

He has more goals than a lot of our forwards.

 

[MadDevil]

I think Quincey is probably better than Moore, Moore is the worst defenseman on the team.

I'm not sure why they love him so much, aside from the fact that he's the second best defenseman at producing offense, and his offense isn't even THAT great or anything special.

I agree that Quincey is better, but are we going to be any better off with him playing more minutes than Moore? I doubt it.

The fact is that we basically have no second pairing. If Lovejoy was paired with a good #3 who can move the puck, he'd be okay as a second pairing guy, but should probably be a third pairing guy. Everybody else is third pairing or depth defensemen.

 

[Cult of Hynes]

Firing Hynes is absolutely not the answer. If by game 30 of next season, we still aren't showing signs of improvement, then I say its time to maybe consider a coaching change. The problem with the team this year is the underperforming Cory Schneider and the fact that the team has not ONE top pairing defenseman. We have two #3s in Severson and Greene, a #5 in Lovejoy, and a #6 in Moore. Merrill and Quincey are garbage. And in addition to that, Palmieri is having a rough go, Bennett hasn't been good, Zacha hasn't been good.

Firing Hynes is the answer if the losing streak continues on. The coach is responsible for how his team plays, if he can not motivate his players to start performing he is a part of the problem and the person that needs to go. Especially when a lot of issues this team has are not being addressed, and a lot of those issues are offensive and defensive strategies. Can't forget to talk about how they look defeated when they go down a goal or things don't go there way with a no goal etc. Oh, and how bad they are almost every game during the second period.

Uh, Bennett has been one of the best possession players on the team, he's also been stuck with a rookie center and a slow ass DSP for a good portion of the season. Then he was hurt, then he was scratched for some reason for garbage like DSP, Kalinin and Gazdic.

Zacha is a rookie that is being given sheltered minutes and thrown all over by Hynes and his horrible juggling. The times he played with Hall he showed really god promise, when he played on the PP he was showing it as well.

Plus, last game Bennett, Zacha and PAP were the best line on the ice.

It's becoming more and more evident that the issue is Hynes and his coaching, or lack thereof. He is constantly getting out coached and seemingly does nothing to adapt to how the other team is playing them.

 

[Billdo]

There's nothing that can realistically be done that doesn't set back the rebuild that's already been set in motion aside from firing Hynes. I'm not a proponent of that but understand the logic. I don't however think you win anything, in any sport, by cycling through head coaches. Hynes had the team overachieving last year, they're worse than they should be this year, and probably are somewhere in the middle.

 

[Billdo]

... Bennett hasn't been good.

Yes he has.