Post-Game Talk: we looked pretty good for the first couple periods

[HIFE]

3 points outta last place in the conference. And the teams below us have a game or two in hand. Not a great game for Coreau although I wouldn't read too much into that. Hopefully he gets more shots, we need to know which players are going to be worth holding onto when we eventually lose all the awful contracts and become decent again, hopefully starting in 2022-23. The key is bottoming out over the next couple years and having Holland retire. Until then let's ride Blash and Holland until the wheels fall off.

Well also 4 points out of a wildcard spot. In the PO thread many are hesitant to guarantee the Wings miss out, and for good reason. The scary possibility is the Wings dragging themselves very close, ending in 17th/18th.

6 years is loong time in the NHL there will be contract changes before that. Retirements, LTIR, buy-outs, trades, things can happen. Holland isn't as brain-dead as we like to joke about here.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Well also 4 points out of a wildcard spot. In the PO thread many are hesitant to guarantee the Wings miss out, and for good reason. The scary possibility is the Wings dragging themselves very close, ending in 17th/18th.

6 years is loong time in the NHL there will be contract changes before that. Retirements, LTIR, buy-outs, trades, things can happen. Holland isn't as brain-dead as we like to joke about here.

Are we playing like a team that's trending towards wild card status or are we trending like a team that's gonna be in the basement? Pretty clear if you ask me. Holland had a great run and no one can ever take that away from him. He's simply playing out the string and if we're lucky he retires after next season. He's shown absolutely no inclination to transform this roster and his drafting has been abysmal.

Best case scenario is we get an elite talent or two during Holland's final two years, pick so high up the board even he can't screw them up. Then the next GM comes on board and starts making decisions geared towards becoming relevent and competitive once again, not the incredibly low bar of being the 8th or 9th best team in the conference.

 

[FissionFire]

At some point you have to think that ownership will pull the trigger on Holland and replace him. Heck of Ilitch wasn't afraid to can Dombrowski I can't see how Holland is safe.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Even if they win the game, Babs won the battle. It's pretty clear that he got out at the right time.

What is clear about that? Toronto is still a bad hockey team and Babs is unlikely to be around when they are actually successful.

He does get paid a lot more before he gets cycled out though, absolutely agree with that.

What Babs bricked was going to Buffalo in my opinion, but ultimately I understand wanting to live in Toronto over Buffalo. When he doesn't get it done in Toronto and they turn on him in the next several years it won't damage his legacy though so it wasn't a bad choice.

You're right that Holland begged him.... Several sources around the team had a don't let the door hit you on the way out though. So the pro-Babs and anti-Holland crowd should realize seemingly one of the only backers Babcock had when he was leaving was the same guy they say isn't adapting and goes the safe route with players that aren't going to produce as much going forward... Curious why that doesn't apply to Saint Babcock.

Unfortunate third period to say the least last night. This team is hard to watch. I will continue to do it, but there are times they are hard to discuss. The execution is sporadic and simply not up to the standards required at this level. We have real problems. Luckily the NHL has bunched the standings over the years but we look nowhere near a playoff team right now. We lack consistency and not just game to game, but right down to shift to shift. If you don't have tons of talent you better be consistent as heck in the NHL and we have neither area right now.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

At some point you have to think that ownership will pull the trigger on Holland and replace him. Heck of Ilitch wasn't afraid to can Dombrowski I can't see how Holland is safe.

Dombrowski never had as close a relationship with the family as Holland does. Keep in mind Dave Dombrowski had a very contentious relationship with Denise Ilitch at one point. Holland's time also completely dwarfs the amount of time Dombrowski spent with an Ilitch organization.

He is likely to be treated like Jimmy D, he will move up and have a different job. But they need to begin planning this move, it isn't working and we need a transition plan for management over the next couple years.

I have said since the middle of this summer I would be a fan of Paul Fenton from Nashville. Retire Jimmy D for good and move Holland into his roles within the organization.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Holland will leave when he wants to. Ownership is not going to force him out. It's pretty obvious they approve of what he is doing.

 

[Fear]

It's also a team that's injured and relying on rookies or players with little NHL experience.

4 of the Wings top 5 scorers are over 30. The other is 27.

 

[SimplySolace]

Like he was any good prior to surgery... He's not an NHL caliber player.

Or y'know, he needed back surgery, maybe.

That and the fact he was playing with offensive juggernauts like Glendening and Miller..

 

[SoupGuru]

Sorry, but I'm going to hang this game on Jurco defending open ice while Kessel scores the game winner.

 

[Wood Stick]

What is clear about that? Toronto is still a bad hockey team and Babs is unlikely to be around when they are actually successful.

He does get paid a lot more before he gets cycled out though, absolutely agree with that.

What Babs bricked was going to Buffalo in my opinion, but ultimately I understand wanting to live in Toronto over Buffalo. When he doesn't get it done in Toronto and they turn on him in the next several years it won't damage his legacy though so it wasn't a bad choice.

You're right that Holland begged him.... Several sources around the team had a don't let the door hit you on the way out though. So the pro-Babs and anti-Holland crowd should realize seemingly one of the only backers Babcock had when he was leaving was the same guy they say isn't adapting and goes the safe route with players that aren't going to produce as much going forward... Curious why that doesn't apply to Saint Babcock.

Unfortunate third period to say the least last night. This team is hard to watch. I will continue to do it, but there are times they are hard to discuss. The execution is sporadic and simply not up to the standards required at this level. We have real problems. Luckily the NHL has bunched the standings over the years but we look nowhere near a playoff team right now. We lack consistency and not just game to game, but right down to shift to shift. If you don't have tons of talent you better be consistent as heck in the NHL and we have neither area right now.

Based on absolutely nothing? He's signed for 6 more seasons. He's not going anywhere. Went from getting the first overall pick to a 10-9-5 record which is fairly impressive. Has a super young team with elite talent coming up in Matthews, Marner and Nylander with complimentary pieces like JVR, Kadri, Bozak and Komarov.

Toronto was the right choice. They will be better than Buffalo. This team will be a threat very, very shortly. Shore up the D, allow the forwards to develop. Probably a playoff team next year.

The Marlies are also looking damn good too. The talent will continue to come in and out. They have the ability to become the next Detroit Red Wings.

 

[Wood Stick]

Or y'know, he needed back surgery, maybe.

That and the fact he was playing with offensive juggernauts like Glendening and Miller..

He's spent time with Dats and Z too.

 

[ap3x]

To me, one of the most frustrating trends this season is not having tied one single game yet with the goalie pulled. You just know that the game is over already.
As harmless as our PP so far.

 

[19 for president]

There is something going on with this team, and I can no longer ignore the coaching. This is not a great team, but the level of execution is horrific. This team has no identity, and is beyond inconsistent. They are never going to be more than a bubble team with this defense, but parts of the game like our PP should be significantly better. A unit that can ice Vanek, Green, Z, Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha, Sproul, Kronwall, AA, Sheahan should score PP goals. Its absurd that our PP is so bad. Its ridiculous that our offensive execution is so bad. I can understand why we get hemmed into our zone, we have a lousy defense, but there is zero reason we should be so bad in the offensive zone. Having no system in place is how you end up with the mess that was the Oilers org for 10 years. Rookie mistakes costing you games is one thing (like Sproul the other day), but the young guys need to be in a system to form good habits. I'm starting to think Blash can't come up with one at the NHL level.

 

[Pavels Dog]

There is something going on with this team, and I can no longer ignore the coaching. This is not a great team, but the level of execution is horrific. This team has no identity, and is beyond inconsistent. They are never going to be more than a bubble team with this defense, but parts of the game like our PP should be significantly better. A unit that can ice Vanek, Green, Z, Nyquist, Tatar, Mantha, Sproul, Kronwall, AA, Sheahan should score PP goals. Its absurd that our PP is so bad. Its ridiculous that our offensive execution is so bad. I can understand why we get hemmed into our zone, we have a lousy defense, but there is zero reason we should be so bad in the offensive zone. Having no system in place is how you end up with the mess that was the Oilers org for 10 years. Rookie mistakes costing you games is one thing (like Sproul the other day), but the young guys need to be in a system to form good habits. I'm starting to think Blash can't come up with one at the NHL level.

The PP is horrific. We just keep dumping the puck in. We may not have a Datsyuk around to give us free zone-entries, but it should be possible to come up with a strategy that means entering the zone with possession.

 

[19 for president]

The PP is horrific. We just keep dumping the puck in. We may not have a Datsyuk around to give us free zone-entries, but it should be possible to come up with a strategy that means entering the zone with possession.

Exactly or if you are going to dump the puck in design a strategy so that you have guys like Mantha, AA, Larkin, etc flying up the wing to retrieve the puck. I mean only Z and Vanek are guys that I would say are below average skaters on our PP units. There is zero reason we should routinely be beat to pucks with the man advantage. Our PP problems are not a personnel problem. Vanek is one of the best net front guys in the league. Green is a very good PP QB, Sproul has a great point shot, AA/ Larkin have the speed for great entries, Mantha has that booming shot/ net front skills, Nyquist has a solid shot, Tatar is snake bit but still has a good shot, Z's shot is dead but he still has great vision. No movement & no possession PPs are a joke.

 

[Cursed Lemon]

The PP is horrific. We just keep dumping the puck in. We may not have a Datsyuk around to give us free zone-entries, but it should be possible to come up with a strategy that means entering the zone with possession.

I'm sorry, is the neutral zone drop pass not good enough for you?

 

[SoupGuru]

I'm sorry, is the neutral zone drop pass not good enough for you?

I'm pretty sure Kronwall drops that pass in his dreams.

 

[wings95]

He got better for a while. Reverted back.

Seems like it!

 

[SoupNazi]

How in the world does a collapse like that happen?

This is on Blashill. The dude is an idiot.

 

[Henkka]

How in the world does a collapse like that happen?

This is on Blashill. The dude is an idiot.

********. Pittsburgh were just better team. Moronic to blaim Blashill about everything.

Pittsburgh outplayed and outworked us in the 3rd. Kronwall was missing for 10 minutes and DeKeyser was double-shifted and dead tired. Sproul was really really bad etc.

 

[chances14]

********. Pittsburgh were just better team. Moronic to blaim Blashill about everything.

Pittsburgh outplayed and outworked us in the 3rd. Kronwall was missing for 10 minutes and DeKeyser was double-shifted and dead tired. Sproul was really really bad etc.

if it was just a one time thing, then sure chalk it up to a bad night

but this is happening ALOT

wings have been near the bottom of the league when it comes to winning percentage when leading after two periods for the last couple years now.

something is amiss

 

[TheMule93]

How in the world does a collapse like that happen?

This is on Blashill. The dude is an idiot.

I don't see it as a collapse, I see it as a regression to the mean type thing.

We were unsustainably lucky for the first two periods, the score ended up reflecting how well we played the game imo.

First period train wreck, decent 2nd period, 3rd period train wreck

 

[ap3x]

********. Pittsburgh were just better team. Moronic to blaim Blashill about everything.

Pittsburgh outplayed and outworked us in the 3rd. Kronwall was missing for 10 minutes and DeKeyser was double-shifted and dead tired. Sproul was really really bad etc.

To me it's rather "moronic" to always make excuses for him. Explaining this just by saying that the Pens were simply the better team is way too easy & not really cutting it. Two goal lead may be nothing if a team like this comes out playing in the third. But even losing it in regulation after being up 3-1? Nah, just not acceptable.

I feel u, not everything should be pinned on Blash. But in games like that, it totally showed how bad he actually is at his job. Line shuffling from the other night & Lashoff in over Sproul did so as well. One of the few things that work consistently right now is the Pk. That's about it. You've got glances of great places here and there, but not to that degree that a working system is noticeable.

 

[Henkka]

He picks Lashoff over Sproul and team wins a game and gets only blame about his decisions.

That's nothing but biased thinking. Sproul was horrible against Pittsburgh defensively and Lashoff was quite mistake-free. Nothing wrong on the decision.

But keep blaiming.

 

[ap3x]

The point is not benching Sproul due to two games that he ****ed up in. The point is bringing up Brian ****ing Lashoff for him. He wasn't assigned to the Griffins without a reason. And seeing him on that Kronner-pairing, you got reminded about that. But keep telling yourself, it being "quite mistake-free". Kronner and him are the only pairing with minus stats.

And did you even see how we went on winning this game? Choking in the 3rd again after holding the lead twice. Blashill got blamed for shuffling the lines as he did. And playing such a game against a team that sits last in our conference was not really disproving those concerns as being unjustified. Plus, Lashoff over Sproul most definitely wasn't a reason for winning that game.

But yeah, keep defending.