What Happened to The Devils?

[LemonSauceD]

Travis “that’s a great team over there” Green is going to “great team over there” the Devils into a high draft pick.

 

[JKG33]

They're a pretty soft team that overachieved last season, and lost some key veteran d-men in Severson and Graves that they wanted to replace with kids... but that's not always as smooth a transition as it sounds. Combine that with Hamilton getting hurt and the goaltending falling back down to earth and its the perfect storm for a terrible season

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Everyone thought they were cup favorites. Oops.

 

[Fatass]

I get the goaltending sucked but it's the same tandem as last season, behind a much shittier defense.
Most devil fans claimed that losing Severson and Graves being replaced by Hughes and Nemec would be an upgrade, it wasn't.

As a nucks fan I've seen bad defense and the devils are sharks level easy to play against. It seems that fans of teams with shitty defense always lay the blame on goaltending because it's harder to fix a dcore than a goalie.

And if we're being brutally honest, the forwards are mostly below average defensively and last year was a fluke.

I see a club with too many similar types of players who play too much on the wrong side of the puck. Yes, they get points and look great with the puck on their stick but that’s less than 5% of a player’s time on ice. What are these players contributing to winning the other 95% of the time? They need more guys who play like Heisher. The right way and the winning way.

 

[tmg]

All of the well documented goaltending woes aside - their shooting has been absolute garbage since the all star break. At the all star break they were close outsiders for a playoff spot. And they fell out losing 8 of Ruff’s last 13 games … shooting 4.2 %. 12 goals on 285 shots in those 8 losses. Outshooting opponents 35 shots per game to 27. Shooting that poorly in front of prime Hasek wouldn’t result in wins.

Getting goalied happens. But when it happens 8 times in 13 games at the most crucial point of the season it’s a major problem that really can’t be blamed on the goaltending and defense.

 

[Nyr88nyg]

Flash in the pan frauds

 

[22FUTON9]

I’m kind of curious about Jack Hughes. I know he was injured but it seems like he really slowed down after that hot start.

I thought he was going to break into that next tier right under McDavid this year (kuch, mack, Matthews etc…) He still might, but definitely didn’t have the huge jump I thought he would have.

 

[thaman8765678]

You put an average goalie in their net and they are easily in the playoffs.

They basically have to score 5 goals per game or it's a loss. Their goalies they have been rotating in and out wouldn't make most teams backup position.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

I get the goaltending sucked but it's the same tandem as last season, behind a much shittier defense.
Most devil fans claimed that losing Severson and Graves being replaced by Hughes and Nemec would be an upgrade, it wasn't.

As a nucks fan I've seen bad defense and the devils are sharks level easy to play against. It seems that fans of teams with shitty defense always lay the blame on goaltending because it's harder to fix a dcore than a goalie.

And if we're being brutally honest, the forwards are mostly below average defensively and last year was a fluke.

Sharks level

Funny how there isn’t a single metric that bears this out.

All of the well documented goaltending woes aside - their shooting has been absolute garbage since the all star break. At the all star break they were close outsiders for a playoff spot. And they fell out losing 8 of Ruff’s last 13 games … shooting 4.2 %. 12 goals on 285 shots in those 8 losses. Outshooting opponents 35 shots per game to 27. Shooting that poorly in front of prime Hasek wouldn’t result in wins.

Getting goalied happens. But when it happens 8 times in 13 games at the most crucial point of the season it’s a major problem that really can’t be blamed on the goaltending and defense.

Honestly, with all that’s gone wrong it says a lot that they were even in the race up to the TDL.

 

[Magic Mittens]

Goaltending is their biggest weakness, injuries definitely didn't help, and coaching was another weak spot.

I think they'll be back in the mix of things next season

 

[Anglesmith]

They seem a lot like Calgary last year. They can outshoot teams 42-23 and give up the five best chances of the game, because they just can't stop making big errors in structure and discipline.

From an outsider's perspective, just like with the Flames last year, it's very easy to just number watch and say that it's the goalies' fault. But when every goalie you put in there suddenly can't achieve their normal numbers, there's obviously something systematic going on. I think there has been objectively bad goaltending throughout, but sometimes that is a result more than the underlying cause; goalies always seem to try to do too much when they are getting scored on too regularly.

For the Flames, it seems as though the issues that crept in may have been due to distraction based on the coach and the locker room dynamics. Some players seemed to be playing with resentment. For the Devils the root cause may be entirely different, but all I'll say is that I think a Markstrom trade would have had higher likelihood to destroy Markstrom's numbers than to improve the Devils' goaltending numbers.

 

[Anglesmith]

Sharks level

Funny how there isn’t a single metric that bears this out.


Honestly, with all that’s gone wrong it says a lot that they were even in the race up to the TDL.

Just for perspective, there were no metrics available last year to encapsulate what the Flames were doing wrong defensively. You literally had to just watch the goals. This year, they have fixed a lot of the critical issues. Their possession numbers are worse, the "high danger chances" are up, and lo and behold both goalies have rebounded to normal numbers.

There's the type of chances you are giving up, and then there is the way you are defending those chances. If you don't defend situations at a league average level, you can't expect league average results. For example, a shot from the slot has a certain expectation leading to XGA. If the defending team is pressuring that shot and forcing the shooter off-balance, the current metrics do not have a way to account for that vs. just letting it be open season.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

They seem a lot like Calgary last year. They can outshoot teams 42-23 and give up the five best chances of the game, because they just can't stop making big errors in structure and discipline.

From an outsider's perspective, just like with the Flames last year, it's very easy to just number watch and say that it's the goalies' fault. But when every goalie you put in there suddenly can't achieve their normal numbers, there's obviously something systematic going on. I think there has been objectively bad goaltending throughout, but sometimes that is a result more than the underlying cause; goalies always seem to try to do too much when they are getting scored on too regularly.

For the Flames, it seems as though the issues that crept in may have been due to distraction based on the coach and the locker room dynamics. Some players seemed to be playing with resentment. For the Devils the root cause may be entirely different, but all I'll say is that I think a Markstrom trade would have had higher likelihood to destroy Markstrom's numbers than to improve the Devils' goaltending numbers.

Sabres have been similar in the past- we can largely outplay a team, but the opposing team wins 3-2 off 5 awful turnovers/breakdowns. For Devils and Sabres I can definitely see coaching as part of it, we really struggled to open up our offense without giving up 2-on-1s and such to start the year. Now UPL is doing well behind that same suspect team, however, so that’s weird. Still, while the Sabres have had mediocre goaltending for 3+ years, the team certainly doesn’t put em in a position to look good. Craig Anderson, for example, mighta played a lot better here than his numbers would indicate.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Goaltending, defensive, coaching. Injuries don’t help.

One thing that hasn’t been mentioned is the way the team is built. All their best players are small. 6’1 or shorter and less than 200 pounds. Not that 6’1 is short. I think it’s NHL average, but their best players aren’t taller, heavier, and stronger. The only two of them are Hamilton and Meier. Hamilton is injured, so it furthers my point. You need a better blend. They’ve brought in some players like MacDermid and Nosek who bring that, but it’s better when it comes from your best players.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

Just for perspective, there were no metrics available last year to encapsulate what the Flames were doing wrong defensively. You literally had to just watch the goals. This year, they have fixed a lot of the critical issues. Their possession numbers are worse, the "high danger chances" are up, and lo and behold both goalies have rebounded to normal numbers.

There's the type of chances you are giving up, and then there is the way you are defending those chances. If you don't defend situations at a league average level, you can't expect league average results. For example, a shot from the slot has a certain expectation leading to XGA. If the defending team is pressuring that shot and forcing the shooter off-balance, the current metrics do not have a way to account for that vs. just letting it be open season.

The Devils are generally mid-pack for defensive metrics this season (aside of course from GA). There's literally nothing that suggests they're as bad defensively as the Sharks as that poster said.

 

[Anglesmith]

The Devils are generally mid-pack for defensive metrics this season (aside of course from GA). There's literally nothing that suggests they're as bad defensively as the Sharks as that poster said.

Not quite literally, because there's actually two big ones: the more objective one is that basically every goalie has performed below the standard they have set in all other situations in their career, and the more subjective one is how many goals go in where you realistically wouldn't expect a save.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Last season they were good and looked to be trending in the right direction. This season I kept thinking they may make a push for a playoff spot at some point, but now it seems like they're almost certainly going to miss the post season in 2024.

What are the reasons they fell so hard, and will they rebound next year?

They were trending in the right direction last season. World class goaltending can give you the illusion you are better than you actually are.

I would know as a Rangers fan watching Lundqvist mask so many team flaws for a decade plus.

Getting a decent goaltender and coach should put them right back in the playoff picture. They have too much talent to stay this bad next year, but are currently still a bit raw.

 

[britdevil]

Lindy Ruff served up some utter dross 3 out of 4 years.

The one year he did well, he had a good coach beside him to lean on.

There's more to it, but he was chief among the shit. Ruff, goaltending, injuries and roster losses. Probably in that order.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

Not quite literally, because there's actually two big ones: the more objective one is that basically every goalie has performed below the standard they have set in all other situations in their career, and the more subjective one is how many goals go in where you realistically wouldn't expect a save.

So how many teams are "Sharks bad" defensively, then? Must be more than a half dozen if the Devils aren't anywhere near the bottom of the league in defensive metrics and yet, because they're goalies don't stop pucks, they must be the worst team in the league defensively. It doesn't make any sense.

The first is not at all true. Schmid/Daws are young goalies that have never put up good numbers for any stretch, and Vanecek was a career backup before NJ with one purple patch last season before shitting the bed in the playoffs. If anything he reverted to the mean and I don’t think anyone that actually watched him play consistently this season, and the goals he gave up, was any appreciable consequence of the play around him. If anything, he had a more negative impact on the defense than the other way around.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Everything went right last season for them.

Everything is going wrong for them this season.

They probably bounce back and end up somewhere in the middle.

Brunette was definitely a loss for them though.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

They were trending in the right direction last season. World class goaltending can give you the illusion you are better than you actually are.

I would know as a Rangers fan watching Lundqvist mask so many team flaws for a decade plus.

Getting a decent goaltender and coach should put them right back in the playoff picture. They have too much talent to stay this bad next year, but are currently still a bit raw.

The best descriptor for the goaltending they got last season would generously be “slightly above average”. There was nothing “world class” about Vanecek last season.

 

[Scrantonicity 2]

Management without a clear sense of direction. The buck stops up top and Fitzgerald has been aimless.

 

[Section 104]

They had a graphic a few games ago that the Devils have given up the second most “first goal of the game” in whatever period they used, sooty don’t remember. But it’s not like they have been a bad team…you expect the Sharks or Blackhawks to be number two. But that has to put them behind the eight ball. Certainly not impossible to overcome a one goal deficit but it doesn’t help. Don’t know what would cause it either for a decent team.

Maybe they are like the 2017-18 team that went on strength of Hart Trophy winner Taylor Hall from 70 to 97 points (mid pack goals for and against) and fell to 72 the next year with bad scoring and defense (Hall missing 50 games).

 

[Dijock94]

They’re extremely young and talented, they will figure it out. Maybe need a bit more grit and sandpaper in the lineup and definitely a goalie or Schmid to emerge

 

[Osakahaus]

Travis “that’s a great team over there” Green is going to “great team over there” the Devils into a high draft pick.

Yet another top pick that'll make the Devils great...eventually. Hey Alexander holtz is supposed to be good, I guess he's easily going down the same path that my good friend Oliver Wahlstrom did as well.