Confirmed with Link: [VAN/VGK] Canucks acquire D Nate Schmidt for a 3rd in 2022

[Fatass]

How was VAN in pole position if other teams were called?

Maybe Drance means we were first called? Or Benning (by absolute luck) called Vegas first?

 

[Diamonddog01]

Maybe the Vegas GM is trying to send a positive message to his other players by trading Schmidt (if he has to move) to a team the player wants to move to? This might be part of the whole “Vegas takes care of their guys” message. Their GM might have got a second from another team, but (maybe?) to him that’s not worth the negative publicity in the players’ world.

Maybe...and it seems they did contact a few other teams after all. So perhaps there was some discussion with the player?

 

[Bleach Clean]

Maybe Drance means we were first called? Or Benning (by absolute luck) called Vegas first?

I think this is the best possible explanation thus far: They called Benning first, as you said (after he failed on Tanev), and then called the others. Only, Benning was quick enough with the agreement that the others really didn't get a chance to weigh in.

 

[4Twenty]

Maybe...and it seems they did contact a few other teams after all. So perhaps there was some discussion with the player?

Schmidt said there wasn’t.

 

[Nucker101]

How was VAN in pole position if other teams were called?

After reading those tweets, I’m assuming some of those teams initially lowballed and Vegas scoffed and didn’t even bother calling back.

Drance did say “circle back” so I assume those GM’s that are angry about missing out were contacted at some point but weren’t later given a chance to beat the Schmidt for a 3rd deal

Unless I’m incorrectly interpreting these tweets. It’ll probably be better cleared up when Drance does a radio interview.

 

[Fatass]

Schmidt said there wasn’t.

Maybe what actually happens, and what the player says publicly are two different things?

 

[Bleach Clean]

I posted this breakdown earlier in the thread:

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I understand and it does add to forming the results. Still, unless we learn that BOS, COL and PHI were all on his 10 team NTC, it's hard to gauge it.

This would also mean that competitive teams were on his no trade list, leaving a chunk of poor teams as viable options. Would he risk that?

Let's game this a little bit:

Assume that the team taking him on had to have 8~ million in cap, similar to what the Canucks had pre-trade. That leaves:

NYI
BOS
FLA
NSH
LA
CLB
BUF
NYR
NJ
DET
OTT

Right away this eliminates PHI and COL as teams that could afford Schmidt straight away without VGK having to take cap back.

Now let's control for teams that he would not favour for one reason or another (debatable of course), and teams that have heavy contract commitments on defense already:

(I list off how many big contracts ($5m and up) each team has committed to the defense)

NYI - 3 big contracts: Boychuck, Leddy and Pulock (RFA). $18 million committed already to the overall Dcorps.
BOS - 1 big contract: McAvoy. $12.35 million committed.
FLA - 3 big contracts: Ekblad, Yandle and Stralman. $25.3 million committed.
NSH - 2 big contracts: Josi and Ryan. $23.68 million committed.
LA - 1 big contract: Doughty. $19.48 million committed.
CLB - 2 big contracts: Werenski and Jones. $17.93 million committed.
BUF - 1 big contract: Ristolainen (Dahlin in 1 year). $19.25 million committed.
NYR - 1 big contract: Trouba. $16.09 million committed.
NJ - 1 big contract: Subban. $23 million committed.
DET - 2 big contracts: Staal and DeKeyser. $17.91 million committed.
OTT - 1 big contract: Chabot. $20.10 million committed.

Bold teams are eliminated based upon their most recent showing (standings). This leaves:

NYI - Pulock would have taken them to $21+ million committed. Adding another $6m makes their Dcorps one of the more expensive ones. Possible, but unlikely.
BOS - Prime location for Schmidt. However, I think they are still chasing OEL, and it appears Hoffman as well.
NSH - Puts them at $30 million with Fabbro as RFA next year... Out, unless they send salary back.
CLB - They were in on Petro and would not have wanted to help out VGK. Schmidt also may not have wanted to play for Torts.
NYR - May have been in on Petro, but needed to move Trouba to be sure. They have DeAngelo as an RFA now, Lindgren next year, and Fox the year after that. They are tough one to handicap for that reason.

And so, I think VGK had two legit locations with BOS and NYR. NYI was a maybe. These teams could take on Schmidt's cap while only giving up a pick. CLB could have been in the mix too, but they were chasing Petro like VGK had been. That could have caused an issue.

Does this seem plausible?

-----------------------------------------


In the end, the other teams McCrimmon may have contacted would be: NYR, NYI and BOS. These were the only teams with enough space to outright take on his salary while allocating that money to the defense.

NYR did nothing so far, and have a lot of RFAs.

NYI has Pulock as RFA, Dobson making his way up, and they just traded Toews to clear salary?

BOS could have definitely used him. They are one team I think McCrimmon definitely called.

So that leaves one other ideal destination, maybe two. If Benning responds quickly, then I'm not surprised this was agreed to quickly as well.

Lines up.

 

[4Twenty]

Maybe what actually happens, and what the player says publicly are two different things?

Why would the player lie? What does he have to gain. Fans would take to him more if he said he used to have Vancouver on his NTC and changed his heart for the young core.

The player lying seems like a ridiculous conclusion to me.

 

[Fatass]

I think this is the best possible explanation thus far: They called Benning first, as you said (after he failed on Tanev), and then called the others. Only, Benning was quick enough with the agreement that the others really didn't get a chance to weigh in.

I’m not a Benning supporter, but he might have played the Schmidt scenario wisely. Yes, we lost Tanev and Tofoli, but signing either of those guys might have meant not having cap room to take on Schmidt?
Who in our organization would advise Benning on this type of circumstance? I just can’t believe Benning would plan this well.

 

[4Twenty]

Don’t the islanders need to pay Barzal? That takes them out @Bleach Clean

 

[Fatass]

Why would the player lie? What does he have to gain. Fans would take to him more if he said he used to have Vancouver on his NTC and changed his heart for the young core.

The player lying seems like a ridiculous conclusion to me.

Not saying the player would lie. Suggesting the player would avoid, or spin the truth. Do you have his exact quote?

 

[GumbyCan2]

it was a wrist shot through a screen. Wasn’t exactly a speeding bullet.

But it was effective. He scored!

 

[4Twenty]

Not saying the player would lie. Suggesting the player would avoid, or spin the truth. Do you have his exact quote?

No I don’t write down quotes when I hear them. He said he found out he got traded from Holtby basically. He was not approached by the front office and it’s asinine to think he’d spin that.

 

[Nazzlind]

What about the report that the original Schmidt to Vancouver trade originally had other moving parts which were obviously dropped?

 

[Nucker101]

I’m not a Benning supporter, but he might have played the Schmidt scenario wisely. Yes, we lost Tanev and Tofoli, but signing either of those guys might have meant not having cap room to take on Schmidt?
Who in our organization would advise Benning on this type of circumstance? I just can’t believe Benning would plan this well.

Depending on how proactive the capologist(I believe Wall?) is, it’s possible he calculated how many dollars were available league-wide to be spent heading into free agency(with some estimations for small market teams spending less than the cap due to covid), how many teams needed to shed salary, and how much money would be leftover for teams to sign the top UFA players with.

It involves some guess work and would be far from 100% accurate but it would’ve given a good enough indicator about how deflated the market would be and why it was likely best to aggressively try to shed salary before or at the draft and avoid signing or acquiring player until later in free agency to take advantage of teams in cap hell and desperate free agents.

 

[Fatass]

No I don’t write down quotes when I hear them. He said he found out he got traded from Holtby basically. He was not approached by the front office and it’s asinine to think he’d spin that.

Why the rudeness? Can’t we have a discussion without that?
Schmidt had a no trade list. Wouldn’t the team talk to him, or his agent, about that? Maybe Schmidt said he’d prefer Vancouver or Boston?

 

[4Twenty]

Depending on how proactive the capologist(I believe Wall?) is, it’s possible he calculated how many dollars were available league-wide to be spent heading into free agency(with some estimations for small market teams spending less than the cap due to covid), how many teams needed to shed salary, and how much money would be leftover for teams to sign the top UFA players with.

It involves some guess work and would be far from 100% accurate but it would’ve given a good enough indicator about how deflated the market would be and why it was likely best to aggressively try to shed salary before or at the draft and avoid signing or acquiring player until later in free agency to take advantage of teams in cap hell and desperate free agents.

To follow on your final sentence. That’s what irked me about the Holtby deal.

 

[4Twenty]

Why the rudeness? Can’t we have a discussion without that?
Schmidt had a no trade list. Wouldn’t the team talk to him, or his agent, about that? Maybe Schmidt said he’d prefer Vancouver or Boston?

Sorry for seeming short. All of this has been talked about so to explain something that’s been gone over is slightly annoying.

Vancouver wasn’t on his list so he could be traded here without consultation. The list was handed in months ago.

 

[F A N]

After reading those tweets, I’m assuming some of those teams initially lowballed and Vegas scoffed and didn’t even bother calling back.

Drance did say “circle back” so I assume those GM’s that are angry about missing out were contacted at some point but weren’t later given a chance to beat the Schmidt for a 3rd deal

Unless I’m incorrectly interpreting these tweets. It’ll probably be better cleared up when Drance does a radio interview.

Vegas probably wanted to pay Jim back for making Sbisa unprotected in the expansion draft. It was with Sbisa that they advanced to the Cup finals.

 

[m9]

How was VAN in pole position if other teams were called?

I think someone said (maybe Friedman or Drance) that a bunch of teams considered him a cap dump and wanted a sweetener to take the contract.

 

[GumbyCan2]

Maybe what actually happens, and what the player says publicly are two different things?

Maybe?

 

[krutovsdonut]

I’m not a Benning supporter, but he might have played the Schmidt scenario wisely. Yes, we lost Tanev and Tofoli, but signing either of those guys might have meant not having cap room to take on Schmidt?
Who in our organization would advise Benning on this type of circumstance? I just can’t believe Benning would plan this well.

benning took a lot of heat standing pat between saturday and late monday afternoon with a secret deal in his back pocket that only happened if vegas signed pietrangelo. he was going to look very bad if the pietrangelo went elsewhere.

to make a firm offer to pieterangelo, vegas needed someone who would wait pietrangelo out with them, and they needed a price to keep that fish on the hook as the heat rose (to mix metaphors).

so they really needed to make a single deal with one team.

one can infer

a. many gms would not wait with vegas for pietrangelo to decide with so much happening in the ufa and trade market and limited cap space

b. any team asked to wait, would expect a discount compared to a deal made right then and there on saturday

c. they needed to trust whoever they made a deal with to hang in there.

benning took a huge gamble here and it paid off.

 

[Fatass]

I think someone said (maybe Friedman or Drance) that a bunch of teams considered him a cap dump and wanted a sweetener to take the contract.

I don’t get this “cap dump” valuation. Didn’t we get a good player in Schmidt? It sure seems to me Boston would have wanted him, especially after losing Krug.

 

[rypper]

I don’t get this “cap dump” valuation. Didn’t we get a good player in Schmidt? It sure seems to me Boston would have wanted him, especially after losing Krug.

Cap dump as in teams knew that Vegas was over the barrel and had to move him, and in a short amount of time.

 

[rypper]

I think this is the best possible explanation thus far: They called Benning first, as you said (after he failed on Tanev), and then called the others. Only, Benning was quick enough with the agreement that the others really didn't get a chance to weigh in.

I think this is the most plausible situation.