Confirmed with Link: [VAN/TOR] Canucks acquire D Travis Dermott for 3rd in 2022 (WPG)

[tradervik]

...

I hope Travis Dermott works out for Allvin and the Canucks, at the cost of a third rounder. But the Canucks track record of trading draft picks for existing position players is beyond dismal.

You mean Benning's track record was beyond dismal. I remember a certain former GM who made some decent moves. The new management team has no record just yet.

 

[MS]

It's impossible not to think about where the Canucks would be today if they hadn't jettisoned so many second and third round draft picks for players who just never panned out. The list of failures from Sutter to Gudbranson, Tofoli, Pedan, Baertschi, OEL and Garland, would fill a team's prospect pool twice over.

For a GM who built his reputation on being a 'drafter and evaluator' of young talent, Benning squandered more draft picks for 'nothing players' than any GM in Canuck history.

I hope Travis Dermott works out for Allvin and the Canucks, at the cost of a third rounder. But the Canucks track record of trading draft picks for existing position players is beyond dismal.

This is an entirely new management team and the track record of Jim Benning - thank f*** - is no longer relevant.

 

[Tomatoes11]

It's impossible not to think about where the Canucks would be today if they hadn't jettisoned so many second and third round draft picks for players who just never panned out. The list of failures from Sutter to Gudbranson, Tofoli, Pedan, Baertschi, OEL and Garland, would fill a team's prospect pool twice over.

For a GM who built his reputation on being a 'drafter and evaluator' of young talent, Benning squandered more draft picks for 'nothing players' than any GM in Canuck history.

I hope Travis Dermott works out for Allvin and the Canucks, at the cost of a third rounder. But the Canucks track record of trading draft picks for existing position players is beyond dismal.

What makes dim even worse is that he actually traded more picks than Gillis did. Lol which is hilarious considering how much higher value dims picks were and how far away we were to a contender when dim traded those picks. Lol

 

[VanJack]

This is an entirely new management team and the track record of Jim Benning - thank f*** - is no longer relevant.

Sorry, but imo the only teams that should be trading future draft picks for position players are the teams like Tampa, Florida, Colorado, Carolina or even the Leafs/Rangers. They've got a chance to win right now, and an extra body or two might get them over the top.

For teams like the Canucks it becomes almost nonsensical to keep trading draft picks for immediate help. Why? You're already below the playoff bar, and even if by some miracle you make them, your team isn't going anywhere anyway.

Jim Benning never seemed to figure this out in eight years......but the new guys don't seem to have figured it out either, at least so far.

 

[MS]

Sorry, but imo the only teams that should be trading future draft picks for position players are the teams like Tampa, Florida, Colorado, Carolina or even the Leafs/Rangers. They've got a chance to win right now, and an extra body or two might get them over the top.

For teams like the Canucks it becomes almost nonsensical to keep trading draft picks for immediate help. Why? You're already below the playoff bar, and even if by some miracle you make them, your team isn't going anywhere anyway.

Jim Benning never seemed to figure this out in eight years......but the new guys don't seem to have figured it out either, at least so far.

Dermott is 25, under team control for multiple more seasons, and we aren't doing a total rebuild.

Getting guys who fit this timeframe makes total sense. The pro scouting just has to be better than the abomination under Jim Benning.

 

[KingofSurrey]

Sorry, but imo the only teams that should be trading future draft picks for position players are the teams like Tampa, Florida, Colorado, Carolina or even the Leafs/Rangers. They've got a chance to win right now, and an extra body or two might get them over the top.

For teams like the Canucks it becomes almost nonsensical to keep trading draft picks for immediate help. Why? You're already below the playoff bar, and even if by some miracle you make them, your team isn't going anywhere anyway.

Jim Benning never seemed to figure this out in eight years......but the new guys don't seem to have figured it out either, at least so far.

Dim Benning traded picks in an attempt to keep himself employed .. after every crap season.

You know what. It worked for quite some time, sadly.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

I'd like to see if Dermott can mesh well with Hughes, and then play Rathbone with Schenn. Imo Rathbone was targeted physically in the games he played this year, and I'd like to see him find his footing in the NHL while knowing that someone has his back.

I'd definitely put Dermott with Hughes. Give him a chance to flourish that he never really had in Toronto and see if he has any untapped potential left. If he curves himself into being a reliable #4-5th defenseman, I'm pretty okay with this trade.

 

[Tomatoes11]

Nvm

 

[Egghead1999]

It's impossible not to think about where the Canucks would be today if they hadn't jettisoned so many second and third round draft picks for players who just never panned out. The list of failures from Sutter to Gudbranson, Tofoli, Pedan, Baertschi, OEL and Garland, would fill a team's prospect pool twice over.

For a GM who built his reputation on being a 'drafter and evaluator' of young talent, Benning squandered more draft picks for 'nothing players' than any GM in Canuck history.

I hope Travis Dermott works out for Allvin and the Canucks, at the cost of a third rounder. But the Canucks track record of trading draft picks for existing position players is beyond dismal.

To be fair, Canucks cannot "develop" players. Tofoli and Gudrenson are fine with another team.
Anyway, back to Demott, Demott is a good 3rd pair LD at least. Just that, Leafs has Rielly, Muzzin, Sandin, Giordano on the left side now.

 

[mathonwy]

To be fair, Canucks cannot "develop" players. Tofoli and Gudrenson are fine with another team.
Anyway, back to Demott, Demott is a good 3rd pair LD at least. Just that, Leafs has Rielly, Muzzin, Sandin, Giordano on the left side now.

Nobody in the last management team actually gave a shit about developing/improving "Canucks" assets.

If they did, McCann would still be a Canuck and maybe even Jake.

Its amazing how badly they f***ed our team.

 

[MS]

Nobody in the last management team actually gave a shit about developing/improving "Canucks" assets.

If they did, McCann would still be a Canuck and maybe even Jake.

Its amazing how badly they f***ed our team.

They spent the entire 8 years chasing squirrels looking for a quick bump to sneak into the playoffs and keep their jobs.

Developing assets internally simply was not a priority, unless they were lottery picks arriving fully formed (and even at that, all of those regressed).

 

[F A N]

Nobody in the last management team actually gave a shit about developing/improving "Canucks" assets.

If they did, McCann would still be a Canuck and maybe even Jake.

Will Jake be here if the Canucks developed/improved Jake?

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

They spent the entire 8 years chasing squirrels looking for a quick bump to sneak into the playoffs and keep their jobs.

Developing assets internally simply was not a priority, unless they were lottery picks arriving fully formed (and even at that, all of those regressed).

Beyond that they would ALWAYS clog up the bottom end of the roster with overpaid, crappy vets they refused to scratch/demote. This meant there was never a situation where a young player could be fed some easy minutes on a 4th line or 3rd defense pair to get their feet under them - those minutes were reserved for the Schallers and Bartkowskis and Beagles and Benns of the world.

 

[MS]

Beyond that they would ALWAYS clog up the bottom end of the roster with overpaid, crappy vets they refused to scratch/demote. This meant there was never a situation where a young player could be fed some easy minutes on a 4th line or 3rd defense pair to get their feet under them - those minutes were reserved for the Schallers and Bartkowskis and Beagles and Benns of the world.

The problem is that playing a young player over a 'reliable veteran' might result in a small short-term hit in order to get a longer-term reward. And when all you're focusing on is NOWNOWNOW TRYTOGETTOPLAYOFFS those small short-term hits are really unattractive.

Why would you want to try developing a Jonah Gadjovich in bottom-6 minutes when Alex Chiasson will be very slightly better in the next game tomorrow?

Literally the exact opposite of how TB operates. TB's Gadjovich was Boris Katchouck who they developed, put on to their roster, and then got a trade return for.

 

[James R]

I think you will all like Travis. He's a new age D - very mobile, and very good at gap control. He's best at transitional defence - and disrupting the other team before they get going. He is at best average when it comes to disrupting the cycle and seems to get wrecked every once in a while by a heavy forecheck. He's pretty good at holding the blue line offensively, and has a nice little misdirection move or two when he's holding the line. Has a bit of snarl to his game also. We really liked him in Toronto, and from a value perspective I think you guys did well getting him for a third.

This is an example of Dubas trying to do right by one of his guys. Travis was getting farther down the depth chart and is quite capable of growing into a more important role. He's easily a very capable third pair D right now - I still think he has upside and can grow into the 2nd pairing. He's a little bit like our modern version of Todd Gill if that name rings a bell.

 

[tradervik]

The circumstances of the Dermott trade remind of the Leivo trade a few years ago: Toronto "does a solid" for a player who has been pushed down the depth chart. That turned out pretty well for the Canucks until Leivo's terrible injury.

 

[strattonius]

I'd love to collect draft picks as well but this team also desperately needs quality NHL players and depth. Dermott is both of those as well as young and cost controlled. Consider that Dermott is still an RFA after next year - that is more valuable than adding a bottom pairing that will hit UFA. It's an excellent gamble and targeted buy low player - our fans in here should be excited at the fact we have a management crew capable of seeking more intelligent pieces like this.

 

[VanJack]

A mixed bag for Dermott so far.....was solid if not nondescript in Denver, but last night in Minny he exhibited some of the brain-cramps in his own zone that ushered him down the depth chart in TO.

But I suppose once the Canucks unloaded Hamonic's $3m cap hit, with no retention of salary, they were playing with house money in taking on Dermott's $1.5m cap hit. And the third rounder they coughed up originally belonged to the Jets in the Nate Schmidt trade.

But I reiterate......an NHL team with a shrewd GM and scouting staff might have been able to package those two picks in the middle of the third round, and potentially move up into the second round to secure a guy who might be a big part of their future like a Demko, a Klimovich or a Hoglander.

It rarely makes any sense for a lottery team to shed draft picks at the trade deadline.

 

[Hodgy]

The problem is that playing a young player over a 'reliable veteran' might result in a small short-term hit in order to get a longer-term reward. And when all you're focusing on is NOWNOWNOW TRYTOGETTOPLAYOFFS those small short-term hits are really unattractive.

Why would you want to try developing a Jonah Gadjovich in bottom-6 minutes when Alex Chiasson will be very slightly better in the next game tomorrow?

Literally the exact opposite of how TB operates. TB's Gadjovich was Boris Katchouck who they developed, put on to their roster, and then got a trade return for.

Ya. It was amazing that a "rebuilding team" like the Canucks could continually be so shortsighted in almost all aspects of their decision making. From signing Boeser to a lower AAV deal with a high QO to signing Halak to a contract with guaranteed bonuses that would be pushed to next year, to consistently preferring veterans over less established players, to continually trading picks for "age gap solutions", all in the interests of the present and at the expense of the future.....and for all these efforts to essentially never lead to any real present success is almost impressive.

 

[MarkMM]

Will Jake be here if the Canucks developed/improved Jake?

Really awkward to think about given what went down. Part of me thinks if what he's been accused of is true then that is a character defect so deep as to be unfixable and we wouldn't want any piece of that, but another part is that if the team had a different culture and leadership character then maybe JV would have evolved into something...else. We'll never know I guess.

 

[Egghead1999]

Nobody in the last management team actually gave a shit about developing/improving "Canucks" assets.

If they did, McCann would still be a Canuck and maybe even Jake.

Its amazing how badly they f***ed our team.

Then, they kept saying they wanted to trade for 23~27 (???) age group players
Now, let's see can the current management team develop Dermott into a great 3rd pair guy that can move up if needed.

 

[biturbo19]

Not really concerned with the "price" of acquisition. That's reasonable enough, especially since it's pretty much directly offset by moving only there half the time Hamonic and his cap hit for the same price.

I just don't really see Dermott as a)the TYPE of defenceman we really need to be looking for, or b)really moving the needle at all in any event.

Just bringing in a small depth defenceman for the heck of it i guess? Don't really get it.

 

[me2]

Including Benning. God, 12 years after that game 7 loss to the Bruins in the finals, and we're ONLY NOW getting out from under the lingering manifestations of that game. We only ever brought in all this Bruins trash because ownership thought "If you can't beat em, join em!"

2027. The year OEL's contract ends. Or 2032 if we buy him out.

 

[strattonius]

Not really concerned with the "price" of acquisition. That's reasonable enough, especially since it's pretty much directly offset by moving only there half the time Hamonic and his cap hit for the same price.

I just don't really see Dermott as a)the TYPE of defenceman we really need to be looking for, or b)really moving the needle at all in any event.

Just bringing in a small depth defenceman for the heck of it i guess? Don't really get it.

What do you mean by type? I see Dermott as an upgrade to skating and moving the puck.

And I do believe this moves the needle, albeit not a lot. Something to take in to consideration is the swap of Hamonic for Dermott allows 1.5M more of flexibility. If management uses their CAP wisely, you could add a good bottom 6 fwd or another depth defenseman with that money. It's a considerable upgrade over just Hamonic.

 

[shottasasa]

watching him play and then looking at his stats, I realised Dermott isn’t quite as small as I thought. He’s 6ft and 200+ pounds. He’s not a very physical defender and doesn’t seem to chase hits, but he has the bulk to be effective in the corners and in front of the net. Not sure if he’s figured out how to maximise his effectiveness in these areas yet, but he doesn’t face the same challenges that Stetcher and Hughes have had to. Those two are effective mostly because of their stick work and constantly moving their feet, both things I’ll be watching Dermott closely for.