Confirmed Buy-Out Virtanen on unconditional Waivers [Cleared; bought out]

[llamateizer]

HABS ?

Even Bergevin isn't dumb enough to offer him a contract.

 

[Hatter of the Beach]

Jake Virtanen seems like he unironically watches Logan Paul

 

[Bounces R Way]

f*** this idiot.

 

[Beerfish]

Still remember craig button just getting flayed on these forums for his lower than expected draft grade.

 

[SnarkAttack]

He mistyped. He meant he feels like Pee Wee Herman.

He's about to be on a similar list.

 

[TkachukMyAho]

I truly hope you never have a daughter. Not only because you’d obviously be pretty terrible at it, but because it seems if something horrible happened to her, you would defend the guy instead.
After reading your posts on the matter, you obviously just don’t get it.

Jake isn’t the victim here.
At least 7 women have come forward about this.
Reporting privately doesnt mean she has something to hide. It means she isnt looking for attention, just justice.

There are no conclusions being jumped to here… 7 women have come forward. There is obviously a lot of truth in how Jake is being painted here.

Your posts are gross because your automatic dismissal of the women’s claims and go straight to defending a kid with 7 women claiming misconduct against him.
What year are you living in? People are getting away with rape and abuse because there are still too many people like you who dismiss each claim before even asking any questions.

You got something to hide? Don’t like due diligence being performed?
Rape sympathizer?
Or just a super Jake fanboi?

Either way…. Time to change.

All I can say to this, and I'll be attacked for it, you keep this frame of mind up when it happens to you or someone you know. I've had a friend go through this shit (mildly well known, no names here) and was dragged through the mud. One person steps up with a story and everyone who never even considered it to be a problem pipes up in the #metoo and piles on for sympathy, money, whatever.

Turns out, as we all expected, no one wanted to be named and innocence was proven in the end. At this point it didn't really matter anymore, the damage was done. If this is really *that* damaging then identity really shouldn't matter at that point.

I am in no way shape or form a rape sympathizer and there are some bad people out there with bad intentions. All I'm saying is you really need to consider both sides.

I have no doubt that Jake put himself in a bad situation. That much we all know, and I think it's high time to teach young adults with money and fame how to behave properly and protect themselves from this situation.

Whether Jake did something that any of us wouldn't do (beautiful girl in a hotel room, perceived consent, alcohol involved) is up for discussion here. There is the chance that Jake didn't understand or realize that he was doing something wrong.

I know everyone wants to grab pitchforks, but don't attack people for trying to understand the facts and timelines of the case before burying someone just because you want to impress people on social media with your high ground ethics.

**EDIT - before I get jumped here, I was at the event that got him in trouble. We were all absolutely stunned about this. He didn't even initiate it, didn't really want it and was effectively roped in by the end of the night. This is first hand info.

 

[VIPettersson]

All I can say to this, and I'll be attacked for it, you keep this frame of mind up when it happens to you or someone you know. I've had a friend go through this shit (mildly well known, no names here) and was dragged through the mud. One person steps up with a story and everyone who never even considered it to be a problem pipes up in the #metoo and piles on for sympathy, money, whatever.

Turns out, as we all expected, no one wanted to be named and innocence was proven in the end. At this point it didn't really matter anymore, the damage was done. If this is really *that* damaging then identity really shouldn't matter at that point.

I am in no way shape or form a rape sympathizer and there are some bad people out there with bad intentions. All I'm saying is you really need to consider both sides.

I have no doubt that Jake put himself in a bad situation. That much we all know, and I think it's high time to teach young adults with money and fame how to behave properly and protect themselves from this situation.

Whether Jake did something that any of us wouldn't do (beautiful girl in a hotel room, perceived consent, alcohol involved) is up for discussion here. There is the chance that Jake didn't understand or realize that he was doing something wrong.

I know everyone wants to grab pitchforks, but don't attack people for trying to understand the facts and timelines of the case before burying someone just because you want to impress people on social media with your high ground ethics.

Not certain about the validity of the sources but I have seen posts claiming that there were "multiple" girls claiming similar incidents. Not just one individual. The post I saw, found on reddit.

 

[TkachukMyAho]

Not certain about the validity of the sources but I have seen posts claiming that there were "multiple" girls claiming similar incidents. Not just one individual.

Hence the "pile on" comment. Listen, I'm not saying Jake isn't guilty here. I don't know. But there's an awful lot of this going on today and typically the results are always the same except for a select few.

Today, once one person steps up to the plate everyone wants the attention, whether rightly deserved or not. I'm not advocating for victim shaming, but let's see some names put up here. It's easy to cry foul anonymously, these boards are living proof of that.

Push your chips in and let due legal process do it's thing. It's all conjecture until that stage.

 

[SnarkAttack]

Hence the "pile on" comment. Listen, I'm not saying Jake isn't guilty here. I don't know. But there's an awful lot of this going on today and typically the results are always the same except for a select few.

Today, once one person steps up to the plate everyone wants the attention, whether rightly deserved or not. I'm not advocating for victim shaming, but let's see some names put up here. It's easy to cry foul anonymously, these boards are living proof of that.

Push your chips in and let due legal process do it's thing. It's all conjecture until that stage.

You don't understand why someone who got raped would want to remain anonymous to the general public?

 

[TkachukMyAho]

You don't understand why someone who got raped would want to remain anonymous to the general public?

Was a crime committed? What's to stop everyone from throwing their name in the ring anonymously and making a situation worse?

Oh, right. Nothing.

I'm not going to debate the traumatic factor with you. If you think this is all fine and dandy then that's your opinion and I respect it. This is not a one size fits all issue going forward, it's becoming something that I believe has a tendency to be unfair.j

If we keep going this way and toasting people on allegations before having facts presented and proper legal process (I'm not talking about 8 women anonymously submitting their names) then I feel bad for our next generation. We should all be agreeing that legal process and facts is the way to prosecute, not by internet pitchforks reading one side of a story.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

As stupid as Jake is on the ice, he might be even stupider off it.

 

[Kshahdoo]

So according to this Russian site, SKA is negotiating a contract with Virtanen. SKA offers him 60M rubles ($817k).

 

[I Hate Blake Coleman]

Was a crime committed? What's to stop everyone from throwing their name in the ring anonymously and making a situation worse?

Oh, right. Nothing.

I'm not going to debate the traumatic factor with you. If you think this is all fine and dandy then that's your opinion and I respect it. This is not a one size fits all issue going forward, it's becoming something that I believe has a tendency to be unfair.j

If we keep going this way and toasting people on allegations before having facts presented and proper legal process (I'm not talking about 8 women anonymously submitting their names) then I feel bad for our next generation. We should all be agreeing that legal process and facts is the way to prosecute, not by internet pitchforks reading one side of a story.

Publication bans are automatic in sexual assault cases. It's not "easy" to cry sexual assault anonymously, it's literally illegal to name the victims unless they fight for it in court themselves (and sometimes then the ban isn't lifted). You don't know what the f*** you're talking about.

 

[Garry Valk]

Was a crime committed? What's to stop everyone from throwing their name in the ring anonymously and making a situation worse?

Oh, right. Nothing.

I'm not going to debate the traumatic factor with you. If you think this is all fine and dandy then that's your opinion and I respect it. This is not a one size fits all issue going forward, it's becoming something that I believe has a tendency to be unfair.j

If we keep going this way and toasting people on allegations before having facts presented and proper legal process (I'm not talking about 8 women anonymously submitting their names) then I feel bad for our next generation. We should all be agreeing that legal process and facts is the way to prosecute, not by internet pitchforks reading one side of a story.

You have absolutely no idea what the hell you’re talking about.

 

[biturbo19]

Still remember craig button just getting flayed on these forums for his lower than expected draft grade.

This seems like reinventing the past.

Of course, there are always the people who are deeply offended by anything that doesn't fully match Bob's consensus list. But among people who seriously follow the draft, Virtanen was hugely polarizing that year. Specifically, a lot of the people who didn't like him, really didn't like him.

I really don't recall Button getting "flayed" over his Virtanen ranking by people with anything to say. Just the lemmings upset he didn't rank him within a couple spots of where Bob's list said he should be.


What i do remember...is a lot of people weirdly calling it a "safe" but "low ceiling" pick at the time. Which never really made sense to me. He was always a real boom/bust swing for the fences type pick, with a "4th line banger" projected floor, but power forward super fast sniper upside as a "ceiling". His career since then, has really taken some turns...the latest of which, having nothing to do with his on-ice shortcomings. But it still seems like a real "upside swing" pick to me. Just...one that went the other way. Though he can still be a plenty effective straight line bottom-6 guy with size, speed, and a shot...and not enough hockey sense to reliably make good on it. Whether he actually gets the opportunity to play again...that's in the courts hands. Both legally, and in the court of public opinion.

 

[GoldenSeal]

So the victim in the case contacts the police after filing a civil suit, NOT a criminal suit?

I mean… shouldn’t it be criminal?

 

[TkachukMyAho]

So the victim in the case contacts the police after filing a civil suit, NOT a criminal suit?

I mean… shouldn’t it be criminal?

Don't throw facts into random internet people providing all righteous accounts of superiority to mere mortals. Their keyboards will light up like fireworks.

 

[Vitto79]

If he gets a chance I say Buffalo

 

[Mickey Marner]

So the victim in the case contacts the police after filing a civil suit, NOT a criminal suit?

I mean… shouldn’t it be criminal?

Higher burden of proof in criminal court, they probably lack the evidence to convict.

 

[Mick Jagr]

If he gets a chance I say Buffalo

Should he get a chance tho? Probably not.

 

[Plural]

Was a crime committed? What's to stop everyone from throwing their name in the ring anonymously and making a situation worse?

Oh, right. Nothing.

I'm not going to debate the traumatic factor with you. If you think this is all fine and dandy then that's your opinion and I respect it. This is not a one size fits all issue going forward, it's becoming something that I believe has a tendency to be unfair.j

If we keep going this way and toasting people on allegations before having facts presented and proper legal process (I'm not talking about 8 women anonymously submitting their names) then I feel bad for our next generation. We should all be agreeing that legal process and facts is the way to prosecute, not by internet pitchforks reading one side of a story.

If some person physically attacks someone (not sexual, just some kind of a physical assault) when no-one is seeing it and that someone chooses to tell that and while telling it, more than handful of other people come out and say, yeah that f***er did the same to me too. Would you be questioning that story similarly as you are this?

I know you think you're being reasonable but you're really not. The stigma and shame associated in sexual crimes is a real thing. While it is entirely possible to be wrongfully accused and yes it has happened, it's almost infinitely more likely to get dismissed as a real victim while coming out. The reason is because of mindset like yours. I'm sorry for your friend, I truly am. I had one terrible thing happen to my brother which is somewhat similar. Still, I recognize that sexual harassment and crime has been a silent issue for our societies for decades, centuries.

Sadly, there's going to be collateral damage. It's not right, not acceptable or dismissable. But as of now, we should believe the (alleged) victims when a singular person gets several plausible accusations. It's not perfect and it will cause harm to innocents. But it will cause significantly less harm to innocents than the previous status-quo. I prefer we believe the plausible stories and work to find a way to protect the innocent. Rather than we dial back to a society where women are scared or too numb to even bring these things up.

 

[TkachukMyAho]

If some person physically attacks someone (not sexual, just some kind of a physical assault) when no-one is seeing it and that someone chooses to tell that and while telling it, more than handful of other people come out and say, yeah that f***er did the same to me too. Would you be questioning that story similarly as you are this?

I know you think you're being reasonable but you're really not. The stigma and shame associated in sexual crimes is a real thing. While it is entirely possible to be wrongfully accused and yes it has happened, it's almost infinitely more likely to get dismissed as a real victim while coming out. The reason is because of mindset like yours. I'm sorry for your friend, I truly am. I had one terrible thing happen to my brother which is somewhat similar. Still, I recognize that sexual harassment and crime has been a silent issue for our societies for decades, centuries.

Sadly, there's going to be collateral damage. It's not right, not acceptable or dismissable. But as of now, we should believe the (alleged) victims when a singular person gets several plausible accusations. It's not perfect and it will cause harm to innocents. But it will cause significantly less harm to innocents than the previous status-quo. I prefer we believe the plausible stories and work to find a way to protect the innocent. Rather than we dial back to a society where women are scared or too numb to even bring these things up.

All fair points. I suppose I'm a little more jaded than most based on experiences of those close to me.

 

[Plural]

All fair points. I suppose I'm a little more jaded than most based on experiences of those close to me.

Totally understandable.

 

[GoldenSeal]

Higher burden of proof in criminal court, they probably lack the evidence to convict.

If you don’t have enough evidence, how can you can convict at all on anything? That sounds sketch.

 

[JAK]

If you don’t have enough evidence, how can you can convict at all on anything? That sounds sketch.

That is the difference between criminal and civil lawsuit.

Let's say you are out walking with a buddy, I come up and knock you out, and run away.

Unless there is DNA or camera evidence, it's going to be really hard for a criminal conviction.