GDT: We have a game tonight? Devils vs. Senators, 7pm, MSG+

[Emperoreddy]

To me the big problem is this is still just a team of parts right now. Parts that don't fit yet.

You have plenty of nice pieces that work in a good team, but we are missing the rest to make this work as a cohesive unit.

Not just first line talent either, but effective role players too. Just a full line of three that have great chemistry and become a sum better than there parts.

I haven't seen any real chemistry all year outside of maybe the Zacha-JJ-Nosen. If we had lines with chemistry I think we wouldn't see as many flubbed passes as we do. So many breakouts die in the neutral zone due to flubbed passes.

 

[TheUnseenHand]

Virtually the entire team is complimentary pieces. They have nothing to compliment.

 

[devilsblood]

I'll kick the dead horse too... I haven't ever really agreed with a lot of you guys complaining about the officiating in years past. However, this year it has been absolutely terrible. I DO NOT think that it has really cost us any games overall, but it certainly doesn't help. The Wilson hit on Moore still irks me especially when Zacha gets a game misconduct for one with way less intensity or aggression.

I don't like to complain about it either. It's frequently used as an excuse for a losing team, but this is more the state of officiating in the league right now. It's been very inconsistent, and tonight was a great example.

Same. Since about the time of the boardings, maybe a little more, I feel we have seen a large % of calls go against us. Some really bad ones.

So I have gone right past the general "bad state of officiating" to wondering "Is there something going on here?".

And I hate even talking about ref's, let alone blaming them, or worse crying conspiracy but geez.

 

[devilsblood]

Wood better stop fighting so much or he will get punched out of the league like Dennis Pederson.

Agree on this also. But last night was not his doing.

He is not especially good at it either, certainly not where he should be mixing it up with experienced fighters.

I give him credit for being willing, and I can not deny his play, to an extent anyway, is asking for it, but it really is not his game.

 

[217 Forever]

That's why I'm saying, Shero needs to do something to make a noticeable improvement with the offense next year. Either do that or eek out 2-1 wins, which is impossible with Hynes system.

Shero said on day one that you need to score more than 1 or 2 goals (forgot the exact quote) to win games and we've scored 1 or 0 goals in almost 30% of this year's games and I don't even know about last year. We're 29th in goals for this year, we were 30th last year. We need to be at least 25th next year, I'm hoping for even more but I think 25th shouldn't be too much to ask for. He said on the day he was announced as GM here, that you need to score goals to win games and that sounded like a direct shot at how pathetic the offense was in years prior to him being here.

Next year will be 3 years he's been here, it's fair game to complain if we're 3 years in and seeing no improvement in goals scored and no improvement in points gained in the standings. It's put up or shut up time. If we're sitting here at 29th or 30th in goals for and 85 points at the end of the 17-18 season, I think it's fair for even the most rational and patient fan to start wondering if we need a new coach and even questioning if the GM is really doing that good of a job, other than the Hall trade. Which was great and I'll never second guess that one ever. We have not otherwise improved though. At that point, someone needs to take responsibility though, whether it's the head coach or the GM. It's really not an accomplishment to jump from the league's 29th scoring team to 25th in a year. So if he can't do that, that may just be an indictment on him as a GM, or it's time to really consider finding a coach that runs a better system than this.

Shero says he has the green light to spend. I'm not sure I believe him, but if he truly does then it better happen this summer whether it's signing a UFA (and overpaying if necessary) or taking on a salary dump from another team. The only thing worse than being a bad team is being a bad and boring team. You just can't keep asking people to pony up to see one goal a night.

 

[Brooklyndevil]

There are times I think Shero needs to break it down completely and start from scratch.

 

[NJRockinRoller]

Shero says he has the green light to spend. I'm not sure I believe him, but if he truly does then it better happen this summer whether it's signing a UFA (and overpaying if necessary) or taking on a salary dump from another team. The only thing worse than being a bad team is being a bad and boring team. You just can't keep asking people to pony up to see one goal a night.

I definitely do not believe him. These guys are not spending money on this hockey team, Shero has to build with what he has.

If you were spending money, Shattenkirk is the guy. Perfect guy at perfect time. This would also be the time to trade for his rights. Spend one of the many picks they have - and will probably add a couple more mid rounders next week via Parenteau and Quincey - and buy his exclusive rights as soon as possible to be aggressive on making a deal. The Devils have never done this but it worked last year with Goligoski in Arizona and Yandle in Florida. This works. This is the guy to spend on.

But Shero does not have the green light.

 

[devilsblood]

Shero says he has the green light to spend. I'm not sure I believe him, but if he truly does then it better happen this summer whether it's signing a UFA (and overpaying if necessary) or taking on a salary dump from another team. The only thing worse than being a bad team is being a bad and boring team. You just can't keep asking people to pony up to see one goal a night.

Well I don't want to see them spend a ton on bad signings, which certainly can happen in UFA.

I'm OK with a dump, if the return is good, and the incoming contract does not extend more then 2 years out.

There are times I think Shero needs to break it down completely and start from scratch.

Nah, need Zacha to pan out, and need to find one big time d-man.

Easier said then done, but I don't think we need all sorts of players.

Really one big time player would change things dramatically. Again, easier said then done.

 

[devilsblood]

I definitely do not believe him. These guys are not spending money on this hockey team, Shero has to build with what he has.

If you were spending money, Shattenkirk is the guy. Perfect guy at perfect time. This would also be the time to trade for his rights. Spend one of the many picks they have - and will probably add a couple more mid rounders next week via Parenteau and Quincey - and buy his exclusive rights as soon as possible to be aggressive on making a deal. The Devils have never done this but it worked last year with Goligoski in Arizona and Yandle in Florida. This works. This is the guy to spend on.

But Shero does not have the green light.

Not with 100% confidence, but I disagree, I don't think the time has been right to spend.

 

[NJRockinRoller]

Not with 100% confidence, but I disagree, I don't think the time has been right to spend.

I hope you are right. I agree that the time hasnt been right to this point, so it is believable that he has the green light and just hasnt used it.

But I just don't believe it. I don't believe anything TNR says. I am forever grateful to them for keeping the team in NJ and ending the nightmare that was the financial mess and getting stability under the team. But I don't think they care about winning hockey games and/or titles. Just my impression and I hope to be proven wrong.

 

[217 Forever]

I hope you are right. I agree that the time hasnt been right to this point, so it is believable that he has the green light and just hasnt used it.

But I just don't believe it. I don't believe anything TNR says. I am forever grateful to them for keeping the team in NJ and ending the nightmare that was the financial mess and getting stability under the team. But I don't think they care about winning hockey games and/or titles. Just my impression and I hope to be proven wrong.

The logical side of me agrees I just hope I'm wrong. It's fine to be patient and try to rebuild "the right way", but this is still professional sports and people pay to be entertained. We're on four years now (not all with these owners I get that) of mostly dreadful boring hockey. Nobody is expecting a parade down Broad St anytime soon but this is just not acceptable. Shero and Harris/Blitzer have to prove to me as well that they are serious about giving us SOMETHING to hold out hope for.

 

[NJRockinRoller]

The logical side of me agrees I just hope I'm wrong. It's fine to be patient and try to rebuild "the right way", but this is still professional sports and people pay to be entertained. We're on four years now (not all with these owners I get that) of mostly dreadful boring hockey. Nobody is expecting a parade down Broad St anytime soon but this is just not acceptable. Shero and Harris/Blitzer have to prove to me as well that they are serious about giving us SOMETHING to hold out hope for.

I believe that Shero is serious and I trust him. I don't think he has support from above, and when he says he does I think he's frankly lying to cover for his bosses who at the end of the day, still put food on his table.

I have no issues with Shero at this point outside of my oft-stated frustration with the lack of a at least quasi-tank that has cost this nowhere-bound team invaluable draft slots in the last two years.

 

[217 Forever]

I believe that Shero is serious and I trust him. I don't think he has support from above, and when he says he does I think he's frankly lying to cover for his bosses who at the end of the day, still put food on his table.

I have no issues with Shero at this point outside of my oft-stated frustration with the lack of a at least quasi-tank that has cost this nowhere-bound team invaluable draft slots in the last two years.

I probably should have stated it differently. Certainly Shero is doing the best he can at the moment with what he has to work with and would love to give us a winner I'm sure. Problem is we don't know what we don't know.

 

[Better Call Sal]

There are times I think Shero needs to break it down completely and start from scratch.

Based on what? This team isn't complete, anyone who thought so was fooling themselves.

When are people going to realize that it was not possible for this rebuild to happen overnight? Who realistically believed that this patchwork defense would hold up over the full season?

It's obviously frustrating, everyone wants the team to win now, but Shero is still forming this team to what he wants it to be. And in the midst of all of this, we're still giving quality minutes and playing time to first year players like Zacha, Santini, Wood and to prospects like Blandisi and Coleman in the middle of this rebuild. We have tons of cap space, very few long term contracts and plenty of draft picks to trade for players should we see the opportunity.

If you see past the fog of ineptitude that this season is falling into, things look good for us. Just have to play the cards right.

 

[devilsblood]

Edit:

Critique on Hall.

In the O-zone, too often we see him carrying the puck on his off wing from down near the goal line all the way up to the point, basically squeezing the d-man out of the play, putting himself in the vicinity of 2 d-men, and forcing him quite often into a turnover.

Not good hockey, needs to keep the puck deep there(or Hynes needs to devise a play where LD dives through the middle there, which in itself is dangerous).

 

[devilsblood]

Based on what? This team isn't complete, anyone who thought so was fooling themselves.

When are people going to realize that it was not possible for this rebuild to happen overnight? Who realistically believed that this patchwork defense would hold up over the full season?

It's obviously frustrating, everyone wants the team to win now, but Shero is still forming this team to what he wants it to be. And in the midst of all of this, we're still giving quality minutes and playing time to first year players like Zacha, Santini, Wood and to prospects like Blandisi and Coleman in the middle of this rebuild. We have tons of cap space, very few long term contracts and plenty of draft picks to trade for players should we see the opportunity.

If you see past the fog of ineptitude that this season is falling into, things look good for us. Just have to play the cards right.

Well that is an interesting point in that, were Moore and Lovejoy patchwork guys? Certainly Quincey and Frenchey were, but those 2 I think were meant to be key players.

Neither guy has worked out very well. So that is a reasonable critique on Shero. To be fair, those were both 3 year deals, not 5 or worse, so relatively short term, but still, better signings could have produced much better results.

 

[Better Call Sal]

Well that is an interesting point in that, were Moore and Lovejoy patchwork guys? Certainly Quincey and Frenchey were, but those 2 I think were meant to be key players.

Neither guy has worked out very well. So that is a reasonable critique on Shero. To be fair, those were both 3 year deals, not 5 or worse, so relatively short term, but still, better signings could have produced much better results.

Really depends on perspective. Expectations from my standpoint were that Severson's role would expand, Lovejoy would stabilize a lower pairing and Quincey would fill a role in there as well. Very few people saw Merrill being a reliable option at all, let alone a staple in the top 4 at this point. Moore was signed to a deal that I'm sure they were hoping would realize some untapped potential as he was still fairly young and has some talent on the offensive side. Unfortunately, that hasn't been enough to make up for his inability to play basic defense. This amount of questions going into the season with almost every defender on the team is what brought concern from the very beginning.

The problem has been that these guys are playing in roles above their talent level, same goes for some guys on offense. That speaks to this being a work in progress more than anything. Couple that with uncharacteristic down years from Schneider and Cammalleri, guys we needed to rely on heavily to be successful, and the results kind of speak for themselves.

 

[devilsblood]

I expected more from Lovejoy.

Moore, I guess is what the scouting report says he was, but yes did hope for some untapped potential to blossom.

But just the same, these are not patchwork guys. 3 yr deals each. I think when each was signed the thought was "top 4". Have they played to that level?

 

[Better Call Sal]

I expected more from Lovejoy.

Moore, I guess is what the scouting report says he was, but yes did hope for some untapped potential to blossom.

But just the same, these are not patchwork guys. 3 yr deals each. I think when each was signed the thought was "top 4". Have they played to that level?

Patchwork may not be the best term to have used, but what better term is there? 3 year deals at the money we gave them is not what I consider a long term investment. A guy like Moore especially where you hope to have him develop the weaknesses in his game further. They're still easily expendable. The other point remains, what better options were there? If there were any, odds are they were worth more money that we weren't willing to give. Or worth more term, which is why I'm sure they let Schlemko walk.

And what more could you have expected from Lovejoy truthfully? There's a guy who really is what he is, and he's playing way above what his role should be. Split hairs as much as you want, but he's barely ahead of Severson for 2nd on the team on average TOI behind Greene. Obviously that could be a result of killing more penalties than powerplays, but still no one expected nor wanted him playing top 2 minutes because he'd be exposed for his flaws.

EDIT: This Penguins fan really nailed it in the Lovejoy signing thread from the summer

If its 2.75 or less its not a bad deal.

+ Great team guy
+ Can PK

- Ices the puck no joke 4-6 times a game
- Can kill offensive plays with questionable dump ins


Will be helpful if he plays 16-17 minutes in a #4-5 role

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

At this point, my biggest concern is that Zacha might have another concussion. I'm pretty numb to the team losing by now.

 

[Tundra]

Virtually the entire team is complimentary pieces. They have nothing to compliment.

You really wonder if Kovy was prescient enough to see our stunning lack of organizational depth back then and said to himself, "I need to get the hell out of here."

 

[Zippy316]

At this point, my biggest concern is that Zacha might have another concussion. I'm pretty numb to the team losing by now.

Can't get disappointed with low expectations.

 

[Better Call Sal]

You really wonder if Kovy was prescient enough to see our stunning lack of organizational depth back then and said to himself, "I need to get the hell out of here."

No, you really don't need to wonder that.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Can't get disappointed with low expectations.

Since season is lost at this point, I guess I'm now in the "lose as much as possible, I don't care anymore" camp. Except when I'm at the games. Then I want to win.

 

[Feed Me A Stray Cat]

Edit:

Critique on Hall.

In the O-zone, too often we see him carrying the puck on his off wing from down near the goal line all the way up to the point, basically squeezing the d-man out of the play, putting himself in the vicinity of 2 d-men, and forcing him quite often into a turnover.

Not good hockey, needs to keep the puck deep there(or Hynes needs to devise a play where LD dives through the middle there, which in itself is dangerous).

Eh, Hall is trying to throw different looks at the defense and open up space for passes. Hall keeping the puck deep and simply cycling is not part of his game, nor should it be.

I think you're right with the second point - Hynes needs to push the defenders to recognize what Hall is doing and be aggressive.