Underlying numbers show Duchene’s value over Turris

[Soundgarden]

I don't see how anyone can say with a straight face Nashville didn't get a big upgrade. Turris is far better than Sissons or Jarnkrok.

Seriously. He probably becomes the third best centerman our team has every had without stepping on to the ice. Bumps Bonino down to the third line and moves Jarnkrok to the wing, that's a huge upgrade.

 

[zeke]

a very good article ruined by the strange inclusion of the useless and misleading Takeaway/Giveaway stats.

but yet, Duchene is a solid upgrade over Turris. Whether enough of an upgrade to justify the price, I'm not sure.

 

[Korpse]

I would be worried if I was a Sens fan. In today's NHL you can't be trading your future away. They have traded ALOT of their future away the past 2 seasons.

Thanks for Dahlin tho we are thankful.

While we are happy that you are happy about Dahlen, I have no idea what the f*** you are talking about.

Ottawa still as their top 3 prospects in White, Chabot and Brown. Dahlen and Bowers were second tier prospects in Ottawa, this isn't trading away the future. They still have a fair number of forward prospects who are similar in caliber.

I feel like most miss an important aspect when discussing future assets. While it is important to have quality and quantity in your prospect pool its also important to remember that there is only so much oppurtunity to go around. You can compile as many assets all you want for as long as you want but if you want to maximize those assets, at some point you have to move some of them.

 

[WesMcCauley]

They had a lot to give.

They didn't give up any of their top prospects.

I think in a vacuum they overpaid, but Sakic held Chabot, White and Brown hostage and Dorion had no choice.

The choice was to re-sign Turris at 6*6.

 

[NyQuil]

The choice was to re-sign Turris at 6*6.

As has been said, (including since by Turris himself), that deal was never on the table in Ottawa.

Dorion said "They weren't willing to budge from 7 or 8 years".

The issue from the very beginning was the gap in term. Not the money. Not Melnyk being cheap. But signing Turris for 7 or 8 years.

Just because he signed for that in Nashville (where the tax situation is much better as well BTW) doesn't mean it was possible in Ottawa.

A lot of people seem to be having trouble with this concept.

 

[rent free]

Colorado kind of lost too. They gave up their bet chip for the foreseeable future for a ton of question marks. Didn't get the d-man they wanted or even a slightly comparable d-man.

Nashville made out alright imo. Didn't give up all that much for a top 6 center, but 6 years for Turris is a bit much. That contract is going to be rough toward the end I think.

colorado's asking price was huge and with the teams he was dealing with, defense isn't something he could acquire. the two prospects they got from nashville are nhl ready, and they got quite a few draft picks, including a 1st round pick. nashville made out like bandits by acquiring a top-6 center without giving up a key roster player. the turris contract probably wont be bad towards the end because he's gonna be 34 when it ends. its not like he's gonna be 38 or 39. theres probably not gonna be a decline anytime soon

 

[rent free]

The choice was to re-sign Turris at 6*6.

turris wouldn't want 6 million in a canadian city. he's be making less than half of that due to taxes.

 

[McOilers97]

I like the trade for the Sens. Even if they paid a fairly steep price to get him, Duchene is a really good player who is being undervalued by many on here just because his numbers in recent seasons have been a bit underwhelming. I fully expect him to fit in well in Ottawa and produce at the ~70 point clip that he did a few years ago. Turris is a good player, but Duchene has an extra gear that Turris can't reach.

 

[haveandare]

colorado's asking price was huge and with the teams he was dealing with, defense isn't something he could acquire. the two prospects they got from nashville are nhl ready, and they got quite a few draft picks, including a 1st round pick. nashville made out like bandits by acquiring a top-6 center without giving up a key roster player. the turris contract probably wont be bad towards the end because he's gonna be 34 when it ends. its not like he's gonna be 38 or 39. theres probably not gonna be a decline anytime soon

When you're trading your biggest chip for the foreseeable future, "we couldn't acquire what we needed and wanted" isn't a good excuse imo.

 

[Makar Goes Fast]

When you're trading your biggest chip for the foreseeable future, "we couldn't acquire what we needed and wanted" isn't a good excuse imo.

well colorado did get a young defensive prospect/roster player with high upside +++, which you know, they wanted.... soooo i think sakic did get his price

 

[Nickmo82]

I love guys like you. Lurk message boards all day looking for spelling errors to correct while pumping your chest.

No one gives a **** pal. Thanks for Dahlen.

When it's a players name and the error made is another players name, it's worth noting. You don't need to get all pissy about it.

 

[Karl Eriksson]

Duchene has represented Canada at every level. Turris is not in that tier.

 

[GTA]

Bowers has been passed by both Formenton and Batherson from the 2017 draft alone. Bowers right now is likely outside the Sens top 10 prospects.

Losing the 1st hurts for sure, but the Sens never gave up anyone they weren't willing to lose.

Do I think the Burrows for Dahlen trade was bad? Bigtime. Is it going to block the Sens from succeeding? Absolutely not.

The Sens prospect pool is still stocked.

Chabot
White
Brown
Chlapik
Harpur
Jaros
Formenton
Batherson

I’d love to hear how Batherson jumped 3 rounds after 18 games. This is classic downplaying after you trade someone

 

[Drij]

Duchene is gone as a UFA. IMO they lose if that happens.

 

[CloutierForVezina]

Duchene is a tremendous player and the Senators got a great upgrade with him. The cost was high but they didn't give up any prime assets and this positions them really well to compete for a cup in the next 2 years.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Duchene post over a point per game with Ottawa. Hoffman and Stone are better than any winger he's played with in the last few years and Karlsson is way better than any defenseman he's had behind him in his entire career. Going to be a real pretty sight seeing Karlsson catch Duchene in full stride with some outlet passes.

 

[bob27]

It looks pretty fair right now. Depending on how the picks and prospects turn out, one side will look genius and the other like moron.

 

[Mr Hat]

I would be worried if I was a Sens fan. In today's NHL you can't be trading your future away. They have traded ALOT of their future away the past 2 seasons.

Thanks for Dahlin tho we are thankful.

I live in BC and hear about the nucks alot. The future is much brighter in Ottawa.

You are talking about our 4th and 10th best prospect and a lottery protected first given over 2 years as alot? Not to mention our top prospect has elite dman potential... Lol

[mod]

 

[CanuckGame39]

I live in BC and hear about the nucks alot. The future is much brighter in Ottawa.

You are talking about our 4th and 10th best prospect and a lottery protected first given over 2 years as alot? Not to mention our top prospect has elite dman potential... Lol

[mod]

 

[Sensin5]

[Q

The fact the Sens gave up

Turris
1st
3rd
Bowers(1st in '17)
Hammond (throw away)

For Duchene

Is absolutely embarrssing. I have nothing against the Sens or their fans. But the amount of futures given away the last 2 seasons is ridiculous. You can't make it in today's NHL doing this ****.[/QUOTE]

So typical of HF. All draft picks are magically top 6 material. The Sens issue currently is a large number of NHL ready or near ready players, and they managed to keep all of the top ones. Most fans love Turris but it became clear he would not re-sign here, so the option is lose for nothing or do a deal. We got easily the best player to be traded for in a long time - an elite top line centre, which is a rare commodity. And it seems we got a guy who really wants to be here. Most Sens fans who follow the game closely are very pleased at this deal, despite losing a really good player and good guy. Definite upgrade.

 

[Sensin5]

The choice was to re-sign Turris at 6*6.

Completely wrong. Typical. 6 at 6 per not on the table for Ottawa.

 

[grim]

Duchene is a tremendous player and the Senators got a great upgrade with him. The cost was high but they didn't give up any prime assets and this positions them really well to compete for a cup in the next 2 years.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Duchene post over a point per game with Ottawa. Hoffman and Stone are better than any winger he's played with in the last few years and Karlsson is way better than any defenseman he's had behind him in his entire career. Going to be a real pretty sight seeing Karlsson catch Duchene in full stride with some outlet passes.

He even made Yakupov look good. Isn't there a special end-of-year NHL award for that?

 

[Boud]

Explain

 

[Shruggs Peterson]

I’d love to hear how Batherson jumped 3 rounds after 18 games. This is classic downplaying after you trade someone

I haven't seen many Sens fans that were happy that they picked Shane Bowers at 28 when Tolvanen and Kostin were still on the board. It was a safe pick and it was even less encouraging to hear why Dorian picked him. He said he had intangibles and a great character. Bowers does many things well but there is no area where he excels, as per his scouting report.

Batherson on the other hand had a great camp and was signed to an ELC by the Sens. It's incredibly impressive for a 4th round pick from the previous June to sign an ELC so early.

So sure there is some downplaying, but Bowers was never an exciting pick. Projects to be a low 2C/3C which the Sens should have in Colin White.

 

[TropicalFruitGirl2]

Ottawa certainly DID give up quite a bit to acquire Duchene, but as was mentioned several times already, they HAD the prospects/picks to give while still maintaining a pretty good pool of talent below the NHL level.
Also, if Duchene helps Ottawa to a championship (even if he leaves as a UFA in two seasons) it would all be worth it for the Sens.

Granted, the Sens winning a Stanley Cup in the next two years will NOT be an easy thing for them to accomplish, but it is very possible nonetheless.

Also, while only the two parties involved know for sure (the Turris camp and Sens management), I suspect there was more going on behind the scenes that the public simply isn't aware of.
Some type of breakdown in the relationship between Turris and Sens management.

It has been said elsewhere that Turris and his agent can be difficult to deal with.
Maybe so, maybe not...but IF so, perhaps Ottawa saw the opportunity to upgrade (however mildy) with Duchene, and even though it cost them what it did (again, remembering they had the pieces to give), made the deal to NOT have to deal with Turris or his agent any longer.

All speculation of course.
But for a team like the Sens who have core players who are either in their prime NOW or are exiting their prime, they'd like to win as soon as possible and they obviously felt the price for Duchene was an acceptable consequence for a chance for the former Colorado player to help them achieve a championship now.
And who knows...even when Duchene's contract is up, he may like playing in Ottawa enough to sign an extension that would fit what the Sens want to build around the rest of the team with.

 

[Jarey Curry]

Colorado kind of lost too. They gave up their bet chip for the foreseeable future for a ton of question marks. Didn't get the d-man they wanted or even a slightly comparable d-man.

Nashville made out alright imo. Didn't give up all that much for a top 6 center, but 6 years for Turris is a bit much. That contract is going to be rough toward the end I think.

And how you know Col didn't get even a slightly comparable d man in Girard? He's smaller and only 19 and still making a case for himself that he can play in nhl already. And that's only one piece colorado received.... Yikes