News Article: What is wrong with the NHL?

[Drivesaitl]

It sucks for Canadian clubs but mostly for Canadian rivalry, heritage, and history. The current NHL offers none to Canadian clubs. Canadian clubs exist in perpetual also run ether.

The last Canadian SC winner was the Montreal Canadiens in 1993.

The last time it really mattered to be a Canadian club in the NHL was the 90's. There was a halcyon period of rivalry and Canadian teams in Winnipeg, Quebec City, Ottawa, Calgary, Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver, as well as Edmonton. 8 Canadian teams.

Canadian clubs, before realignment, used to actually play each other in the playoffs. Commonly, every season. Remember the Smythe division? 4/5 of the teams in that division were Western Canadian meaning constant Canadian playoff matchups.

Want to see something sad? Upcoming the list of the Oilers playoff opponents since 1992, the last time we played a Canadian team in the playoffs, the Canucks, and beat them 4 games to 2. Most of you readers weren't even born then. Since then the Oilers have played these teams in playoff rounds;

97; Dallas, Colorado
98;Colorado, Dallas
99; Dallas
2000; Dallas
2001: Dallas (were we the Edmonton Oilers or the Houston Oilers, that was the constant gag line as we played the Dallas Stars 5 f***ing seasons in a row)
2003; Dallas stars (f***, again, again we lose)
2006; Detroit, Anaheim, SJ, Carolina (OK I know for playoff starved Oilers fans the run was magical but could we have any less interesting opponents from a rivalry perspective? If a computer pumped out random opponents it would look like this)
2017; SJ, Anaheim.

Our last 14 playoff opponents, spanning 28years, have featured opponents that have no meaningful relationship or rivalry with Edmonton, which when last noted, was located still in Western Canada, not Texas, Not California.

So as we stumble into another playoff season of missing the playoffs, and our opponent on HNIC in one of the last games is Anaheim Ducks (which triggered this thread) I say WTF NHL. Give Canadian clubs something to cheer about and be interested in. Albeit in Calgary, Toronto, and Winnipeg maybe things look a bit different but most of their fans don't remember what Canadian playoff matchups looked like either.

To most posters here, that are younger you have no history with what an Oilers vs Flames matchup ever looked like. Or even Oilers vs Winnipeg. Or Calgary vs Vancouver. Toronto vs Montreal. Montreal vs Quebec City. Some of the best playoff memories ever are contained in those series and it rarely seems to happen now, and especially not in the WC.

I think Canucks and Flames have continued having the occasional Canadian matchup but can't remember the last time that happened.

This playoffs the Maple Leafs would have to go as far as the cup final to see a potential Canadian opponent (god forbid)

The Jets and Flames, being in different divisions (I feel sorry for Winnipeg being all alone) would have to each win their divisions to see a matchup.

As per usual it will be Canadian clubs off to play non rival US opponents.

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[rboomercat90]

The league has been set up for these local rivalries for several seasons now. In theory, it wants exactly what you’re complaining about. Calgary, Edmonton and Vancouver are in the same division. So are Ottawa, Montreal and Toronto. Winnipeg is on their own island but it doesn’t make any sense placing them in the same division as Vancouver, not with a two time zone difference. Maybe you could put them in the East with the Eastern Canadian teams but even that would add to their travel. The problem is most of the Canadian teams can’t get their acts together. That’s the only reason you’re not seeing these matchups you want. Why that is, is a different debate and worthy of its own thread but the current format is set up for the Canadian teams to play each other.

I have a different opinion than you do on this. I hate the same teams playing each other every year. My favourite format was the 1 vs 16 format the league used the first two seasons the Oilers were in the league. That format wouldn’t work today because there are too many teams in the league to balance the schedule and make it fair for everyone. I heard Brian Burke talking about this format recently and he said the league considered it a while back but their biggest problem with it was the possibility of having a first round with several east and west coast teams playing each other. They were terrified of ratings for games that would have Eastern teams starting at 10 pm. Bottom line, according to Burke, is that this current playoff format isn’t going anywhere any time soon.

 

[belair]

The current playoff format, that people pretty much despise, actually promotes these regional matchups to occur. Unfortunately for fans of Canadian teams, their teams haven't managed to get their shit together.

I will state as an aside, the problem the NHL might have in the near future, is how easy it is to build a contending team in the salary cap era for a team starting from $0 with the league's current expansion rules in place. This may carry over to the Seattle franchise.

 

[smokersarejokers]

The current playoff format, that people pretty much despise, actually promotes these regional matchups to occur. Unfortunately for fans of Canadian teams, their teams haven't managed to get their **** together.

I will state as an aside, the problem the NHL might have in the near future, is how easy it is to build a contending team in the salary cap era for a team starting from $0 with the league's current expansion rules in place. This may carry over to the Seattle franchise.

Yeah, I can't believe that the teams agreed to the current expansion rules. Why the hell is Vegas exempt from the Seattle expansion draft?

 

[Hynh]

Yeah, I can't believe that the teams agreed to the current expansion rules. Why the hell is Vegas exempt from the Seattle expansion draft?

The owners agreed to that so they get a 1/30 share of the Seattle money instead of a 1/31 share.

 

[PBandJ]

Yeah, I can't believe that the teams agreed to the current expansion rules. Why the hell is Vegas exempt from the Seattle expansion draft?

Vegas got that in exchange for not getting a piece of the Seattle pie, and that was an easy choice for them I bet.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The league has been set up for these local rivalries for several seasons now. In theory, it wants exactly what you’re complaining about. Calgary, Edmonton and Vancouver are in the same division. So are Ottawa, Montreal and Toronto. Winnipeg is on their own island but it doesn’t make any sense placing them in the same division as Vancouver, not with a two time zone difference. Maybe you could put them in the East with the Eastern Canadian teams but even that would add to their travel. The problem is most of the Canadian teams can’t get their acts together. That’s the only reason you’re not seeing these matchups you want. Why that is, is a different debate and worthy of its own thread but the current format is set up for the Canadian teams to play each other.

I have a different opinion than you do on this. I hate the same teams playing each other every year. My favourite format was the 1 vs 16 format the league used the first two seasons the Oilers were in the league. That format wouldn’t work today because there are too many teams in the league to balance the schedule and make it fair for everyone. I heard Brian Burke talking about this format recently and he said the league considered it a while back but their biggest problem with it was the possibility of having a first round with several east and west coast teams playing each other. They were terrified of ratings for games that would have Eastern teams starting at 10 pm. Bottom line, according to Burke, is that this current playoff format isn’t going anywhere any time soon.

I don't really see how time zone makes all that much difference in an era of air travel. Maybe have more competently arranged schedules and less poorly planned back 2 back games. Vancouver to Winnipeg is a two hour flight, big deal.

Winnipeg being alone in its own division is deplorable. By all means ALL the Western Canadian clubs should be grouped together in the same division. To further interest and possibility of matchups in playoffs.

The E astern Canadian clubs get the benefit of being grouped together, at least, why not the West?

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

The problem isn't the playoff structure, it's that Canadian trams typically haven't been good enough to make the playoffs or last a round.
When was the last time Edmonton, Calgary and Vancouver made the playoffs in the same year?
How often do Ottawa, Toronto and Montreal make it in the same year?

These teams have to make the playoffs to be able to play each other.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The current playoff format, that people pretty much despise, actually promotes these regional matchups to occur. Unfortunately for fans of Canadian teams, their teams haven't managed to get their **** together.

I will state as an aside, the problem the NHL might have in the near future, is how easy it is to build a contending team in the salary cap era for a team starting from $0 with the league's current expansion rules in place. This may carry over to the Seattle franchise.

Regional matchups are somewhat significant across border if its something like Vancouver vs Seattle. Toronto vs Buffalo, Montreal vs Boston etc. Most of what is currently grouped in NHL divisions is not regional. I have zero connection with California, Arizona, and there is no rivalry the Oilers have with any team in the division other than Calgary. Vancouver has never been really a rival because they were never good when the Oilers were (and vice versa, if one could say the Canucks were all that good)

There is no region that encompasses the "Pacific" Division. It makes no sense geographically or otherwise. Being that 3 clubs are far from the Pacific it shouldn't be named that either.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The problem isn't the playoff structure, it's that Canadian trams typically haven't been good enough to make the playoffs or last a round.
When was the last time Edmonton, Calgary and Vancouver made the playoffs in the same year?
How often do Ottawa, Toronto and Montreal make it in the same year?

These teams have to make the playoffs to be able to play each other.

its not outside of the context of the OP, as stated. I'm really bad at picking titles, invariably I am. I never know what the title of a thread should be. The trouble is variegated. Reasons why Canadian clubs are uncompetitive can have anything to do with unconditional support yielding or empowering incompetent running of orgs. Could be NHPA related and players not wanting to play in fishbowl Canadian markets. Any number of factors could be involved.

But the thread is about the Oilers not having faced another Canadian opponent in the playoffs in the last 28 years. That is deplorable, its absolutely ridiculous. That we've played 14 US opponents in that time, and 0 Canadian opponents is I thought very interesting, and indicative of a huge problem. If people disagree with what the cause of the problem is thats fine. I wasn't pencilling in that it was just due to divisional alignment, but that regardless its a sorry state of affairs.

I happen to consider myself luckly to have seen the WHA and the NHL when Canadian Rivalries even occurred, and contributed to legendary civic brouhaha's

People that haven't seen any of those series don't know, frankly, what they are missing in atmosphere.

The saddest thing is that the last time we were even in a SC the opponent was Carolina. Two more diverse opponents could not be had in a final. Albeit Calgary vs Tampa was close. There is zero relevance to these types of matchups in hockey. Thanks Bettman NHL!

This season in EVERY instance a Canadian club will not face another Canadian club unless the unspeakable occurs. Its a very remote scenario.

Sometimes I wish we were still in the WHA with an all Canadian division. The NHL as a concept and product seems to not deliver well to Canadian markets. We love it because its hockey, but outside of that what is the NHL actually doing for Canadian fans?

 

[belair]

Regional matchups are somewhat significant across border if its something like Vancouver vs Seattle. Toronto vs Buffalo, Montreal vs Boston etc. Most of what is currently grouped in NHL divisions is not regional. I have zero connection with California, Arizona, and there is no rivalry the Oilers have with any team in the division other than Calgary. Vancouver has never been really a rival because they were never good when the Oilers were (and vice versa, if one could say the Canucks were all that good)

There is no region that encompasses the "Pacific" Division. It makes no sense geographically or otherwise. Being that 3 clubs are far from the Pacific it shouldn't be named that either.

I'm being pretty lenient when calling it regional simply due to geography and the fact that a 32 team league is unlikely to have a large contingent of teams in a very small area outside of the Metro division area. Western Canadian teams would certainly fall under this criteria.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I'm being pretty lenient when calling it regional simply due to geography and the fact that a 32 team league is unlikely to have a large contingent of teams in a very small area outside of the Metro division area. Western Canadian teams would certainly fall under this criteria.

Yeah. To me I could even handle a division with all 4 WC clubs and Minny and Seattle. Those would at least make some kind of sense within a regional perspective and Seattle and Vancouver and Minny and Winnipeg seem to have some rivalry and affinity.

Cali teams should probably be grouped with Colorado, Arizona, that makes the most sense and if needed throw in Dallas.

The Florida clubs make it a regional shit show as they don't fit anywhere and geographically are damn far away as its possible to get from say Edmonton or Vancouver. Really I question why NHL had to go into Florida in the first place. Teams should be compensated for having to fly all the way down to those far off markets that have nothing to do with hockey.

 

[Kyle McMahon]

I dislike the fact that franchises in places like Anaheim even exist in the first place, so I agree with this to a point.

But the reason the Oilers haven't played a Canadian team in the playoffs since 1992 is mainly on the Oilers.

We've made the playoffs a laughable 8 times since then. 6 of those times the Flames sucked and missed the playoffs. 6 of those times the Canucks sucked and missed the playoffs. Winnipeg didn't have a team for most of the time. The Oilers, Flames, and Canucks have never all made the playoffs in the same year since the old Smythe Division days. The format doesn't matter when the Canadian teams seldom qualify anyway.

If you want to argue that they should make it more often even with mediocre to bad teams by virtue of the league contracting several garbage franchises like Anaheim and Arizona and having a Western Conference where 8 out of 12 teams make it, I would be fully on board.

 

[smokersarejokers]

Vegas got that in exchange for not getting a piece of the Seattle pie, and that was an easy choice for them I bet.

I know, but why are they given this option and other teams aren't?

I'm sure a team like Toronto would much rather keep a young asset instead of getting a few million bucks.

 

[rboomercat90]

I don't really see how time zone makes all that much difference in an era of air travel. Maybe have more competently arranged schedules and less poorly planned back 2 back games. Vancouver to Winnipeg is a two hour flight, big deal.

Winnipeg being alone in its own division is deplorable. By all means ALL the Western Canadian clubs should be grouped together in the same division. To further interest and possibility of matchups in playoffs.

The E astern Canadian clubs get the benefit of being grouped together, at least, why not the West?

The time zone issue has nothing to do with travel. It’s about fans not being able to watch their team play until late at night. It’s annoying enough waiting for Oiler games on the west coast to start at 8 or 8:30 pm, add another hour to that for Winnipeg if you place them with Vancouver. That’s the reason Columbus, Detroit and Toronto all moved to the Eastern Conference, that’s 10- 10:30 start times. The league wants teams in the same time zone for this reason.

It isn’t deplorable that Winnipeg is the only Canadian team in their division. It might be unfortunate but it’s what they wanted because they didn’t want the bulk of their divisional games starting so late at night. Geography works against them.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I dislike the fact that franchises in places like Anaheim even exist in the first place, so I agree with this to a point.

But the reason the Oilers haven't played a Canadian team in the playoffs since 1992 is mainly on the Oilers.

We've made the playoffs a laughable 8 times since then. 6 of those times the Flames sucked and missed the playoffs. 6 of those times the Canucks sucked and missed the playoffs. Winnipeg didn't have a team for most of the time. The Oilers, Flames, and Canucks have never all made the playoffs in the same year since the old Smythe Division days. The format doesn't matter when the Canadian teams seldom qualify anyway.

If you want to argue that they should make it more often even with mediocre to bad teams by virtue of the league contracting several garbage franchises like Anaheim and Arizona and having a Western Conference where 8 out of 12 teams make it, I would be fully on board.

Part of my feeling is that there ought to be around 9-10 Canadian NHL clubs. The NHL doesn't accommodate this, and I think at their ultimate peril. I wonder if there comes a time, after several decades of the current NHL arrangement not servicing any Canadian success or even significant Canadian competition whether there should be an alternate Canadian league. I would support that one instead, and forget about the NHL, gladly.

The CFL, and now the fledgling Canadian Soccer league may indicate that Canadians like to see Canadian competition. Its uncompetitive, pun intended, for the NHL to not provide this to Canadian Cities in this heartland of hockey. I wish for better than the NHL is serving Canadian markets, or Canada in general.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The time zone issue has nothing to do with travel. It’s about fans not being able to watch their team play until late at night. It’s annoying enough waiting for Oiler games on the west coast to start at 8 or 8:30 pm, add another hour to that. That’s the reason Columbus, Detroit and Toronto all moved to the Eastern Conference. The league wants teams in the same time zone for this reason.

It isn’t deplorable that Winnipeg is the only Canadian team in their division. It might be unfortunate but it’s what they wanted because they didn’t want the bulk of their divisional games starting so late at night. Geography works against them.

Thanks, sorry I missed that, good point.

heh, perhaps because I'm a lifetime night owl and infamous insomniac. (I'm sleep agnostic ) It doesn't even really occur to me that it would be hard, tiresome, or bothersome to watch late night matchups. I always quite enjoy late Pacific starts. I'd probably enjoy them even if they started at 11pm, lol. I guess I could survive in Newfoundland.

That said I'm not aware that Winnipeg, or Winnipeggers (what do they call them?) wanted this specific arrangement. Anybody I know in Winnipeg is kind of sad that the NHL has put them in an all US division. The NHL has really broken up WC. That's the only comments I've ever read.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I'm not alone, heres an article supporting an all Canadian division;

Why not have all Canadian NHL teams in one division? | The Star

 

[Kyle McMahon]

Part of my feeling is that there ought to be around 9-10 Canadian NHL clubs. The NHL doesn't accommodate this, and I think at their ultimate peril. I wonder if there comes a time, after several decades of the current NHL arrangement not servicing any Canadian success or even significant Canadian competition whether there should be an alternate Canadian league. I would support that one instead, and forget about the NHL, gladly.

The CFL, and now the fledgling Canadian Soccer league may indicate that Canadians like to see Canadian competition. Its uncompetitive, pun intended, for the NHL to not provide this to Canadian Cities in this heartland of hockey. I wish for better than the NHL is serving Canadian markets, or Canada in general.

It's possible it reaches a point where a second WHA pops up with a focus on Canadian markets, but probably not in the near future. But unfortunately for now there are just too many people and too much money in the US for it to go back to a better balance like it was in the past (8 Canadian teams, 13 American teams). Economic realities mean franchises in markets where 99% of the population doesn't give the slightest crap about the sport of hockey (Anaheim, Miami) are still more profitable than teams in Quebec City or Saskatoon would be. Perhaps one day this will change but it seems doubtful.

 

[rboomercat90]

Thanks, sorry I missed that, good point.

heh, perhaps because I'm a lifetime night owl and infamous insomniac. (I'm sleep agnostic ) It doesn't even really occur to me that it would be hard, tiresome, or bothersome to watch late night matchups. I always quite enjoy late Pacific starts. I'd probably enjoy them even if they started at 11pm, lol. I guess I could survive in Newfoundland.

That said I'm not aware that Winnipeg, or Winnipeggers (what do they call them?) wanted this specific arrangement. Anybody I know in Winnipeg is kind of sad that the NHL has put them in an all US division. The NHL has really broken up WC. That's the only comments I've ever read.

Like I’ve said, I don’t like to see the same teams playing every year. I hated that the Oilers played Dallas five years in a row. I really hoped they would go back to that 1 vs 16 format. In that regard, I agreed with you about travel itself not being a big enough issue not to do it. It wasn’t until I heard Brian Burke explain the reason they’d never do it again was because of having a bunch of first round series having 10:30 pm east coast start times. They could live with that happening in the finals for one series but that was as far s they were willing to go. I hadn’t considered that before either and it made me realize that this was likely the best format after all. With such a big league now there aren’t any perfect options.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Like I’ve said, I don’t like to see the same teams playing every year. I hated that the Oilers played Dallas five years in a row. I really hoped they would go back to that 1 vs 16 format. In that regard, I agreed with you about travel itself not being a big enough issue not to do it. It wasn’t until I heard Brian Burke explain the reason they’d never do it again was because of having a bunch of first round series having 10:30 pm east coast start times. They could live with that happening in the finals for one series but that was as far s they were willing to go. I hadn’t considered that before either and it made me realize that this was likely the best format after all. With such a big league now there aren’t any perfect options.

As a kid I always just inferred that it would be super fantastic to be in the East, even NFlD, and be watching a playoff game until 4am in 4th OT period. haha. I loved staying up as long as I could. I used to beg my parents to take me to Dusk to Dawn driveins. They relented occasionally but were concerned with what else I would be seeing not on the screens...

My parents were permissive in the sense that if it was hockey playoffs they would let me watch till the game finished. So that I was always wishing for a game that would never end and see if I had to go to school...heh.

About the latest it ever got was 1;30am MST though..

Its going to be interesting as an experiment to see how Halifax and its fans do with the CFL. My take is they eat it up. I don't think for a lot of zealous fans it really matters when the games are played or how late.

 

[oilers'72]

The Oilers played Winnipeg 6 times, Calgary 5 times, Vancouver twice and Montreal once up to 1992. The only one I'd consider significant was sweeping Montreal 3-0 in 1981. Only the 1990 series against the Jets may be memorable for the Alpo Suhonen comments that set a fire under the Oilers, who overcame a 3-1 deficit to win the series. The 1986 Calgary series is known more for how the Oilers forgot how to play playoff hockey, played like Bob Johnson got into their heads, and gifted the Flames the series.

 

[RegDunlop]

@Drivesaitl

You must recall Slats championing an all Canadian division for years no?

 

[Ritchie Valens]

I don't really see how time zone makes all that much difference in an era of air travel. Maybe have more competently arranged schedules and less poorly planned back 2 back games. Vancouver to Winnipeg is a two hour flight, big deal.

Winnipeg being alone in its own division is deplorable. By all means ALL the Western Canadian clubs should be grouped together in the same division. To further interest and possibility of matchups in playoffs.

The E astern Canadian clubs get the benefit of being grouped together, at least, why not the West?

The format for each series would be simple to alleviate air travel time. Instead of the playoff series' going 2-2-1-1-1, changing it to 2-3-2 would likely solve that.

This ties in with @rboomercat90
1 vs 16, 2 vs 15 (and so) format...but then how do you sort out conference champions in that format.

Maybe something like a CFL cross over could work too? Top 6 teams from each conference make it and the last four teams league wide with the highest points get in (top 16 in the league). If it's two from the west and two from the east, everyone stays put in their respective conference but if it's 3 east teams, two higher seeded teams stay east and one crosses over to the west and vice versa. As the league standings sit at the moment, the Habs would cross over to the West and knock the Avs out. The catch is once you cross over, you play out your season in that conference.

 

[ConcernedOilersFan]

Yeah. To me I could even handle a division with all 4 WC clubs and Minny and Seattle. Those would at least make some kind of sense within a regional perspective and Seattle and Vancouver and Minny and Winnipeg seem to have some rivalry and affinity.

Cali teams should probably be grouped with Colorado, Arizona, that makes the most sense and if needed throw in Dallas.

The Florida clubs make it a regional **** show as they don't fit anywhere and geographically are damn far away as its possible to get from say Edmonton or Vancouver. Really I question why NHL had to go into Florida in the first place. Teams should be compensated for having to fly all the way down to those far off markets that have nothing to do with hockey.

Because Tampa Bay is one of the model non-traditional markets, has had stellar attendance for years, committed ownership/front office and a star-studded roster? It's pretty petty to make such silly statements when the stats take only a five second Google search to be seen. Tampa Bay, Nashville, Dallas, and Vegas are solid franchises, I'm sorry, but this post reeks of envy. Well, guess what, we could've been like them quite possibly had Katz not let Chia commit seppuku by trading the future for f*** all in 2015.

The reason Canadian teams haven't succeeded is not because of the NHL hating Canada (if they did, the Oilers would be in Houston right now), it's because Canadian teams are run by old boys clubs who put themselves over the teams. If the Oilers had a real owner with a proper front office, McDavid wouldn't be carrying this sad sack team the past several years, but they don't, and that's why Canadian teams continue to fail time and time again.

The owners don't have to bother trying because people will still follow the teams no matter what: the Flames have essentially been mediocre their entire history sans '89, and yet they still draw big crowds. The Oilers have been Cleveland Browns-level bad, and yet still draw big crowds. And so on, and so forth.

People here have said (I've been a lurker) that if McDavid goes, the Oilers would essentially wither and die, but I disagree. Sure, you'd see a lot of anger and rage, but you'd also see "real" fans saying that you should still stick with the team, no matter how bad the team becomes without McDavid. Hockey in Canada is essentially coasting, doing as little as possible, a lot like European soccer where only a select few clubs are actually worth supporting; Canadian teams don't need to try because fans will still support them. You may be thinking, well, isn't that good? Sure, but what that does is breeds complacency. Canadian fans are too complacent - look at how the city of Edmonton willingly bent over the table when it came to the arena deal, for example. Why didn't the city tell Katz to sod off? Sure, he could've just said alright, I'll move the team, but where would he have moved to?

You can blame "garbage franchises" and geographical distance all you want, but until Canadian fans grow a spine and actually demand their teams shape the hell up, nothing will change. If you disagree, that's fine. We're all entitled to our own opinion.

Just don't come crying here saying you're done with hockey when McDavid bails for an American team in the next few years while Katz laughs it up over red wine and overpriced burgers.