What Happened to Stamkos?

[Sky04]

It's odd because before the leg injury he was headed towards a developmental trajectory of being a beastly all around dominant center. But for maximum effectiveness it's probably better he try to be Mike Bossy and not Steve Yzerman.

Yeah he was absolutely dominant but that was a stretch 17 games out of his entire career where the stars just aligned for him. He could've had a beastly year had he finished it but for the majority of his career his usefulness comes from not much else but his shot.

 

[Stephen]

this sums it up. He's got a great sniping shot, he's right handed, and he's speedy, but he's lost some of the speed due to the leg injury, then lost some stability with the blood clot injuries, and St. Louis was never really "replaced", they pigeonholed one of Kucherov (awesome talent), Callahan (average middle 6 winger), or Drouin (great talent, but still a rookie) into his RWer, and that's definitely hurt him.

I would have loved to have him on the Rangers to see what he and Zuccarello could have done together--that would have been more magical than Disney on Ice.

Alas, Stamkos is still a great player. He'll follow Crosby's point path in the NHL, probably will continually put up 70-80 point seasons without a hitch. He'll start declining 4 years into his contract into a 60 point player, and then 2 years after that, he'll be a 50 point player. Not the end of the world, and the price you pay for a generational talent.

Luckily, Stamkos does have age on his side. he is still only 25 years old

From my viewings, the idea that he's lost speed because of the leg thing is a false narrative. He's still got that great straight line speed and long straight leg dash, powerful first stride, but he's relatively weak maintaining high speed when it comes to maneuvering laterally.

 

[RegularSznAllStars]

From my viewings, the idea that he's lost speed because of the leg thing is a false narrative. He's still got that great straight line speed and long straight leg dash, powerful first stride, but he's relatively weak maintaining high speed when it comes to maneuvering laterally.

Exactly. Those saying he has lost a step due to the leg injury clearly dont watch this team. His leg is fine. Just as fast now as he was before the break.

 

[SPF6ty9]

Exactly. Those saying he has lost a step due to the leg injury clearly dont watch this team. His leg is fine. Just as fast now as he was before the break.

Just watching him play it looks like he's constantly a step slower to the play. If it's not the leg it must be something mental whether it's being tentative after the injury or changing his style of play, but to me it appears like he's just getting to the puck slightly too late. He still should have the physical talent to dominate if the leg is fully recovered, it might just be something between the ears slowing him down from being a more effective and disruptive player.

 

[Stephen]

Just watching him play it looks like he's constantly a step slower to the play. If it's not the leg it must be something mental whether it's being tentative after the injury or changing his style of play, but to me it appears like he's just getting to the puck slightly too late. He still should have the physical talent to dominate if the leg is fully recovered, it might just be something between the ears slowing him down from being a more effective and disruptive player.

Don't think he's half a step behind. His acceleration and speed through open ice in a straight leg dash is fine. His exposiveness is fine. His lateral mobility and maintaining speed on turns isn't the best. He probably seems a step behind on plays because traditionally one of his assets as a sniper is his ability to disappear in the background only to reappear out of nowhere on a one time feed or jumping on a rebound. But now that he doesn't have a tailor made playmaker on his wing to feed him with nearly the same efficiency so he has to cover more of the ice, win more puck battles, carry the play more.

One thing I'm really not liking with Stamkos lately is his lack of puck control. Seems like he makes a lot of errant passes, coughs things up under very little pressure and deteriorating ability to control the puck like a classic centerman.

 

[dechire]

He's tried really hard to play a different style of hockey and he's bad at it. There are probably some physical issues after his broken leg but they aren't the big problem. His mental game has been crap for 2 years. If he can get back to playing to his actual skillset and no longer making dumb plays then he'll return to being a great player. Never as good as he was before but he's no longer in his goalscoring prime. Ovechkin isn't either and he's doing just fine.

 

[MessierII]

Martin St. Louis leaving

 

[authentic]

Hockey player prime is getting younger and younger. Usually players produce their most productive seasons before what we actually consider their "prime" age. However, they're usually more complete players between 24-28 than they are before that. The speed of the game and the wear and tear on the body is making it harder and harder to keep up. Remember how many 40 year old skaters there used to be? Not so much anymore. Teams start looking at guys sideways at 35 now. The Vincent Lecavalier, Eric Staal, Brad Richards, Thomas Vanek, Corey Perry, Dany Heatley generation coming to that stage of their careers are massively less effective than stars of previous generations in how they age.

This is all false. A study was shown here that said elite players on average are at their best statistically at ages 27-28 in the past 30 years. The last 5 seasons have featured 3 of the best 40+ year olds we've ever seen (besides Howe in the 70s) in Selanne, Lidstrom and Jagr. Thornton is still a high end elite player, Ovechkin is hands down the best goal scorer in the league still at 30. Crosby had his best full season relative to the league at 26 and Kane just had a similarly dominant season at 27. I'm not sure where this comes from because I see this quite a bit on here but it's not true, players are not statistically peaking before 25 like you are making out here, players have been able to sustain their prime years longer as time has gone most likely due to better health from diet, training and in healing injuries.

 

[Harvey Birdman]

It's simple a broken limb is not an easy thing to regain form from. I've had two breaks, each on separate limbs... The full recovery is long term and that limb is rarely what it was prior to break.

And he lost St. Louis.

Combine those two things and you'll see a decline. He is young enough with the right line mate I believe he will return to form before his career is up. But he is going to have to fully adapt to a changed leg and get the right line mate at almost the same time at this point for it to happen.

Can it happen and do I believe it will happen? Yes. But it's a wait and see with him with a return to form.

 

[authentic]

A lot of people talk about the leg with Stamkos but as some have mentioned they don't think his speed has declined at all, I think this may be true and to be honest though I had thought I noticed a slight decline the bigger decline to me seems to be the way he handles the puck. He doesn't seem to carry it quite as well or maneuver through defenders like he used to.

 

[Harvey Birdman]

A lot of people talk about the leg with Stamkos but as some have mentioned they don't think his speed has declined at all, I think this may be true and to be honest though I had thought I noticed a slight decline the bigger decline to me seems to be the way he handles puck. He doesn't seem to carry it quite as well or maneuver through defenders like he used to.

Being someone that's broken multiple limbs I can tell you it's not s strength, speed, or necessarily movement thing... It's that the limb heals slightly differently than it formally was and you have to relearn muscle memory with that limb. In any sport you rely heavily on muscle memory, especially if it's a leg break in a foot heavy sport like hockey. You have to understand it's a relearning, learning curve on a limb break.

 

[Holtbyisms]

Stamkos is unreal good in terms of goal scoring ability. But unfortunately he plays in the same era as a guy who wears #8. That's not putting Stammer down by any means it's just not even fair to compare any pure goal scorer to Ovechkin right now. I think he's on the second tier below Ovechkin so he doesn't get the credit he's due. That said, the second tier imo only consist of him. He's the second best pure goal scorer in the NHL.

Ovechkin
...
Stamkos
...
...
...
...
Whoever you wanna throw in there.

 

[garmonbozia]

Severely broke his leg. Busted ass to try and rehab in time for the Olympics, came up short. The unfortunate drama of Marty St. Louis' departure. The supremely fortunate development of Cooper's AHL All Stars and the metamorphosis of the team in his absence. Being made Captain. I believe he tried to play like pre-injury Stamkos the rest of that season (he physically couldn't then), and the team got swept out of the playoffs (Bishp).

At this point I believe Stamkos made a conscious choice to change his game. To be a better Captain. To play more responsible. Take fewer risks. Score more timely goals than just more goals. To buy in to Cooper's system, execute it, and hold others accountable for doing the same. To work on deficiencies more than strengths To model the necessary discipline and effort. It has come at a cost. He hasn't looked as dominant as pre-leg break Stamkos. It has also come with benefits.

The team he Captains has since gone to the Finals and Conference Finals. Obviously I wouldn't contend Stamkos being Captain as being the most instrumental aspect in the team's success. I would contend that the rest of the team buys in to the system as much as Stamkos does. They echo and support their Captain. They emulate his dedication and effort. They have far fewer doubts of Stamkos' ability than fans seem to.

Stamkos is trying to undergo an Yzerman-esque transformation.

 

[FinnLightning26]

Stamkos should take notes from Ovechkin. Stop trying to be that all-around playmaking center because you're not one. He seems to think about the plays way too much nowadays. His best attribute is easily his shot and he doesn't use that nearly enough to his advantage. When you look at the highlights from his 50 and 60 goal seasons, many times he just plain beats the goalie with his shot. He doesn't do that anymore.

God I hope he starts clicking with Drouin. If he does, there's a chance he returns to his former self. I'm not too convinced he will though.

 

[Vagrant]

This is all false. A study was shown here that said elite players on average are at their best statistically at ages 27-28 in the past 30 years. The last 5 seasons have featured 3 of the best 40+ year olds we've ever seen (besides Howe in the 70s) in Selanne, Lidstrom and Jagr. Thornton is still a high end elite player, Ovechkin is hands down the best goal scorer in the league still at 30. Crosby had his best full season relative to the league at 26 and Kane just had a similarly dominant season at 27. I'm not sure where this comes from because I see this quite a bit on here but it's not true, players are not statistically peaking before 25 like you are making out here, players have been able to sustain their prime years longer as time has gone most likely due to better health from diet, training and in healing injuries.

1. Tell me what age Alexander Ovechkin scored his career high in goals.

2. Tell me what age Sidney Crosby scored his career high in points.

3. Do the same for Malkin.

4. Do the same for Stamkos.

5. Do the same for virtually every star player in the league.

 

[pm88]

I often wondered this about Stamkos as well. I basically thought he'd be neck and neck with OV for being the most elite goal scorer in the game with the way his career started out. I understand the broken leg thing, but guys can recover from that, right?

I was under the assumption that Tampa is one of those most ridiculously talented teams in the league as well, so it's interesting how they haven't had anyone who matches up with Stamkos' playing style.

He's still young, though. I don't think he's peaked at all, he just needs to find that one player who matches his skill set

 

[Sam Spade]

At this point I believe Stamkos made a conscious choice to change his game. To be a better Captain. To play more responsible. Take fewer risks. Score more timely goals than just more goals.

The team he Captains has since gone to the Finals and Conference Finals. Obviously I wouldn't contend Stamkos being Captain as being the most instrumental aspect in the team's success. I would contend that the rest of the team buys in to the system as much as Stamkos does. They echo and support their Captain. They emulate his dedication and effort. They have far fewer doubts of Stamkos' ability than fans seem to.

Yes, I'm sure he made a conscious decision to score less.

He literally had NOTHING to do with the teams playoff success last season.

The year they went to the Final, I think most would agree he was a disappointment, while Johnson was the superstar.

 

[BayStreetBully]

Stamkos is trying to undergo an Yzerman-esque transformation.

Stamkos is too young to undergo an Yzerman-esque transformation. If he can't keep up his production while playing Selke caliber defence like Fedorov or Datsyuk, then he should stick to scoring goals. As long as he isn't being irresponsible defensively, he's most valuable doing what he does best- scoring.

 

[authentic]

1. Tell me what age Alexander Ovechkin scored his career high in goals.

2. Tell me what age Sidney Crosby scored his career high in points.

3. Do the same for Malkin.

4. Do the same for Stamkos.

5. Do the same for virtually every star player in the league.

Career highs in points? You mean they scored more points when multiple players were getting 90-100 compared to when scoring became one person above 90 per year? Shocking. Ovechkin scored his highest rate of points relative to the league when he was 24. Crosby at 26 despite playing way more defensively as well as playing with a wrist injury for the last month of the season. Malkin had his best season at 25. Stamkos broke his tibia and lost St. Louis... is there anything else I'm missing here?

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Do TB fans think that Drouin can turn into that playmaking winger that Stamkos needs?

I think he's not only that winger, but more IMO. He has a shot that looks about as dangerous as anyone on the team after Stammer, and if he threatens to use it often enough that goalies and defensemen don't cheat towards Stamkos we could see some real magic from this pair.

1. Broke his leg. Was playing arguably his best hockey before that.

2. Linemates and system changed. Stamkos used to play with St. Louis, who suited him almost perfectly, and in a system that was more open than most others in the NHL. Not so anymore.

3. Misguided attempt to play a different style. Stamkos spent last year trying to be a traditional centre, and he just isn't.

4. Goal scorers peak earlier than other players. Its natural that Stamkos would peak early.

Is it me, or has his ability to carry the puck for any length of time in the offensive zone also diminished to next to nothing over the past couple of years? He was always fairly dependent on St. Louis being the puck carrier and has that wonderful ability to "ghost" it but he used to be way better at controlling things.

Watching him try to carry the puck in against any kind of opposition has been painful.

 

[Vagrant]

Career highs in points? You mean they scored more points when multiple players were getting 90-100 compared to when scoring became one person above 90 per year? Shocking. Ovechkin scored his highest rate of points relative to the league when he was 24. Crosby at 26 despite playing way more defensively as well as playing with a wrist injury for the last month of the season. Malkin had his best season at 25. Stamkos broke his tibia and lost St. Louis... is there anything else I'm missing here?

Yes. The answer to every single one of those questions.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

He didn't want to risk injury until his contract got re-upped. Watch his production explode now that he's got guaranteed cash flow.

 

[tony d]

That leg injury really hurt him (Pun intended), think he may get 40 goals this year.

 

[Rufus]

Leg injury, improved team around him, and St. Louis being traded are all things that could have had an impact on him scoring less.

 

[beowulf]

Probably a mix of a few things people have brought up from injuries to changes in scoring league wide etc. Still a great player to have in the lineup.