Ukrainians in the NHL

[Garl]

Russia isn't a great example: it had like 5% of its modern territory 1000 years ago, is one of the most ethnically diverse countries on Earth and has a huge inner migration over the Soviet times. There's a Russian saying: "scratch a Russian, and you'll find a Tatar". Hapan or maybe something like Netherlands would be a better proof for your point.

1.Majority of the population still lives in the European part of Russia.
2.Ethnic russians account for smth like 80% of the population. And if you take national republics out, it will be closer to 95%. Russia is not so ethnically diverse actually.
3.Soviet inner migration? It was really hard to relocate from one city to another in USSR thanks to propiska. Inner migration wasn't such a big deal really.
4.I heard that saying. It has some truth in Ural or Volga region, but not generally. Comes from a widespread belief that tatars and mongols actively mixed with russian during Golden Horde times which is not based on any evidence.
5.There's much bigger chance to find a finn actually, there have been many finnish tribes assimilated by slavs in northern Russia. Still has a lot of finnish city names(Koryazhma, Kirishi etc).

 

[Absolut]

Seriously, man. You need a history lesson. Back then there was no Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan etc, it was the Soviet Union.

http://geacron.com/en/?v=m&lang=en&...0853554&nd=-1&d=&di=1968&tm=p&ct=0&ly=yyyyyyy

The thread is not about Ukraine the independent nation. And yes, "back then" there was Ukraine, Russia and Kazakhstan. Soviet Union = USSR = Union Of Soviet Socialist Republics. Ukraine, Russia and Kazakhstan (among others) were those republics. Each with distinct culture, language, ethnic make up and tradition. So to say there was no Ukraine back then is just wrong. Ukrainian culture has existed for centuries, going back to Kievan Rus. How do I know all this? I googled it. Please feel free to do the same, before suggesting "history lessons" to other posters.

 

[SashaSemin28]

Seriously, man. You need a history lesson. Back then there was no Ukraine, Russia, Kazakhstan etc, it was the Soviet Union.

http://geacron.com/en/?v=m&lang=en&...0853554&nd=-1&d=&di=1968&tm=p&ct=0&ly=yyyyyyy

By your logic, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have not existed for hundreds of years.

Why do you think the current Ukrainian government have banned the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic anthem (after it was used as Zhivi Novorossiya). And why would a country which didn't exist have its own national anthem? (As did every Soviet Socialist Republic except the Russian SFSR)

 

[Absolut]

By your logic, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have not existed for hundreds of years.

Why do you think the current Ukrainian government have banned the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic anthem (after it was used as Zhivi Novorossiya). And why would a country which didn't exist have its own national anthem? (As did every Soviet Socialist Republic except the Russian SFSR)

He has no logic. Just mind-boggling level of ignorance.

 

[D0ctorCool]

I don't know about Ukranian NHLer's in particular, but I do know there are a lot of people of Ukranian descent who watch hockey regularly.

 

[SaltNPeca]

Hm, no? In a country like Russia or Germany majority of people can trace their ancestry for 1000 years, and they lived there all that time.

In modern West Germany this is simply not true in my experience.

There are maybe 1 or 2 people I work with that are what you might call "true German" in the modern sense. The rest have Portuguese, Hungarian, Polish, Russian, Kazakh, Baltic, American, or some other mix.

Not to mention the recent history of mass immigration and 1,000,000+ refugees simply walking in...

For ages Germany has been fragmented culturally and mixed racially. It is really the language that binds the country, then culture. Race or ancestry quickly becomes confusing despite your 1000 year claim.

A unified German nation-state has only existed for arguably ~150 years. The period described as Kleinstaaterei lasted from the 13th century to 1871.

 

[GaboriklessWild]

The thread is not about Ukraine the independent nation. And yes, "back then" there was Ukraine, Russia and Kazakhstan. Soviet Union = USSR = Union Of Soviet Socialist Republics. Ukraine, Russia and Kazakhstan (among others) were those republics. Each with distinct culture, language, ethnic make up and tradition. So to say there was no Ukraine back then is just wrong. Ukrainian culture has existed for centuries, going back to Kievan Rus. How do I know all this? I googled it. Please feel free to do the same, before suggesting "history lessons" to other posters.

Come on dude, what are you talking about and who is talking about ethnicities?

This was the original comment

Peter Bonda was born in Ukraine

Come on man. Bondra has nothing to do with Ukraine. His father is Slovak and his mother polish origin.

He was born in the Soviet Union. Stop making stuff up, Ukraine did not exist then. His father is Slovak, he just got a job in the Soviet Union. When Peter was three years old Bondra's family returned to Czechoslovakia.

If you were born in Lutsk/Lviv/Kiev/Moscow at the time, you were born in the Soviet Union. Independent Ukraine/Russia etc did not exist then. How hard is it to understand? Seriously!

By your logic, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have not existed for hundreds of years.

Nope dude, that's not my logic at all.

 

[Bear12Good]

Kovalchuk
Kovalenko
Datsyuk
Nikolishin
Zherdev
Grigorenko
Semak
Korolyuk
Oksiuta
Lyashenko
Marchenko

 

[Absolut]

Come on dude, what are you talking about and who is talking about ethnicities?

I am. And everyone else - except you. I stated several times that my question was about ETHNIC UKRAINIANS. OP was mine and I explained that persons of interest were guys like Parayko. OP had nothing to do with Ukraine in geo-political sense. Regardless, you are missing everyone's point that Ukraine existed as part of USSR. Independent or not is irrelevant. Just like nations like Slovakia, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Poland etc. existed whether they were independent or not.

 

[GaboriklessWild]

I am. And everyone else - except you. I stated several times that my question was about ETHNIC UKRAINIANS. OP was mine and I explained that persons of interest were guys like Parayko. OP had nothing to do with Ukraine in geo-political sense. Regardless, you are missing everyone's point that Ukraine existed as part of USSR. Independent or not is irrelevant. Just like nations like Slovakia, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, Poland etc. existed whether they were independent or not.

Dude, don't insult my intelligence. I don't care about 'ethnic ukrainians' or 'ukrainian' hockey players. This is the only thing I answered:

Peter Bonda was born in Ukraine but grew up in Slovakia. He's probably the best one.

Bondra is not an ukrainian and was not born in ukraine. Deal with it. I'm 100% sure his birth certificate showing that he was born in Lutsk, Soviet Union.

Also, it is clear that there are huge holes in your history knowledge. By your logic, Bondra was born in Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth, Russia, Austria-Hungary or Poland which probably makes the most sense from this perspective. In the last 600-700 years the present-day West-Ukraina was mostly part of Poland and Poles and Jews lived there (hence Bondra's mother is Polish). During the WW2 the Polish government fled here but the ukrainian army who collaborated with the nazi Germany has occupied this area. Later the Soviet troops liberated it and annexed from Poland. This is the only reason that Estern-Galicia is now known as Ukraine. It can be said from the rest of Ukraine as well. This is why Ukraine is Europe's 21st century 'Balkans' and a lot of trouble here.

 

[Absolut]

Dude, don't insult my intelligence. I don't care about 'ethnic ukrainians' or 'ukrainian' hockey players. This is the only thing I answered:


Bondra is not an ukrainian and was not born in ukraine. Deal with it. I'm 100% sure his birth certificate showing that he was born in Lutsk, Soviet Union.

Also, it is clear that there are huge holes in your history knowledge. By your logic, Bondra was born in Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth, Russia, Austria-Hungary or Poland which probably makes the most sense from this perspective. In the last 600-700 years the present-day West-Ukraina was mostly part of Poland and Poles and Jews lived there (hence Bondra's mother is Polish). During the WW2 the Polish government fled here but the ukrainian army who collaborated with the nazi Germany has occupied this area. Later the Soviet troops liberated it and annexed from Poland. This is the only reason that Estern-Galicia is now known as Ukraine. It can be said from the rest of Ukraine as well. This is why Ukraine is Europe's 21st century 'Balkans' and a lot of trouble here.

Please pay close attention: the point disputed by numerous posters is that "Ukraine and Russia and Kazakhstan didn't even exist then. " They did. As part of the USSR. You can argue the opposite until you are blue in the face. And you will be wrong. Someone born in Kiev was born in Ukraine. Someone born in Moscow was born in Russia. They were also born in Soviet Union. Because Ukraine and Russia were part of Soviet Union. It doesn't matter how much you argue the opposite.

 

[Shakey Rustie]

Please pay close attention: the point disputed by numerous posters is that "Ukraine and Russia and Kazakhstan didn't even exist then. " They did. As part of the USSR. You can argue the opposite until you are blue in the face. And you will be wrong. Someone born in Kiev was born in Ukraine. Someone born in Moscow was born in Russia. They were also born in Soviet Union. Because Ukraine and Russia were part of Soviet Union. It doesn't matter how much you argue the opposite.

My grandparents were Ukrainains who were born in Austria-Hungary. A large portion (if not most) of the Ukrainians that came to Canada in the late 1800s and early 1900s came from that area of Ukraine.

 

[GaboriklessWild]

Please pay close attention: the point disputed by numerous posters is that "Ukraine and Russia and Kazakhstan didn't even exist then. " They did. As part of the USSR. You can argue the opposite until you are blue in the face. And you will be wrong. Someone born in Kiev was born in Ukraine. Someone born in Moscow was born in Russia. They were also born in Soviet Union. Because Ukraine and Russia were part of Soviet Union. It doesn't matter how much you argue the opposite.

You really need to chill. No one disputes that the Ukrainians do not exist, but Ukraine as the country is a different thing.

The region we today call 'Ukraine' has a long history but 'Ukrainians', like all national identities, are far more recent. Ukrainian nationalist can conjure up a glorious Ukrainian history, stretching back centuries. But, geography aside, that's going to have very little to do with modern Ukrainian as a nationality.

 

[Kamus]

You really need to chill. No one disputes that the Ukrainians do not exist, but Ukraine as the country is a different thing.

The region we today call 'Ukraine' has a long history but 'Ukrainians', like all national identities, are far more recent. Ukrainian nationalist can conjure up a glorious Ukrainian history, stretching back centuries. But, geography aside, that's going to have very little to do with modern Ukrainian as a nationality.

You can definitely see your bias, thank you for confirming it. Wow, another empire telling people of a region/area what and how they should define themselves based on "official" history as quoted by you.

 

[Ziggyjoe21]

Dude, don't insult my intelligence. I don't care about 'ethnic ukrainians' or 'ukrainian' hockey players. This is the only thing I answered:


Bondra is not an ukrainian and was not born in ukraine. Deal with it. I'm 100% sure his birth certificate showing that he was born in Lutsk, Soviet Union.

Also, it is clear that there are huge holes in your history knowledge. By your logic, Bondra was born in Polish–Lithuanian Commonwealth, Russia, Austria-Hungary or Poland which probably makes the most sense from this perspective. In the last 600-700 years the present-day West-Ukraina was mostly part of Poland and Poles and Jews lived there (hence Bondra's mother is Polish). During the WW2 the Polish government fled here but the ukrainian army who collaborated with the nazi Germany has occupied this area. Later the Soviet troops liberated it and annexed from Poland. This is the only reason that Estern-Galicia is now known as Ukraine. It can be said from the rest of Ukraine as well. This is why Ukraine is Europe's 21st century 'Balkans' and a lot of trouble here.

Yes Ukraine was part of the USSR at that time. Ukraine was also a country at that time, and has existed for hundreds of years.

Just because it was part of the USSR doesn't mean it didn't exist. That's silly.

 

[GaboriklessWild]

You can definitely see your bias, thank you for confirming it. Wow, another empire telling people of a region/area what and how they should define themselves based on "official" history as quoted by you.

I'm from Slovakia (formerly Czechslovakia, Hungary, Austria-Hungary, Poland, Great Moravia, Avars) I have no problem with that. I do not need rewrite the history books, just like in Ukraine.

Ukraine ... has existed for hundreds of years.

When?

 

[Balance]

Yes Ukraine was part of the USSR at that time. Ukraine was also a country at that time, and has existed for hundreds of years.

Just because it was part of the USSR doesn't mean it didn't exist. That's silly.

Agreed, Ukrainian culture is older than Russian culture. It was basically the USSR that tried to wipe away Ukranian culture and unfortunately did that in Eastern Ukraine but in Western Ukraine the culture is stronger than ever and will never die.

The USSR imposed only speaking Russian, closed down Ukrainian churches, and did horrible atrocities like Holodomor and sent numerous Ukrainians to siberia.

 

[Ziggyjoe21]

I'm from Slovakia (formerly Czechslovakia, Hungary, Austria-Hungary, Poland, Great Moravia, Avars) I have no problem with that. I do not need rewrite the history books, just like in Ukraine.



When?

I don't understand what your angle is.

The modern country of Ukraine has existed since the early 19th century. However, Kiev and earlier iterations of Ukraine go back to the 9th century. Look it up.