What say you on the 2013/14 Vancouver Canucks' team "IDENTITY?"

[NYVanfan]

Identity of the Franchise or the team?

Team Identity: Pony with a few tricks

-Ageing core with some bright spots among prospects.
-Sedin line play a possession style of play (detroit-esque), but our exciting mobile offensive-defencemen and two way forwards allows for faster north-south style of play.
-Lacks size and shutdown ability on the bottom 6, and is in dire need of reliable scoring threats on the top 6. Mobile defence can get too offensive and forgets the defense part.

to me this is an underrated part of the problem
they are not, in my view, particularly exciting nor particularly mobile, nor particularly offensive for that matter.
looking at our top-4 NTC dmen, they have between them 5 40+ point campaign in 33 seasons.
we never replaced Erhoff, the one guy who could really skate & join the rush and add an extra dimension to the offense (which has really hurt the Sedins, imo), and the loss of Salo is under-rated as well, IMO. Do any of these other guys pass the puck as well as Salo did?

the woes of our offense are firmly linked to the inability of the D to move the puck quickly and consistently contribute to the offense all over the ice the way guys like Keith, Seabrook, Doughty, Boyle, Shatty, etc ,etc can ... Their best offensive contributions are from blasting away at the point, if we're lucky.

All of our top 4 D are the same -- not particularly offensive, not particularly defensive (save Hamhuis), not particularly fast, not particularly tough ...pretty good at everything, great at nothing.

And their mediocrity at getting the puck up and moving quickly out of the zone is a big part of why the offense is so weak.

 

[School of WristShot]

Lack of elite talent. No top liners either on offense of defense except maybe Henrik. Looks like Sedins are past prime (especially Daniel), Kesler is yeah... Rest of top six guys are mostly 2/3rd line tweeners. Same applies to defense. No true #1 dman who can play on all situations on this team (smooth skating puck mover who can QB a PP while shutting down opposition's top line) Every one of them has glaring holes in their game. Hamhuis is excellent two zone player but mediocre in ozone, Tanev doesn't shoot, Garrison can't hit the net and slow, Bieksa most well rounded but inconsistent, Edler is above all. Bunch of 2/3 guys on a good day and 3/4/5 on a bad day. At this point, I don't blame effort or execution/coaching as much because lack of talent on this team seems more than evident.

 

[Betamax*]

to me this is an underrated part of the problem
they are not, in my view, particularly exciting nor particularly mobile, nor particularly offensive for that matter.
looking at our top-4 NTC dmen, they have between them 5 40+ point campaign in 33 seasons.
we never replaced Erhoff, the one guy who could really skate & join the rush and add an extra dimension to the offense (which has really hurt the Sedins, imo), and the loss of Salo is under-rated as well, IMO. Do any of these other guys pass the puck as well as Salo did?

the woes of our offense are firmly linked to the inability of the D to move the puck quickly and consistently contribute to the offense all over the ice the way guys like Keith, Seabrook, Doughty, Boyle, Shatty, etc ,etc can ... Their best offensive contributions are from blasting away at the point, if we're lucky.

All of our top 4 D are the same -- not particularly offensive, not particularly defensive (save Hamhuis), not particularly fast, not particularly tough ...pretty good at everything, great at nothing.

And their mediocrity at getting the puck up and moving quickly out of the zone is a big part of why the offense is so weak.

Wonder how this team would have performed if Schultz decided to sign here instead of the Oilers.

If Canucks' were going to reset this team to the past (if they still believe this core is good enough to compete for the Cup), maybe they could acquire a Brian Campbell from the Panthers.

 

[Betamax*]

Provided the question is about their identity, and not their play, or level of success, I'd say Torts has done a fantastic job of establishing an identity.

When other players and other teams identify the Canucks as a "tough" team, it says a lot. When you consider that most people's perceptions over the past 5 years or so is that they were skilled, soft and weak.

So, just curious Wolfhard, do you think the Canucks still have a reputation around the league as a "tough" team or was that persona, short-lived, just like, uh, a "Candle in a 100MPH Wind?"

Anyway, I was looking at some basic stats and discovered that the Kings have about 10 players with 90+ hits so far this season. (Lead by Dustin Brown's 184).

Source: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.htm?fetchKey=20142LAKSASALL&sort=hits&viewName=rtssPlayerStats

The Canucks on the other hand, have only two players with 90+ hits (Bieksa and Kesler).

Source: http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.htm?fetchKey=20142VANSASALL&sort=hits&viewName=rtssPlayerStats

Are these stats an accurate reflection of what's being demonstrated on the ice or are Kings' players getting some "home cooking" when it comes to hit stats from their own home ice rink?

 

[fancouver]

As much as fans want to have an identity for their team, I think identities are only for good teams. And Vancouver is no longer a good team, so an identity is irrelevant and non-existent.

I can see Tortorella wants a blue-collar, stiff, heavy pushback, shot-blocking, mental-toughness type of hockey. But with our current crew, they are far from it as they do not have the personnel. It looks like only Higgins is striving in this system. Sestito is buying in and Kassian is still trying to become consistent.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

Elliott is bang on. This team is what it is, to go Bertuzzi in assessment. It's team that's lost it's way that isn't sure what it is. Torts can drill it into them all he likes, they are a team that'll look damn good on some nights and mediocre most nights.

 

[BROCK HUGHES]

NO SKILL ,NO GRIT,NO HEART,,worst Canucks team i have seen in years.

 

[dave babych returns]

It's weird how when you take a decent NHL team, take away two of their top three centers and two or three of their top five defensemen plus a bunch of other guys, take away their coach and have them go several weeks with constant losing and little practice time, how they start to seem listless and lacking in identity.

 

[Betamax*]

It's weird how when you take a decent NHL team, take away two of their top three centers and two or three of their top five defensemen plus a bunch of other guys, take away their coach and have them go several weeks with constant losing and little practice time, how they start to seem listless and lacking in identity.

cyber bro, dave ... this decent team with two of their top three centres and their top 5 d sans Edler for the most part (whom holds the team lead as a negative/minus player) had a record 1 win and 7 losses in the month of January prior to the infamous game against the Flames which got Coach torts banned for 15 days.

Look at how Flames have performed since that incident vs. what the Canucks managed to "achieve" since then.

Interesting that.

BTW, Coach Torts only needs to look in the mirror when it comes to the team having "little practice time."

 

[Grumbler]

Dilapidated.

 

[dave babych returns]

cyber bro, dave ... this decent team with two of their top three centres and their top 5 d sans Edler for the most part (whom holds the team lead as a negative/minus player) had a record 1 win and 7 losses in the month of January prior to the infamous game against the Flames which got Coach torts banned for 15 days.

Look at how Flames have performed since that incident vs. what the Canucks managed to "achieve" since then.

Interesting that.

BTW, Coach Torts only needs to look in the mirror when it comes to the team having "little practice time."

Does this have anything to do with my point?

In case you needed that clarified: this team had an identity, then experienced a ton of adversity (much of which they are still going through) and have come out of it apparently sans said "identity."

It's really not all that much of a surprise.

 

[Drop the Sopel]

It's also not a coincidence that teams that lack in terms of personnel and ability also are known for lacking grit, heart, passion, effort and unfortunately, they usually even lack moxie. The problem is finding moxie on the trade front or in free agency is just so difficult.

The team isn't very skilled, nor deep. If everything went right and they suffered very few injuries, they probably could have finished around 10th overall. Throw in a few injuries to key players and the parity of teams around 10-25 in the league, and they will be fighting to stay in the top 20.

 

[Betamax*]

Does this have anything to do with my point?

In case you needed that clarified: this team had an identity, then experienced a ton of adversity (much of which they are still going through) and have come out of it apparently sans said "identity."

It's really not all that much of a surprise.

Quite frankly, dave, I didn't even know what point you were trying to make, well, other than to come across as an apoligist for Coach Torts.

What exactly was their identity prior to their recent slide during the entire month of January?

Remember they were on struggling well before Henrik and Mike got Hanzel'ed .....

 

[dave babych returns]

Quite frankly, dave, I didn't even know what point you were trying to make, well, other than to come across as an apoligist for Coach Torts.

What exactly was their identity prior to their recent slide during the entire month of January?

Remember they were on struggling well before Henrik and Mike got Hanzel'ed .....

Go back and read some posts from December.. there's a lot about a team that is excellent defensively and tenacious on the forecheck, scoring just enough at even strength, too bad they can't buy a goal on the powerplay but as long as they score just enough they can win.. I am pretty sure you won't have too much trouble connecting the dots.

 

[Betamax*]

Go back and read some posts from December.. there's a lot about a team that is excellent defensively and tenacious on the forecheck, scoring just enough at even strength, too bad they can't buy a goal on the powerplay but as long as they score just enough they can win.. I am pretty sure you won't have too much trouble connecting the dots.

dave, instead of trying to send me on a wild dog case, why didn't you actually define it in this thread in the first place?

 

[LickTheEnvelope]

It's weird how when you take a decent NHL team, take away two of their top three centers and two or three of their top five defensemen plus a bunch of other guys, take away their coach and have them go several weeks with constant losing and little practice time, how they start to seem listless and lacking in identity.

Actually it's mostly just been without Santorelli.

But really the powerplay has been the worst in the league for 2 years... so i'm not sure how you justify that...

 

[dave babych returns]

dave, instead of trying to send me on a wild dog case, why didn't you actually define it in this thread in the first place?

The "wild dog case" is completely up to you.

As for why I didn't take the time to explain the team's identity to you and the honks who get air time on local sports talk radio who are having trouble attempting to define what the Canucks' "IDENTITY" currently is..

Let's just say if I don't feel obliged to spoon feed you that information, I certainly am not going to feel obliged to explain my lack of obligation.

 

[dave babych returns]

But really the powerplay has been the worst in the league for 2 years... so i'm not sure how you justify that...

Yeah I'm not sure either. I certainly didn't try to justify it here.

 

[Betamax*]

The "wild dog case" is completely up to you.

As for why I didn't take the time to explain the team's identity to you and the honks who get air time on local sports talk radio who are having trouble attempting to define what the Canucks' "IDENTITY" currently is..

Let's just say if I don't feel obliged to spoon feed you that information, I certainly am not going to feel obliged to explain my lack of obligation.

well, dave, I was bemused at exactly why you even posted in this thread in the first place. It seemed similar to the rhetoric and spin we hear from GMMG when he tries to explain or justify the team's failures .....

re:

It's weird how when you take a decent NHL team, take away two of their top three centers and two or three of their top five defensemen plus a bunch of other guys, take away their coach and have them go several weeks with constant losing and little practice time, how they start to seem listless and lacking in identity.

 

[dave babych returns]

well, dave, I was bemused at exactly why you even posted in this thread in the first place. It seemed similar to the rhetoric and spin we hear from GMMG when he tries to explain or justify the team's failures .....

re:

Yeah that's because I am unsurprised that a badly slumping team appears to have little or no discernable identity, and admittedly I have a bit of disdain those who embark on futile endeavours to draw conclusions about a relatively permanent attribute (IDENTITY) during a relatively transitive period (a mid season slump).

But I mean at least they are trying to understand what's going on, I have a lot more disdain for those who should know better and embark on those same futile endeavors strictly for the purposes of rabble-rousing..........

 

[Smokey McCanucks]

Our identity is we're ****ing cursed and can't score, the refs hate us and our coach is nuts, all our players are hurt and our powerplay stinks.

 

[David71]

Injury proned.

 

[Betamax*]

Regression ... circa 1997-99 ... kinda joking here, I think.

 

[vector209]

Team identity:

A little discouraged,
Yet stubbornly determined.

The conflict is lovely, dark, and deep,
But they have promises to keep,
And miles to go before they sleep,
And miles to go before they sleep.

 

[Betamax*]

Okay, this isn't an "identity" per se but the way things are going with the team ... the mantra seems to be trending towards, "Suck Bad for Ekblad" ...