UFC betting scandal (fighters barred from associating with James Krause, Jeff Molina suspended)

[CDJ]

You can't really make injuries public in MMA prior to a fight and we know many of these guys have preexisting injuries from camp, those injuries would definitely be targeted. I think Dillashaw disclosing his injury to the ref prior to the fight was good enough but based on what we saw, he should have backed out. Usman comes to mind the first time he fought Masvidal.

I don't actually see the bets Krause made going 8 for 8. Were they all on his fighters or against his fighters? They need to make an example of him for sure if they have the evidence.

They weren’t all his fighters, as a matter of fact looking at the 8 bets now I’m pretty sure none of them were his fighters

He’s pretty good at breaking down fights, I think that was just a pretty easy card to bet. I’m on an all time cold streak and I even won money that card (before immediately losing it all back and then some on this last card)

 

[pistolpete11]

I still think TJ was delusion and wanting a paycheck. Maybe there's some evidence that he or his team is involved in betting, but I haven't seen it.

With Krause, this is why other sports banned betting a looooong time ago. Even if he didn't do anything (which seems very unlikely at this point), the optics are terrible.

 

[td_ice]

$100 bet would've paid out $50,000.

Not sus at all.

I think it was a couple years ago, a poster on here picked 11 fights, 11 wins. I wish I would have commented on it, at the time. (I doubled check time stamp, and no edit of the post). But I did not.

 

[m9]

The most interesting piece of the Krause picks to me is two picks on Spivac, even though the fight didn't happen.

We know Lewis pulled out with some sort of illness/medical thing, could that have gotten out?

I'll say it again, the biggest thing that could come of this might be some coach betting ring that involves Krause and others where the teams trade information so they all know who to bet on. Then you wouldn't have to bet on your own fighters, you could bet on fighters from other camps. Like one of those revenge movies where two people go after the other's enemies to stay hidden in plain sight.

 

[pistolpete11]

The most interesting piece of the Krause picks to me is two picks on Spivac, even though the fight didn't happen.

We know Lewis pulled out with some sort of illness/medical thing, could that have gotten out?

I'll say it again, the biggest thing that could come of this might be some coach betting ring that involves Krause and others where the teams trade information so they all know who to bet on. Then you wouldn't have to bet on your own fighters, you could bet on fighters from other camps. Like one of those revenge movies where two people go after the other's enemies to stay hidden in plain sight.

Frankly, as long as they aren't throwing fights like they essentially did with Minner, I wouldn't even care. The only people they are really screwing over are the sportbooks who make money hand over fist. They're just dummies for getting caught. Edit: I guess if they are giving out their fighter's injury details without them knowing, that's pretty f***ed up, though it seems like Minner was probably in on it in this case.

I don't know how you really stop it. Stuff is always going to get leaked. I'm sure it does in the stick and ball sports as well but 1) it's way more of an impact when it is 1-on-1 physical combat and 2) you don't have coaches talking about betting out in the open in those sports. If it wasn't for the optics, I don't think the UFC would really care. They will make an example of Krause and pretend like it was 1 bad apple. Just like the NBA did with Tim Donaghy. If there are other guys, they will tighten up and operate more in the shadows. The next controversy will come along and everybody will move on.

Looking forward to the 30 for 30 in a few years, though.

 

[CDJ]

I think it was a couple years ago, a poster on here picked 11 fights, 11 wins. I wish I would have commented on it, at the time. (I doubled check time stamp, and no edit of the post). But I did not.

Spoiler alert it wasn’t me

The most interesting piece of the Krause picks to me is two picks on Spivac, even though the fight didn't happen.

We know Lewis pulled out with some sort of illness/medical thing, could that have gotten out?

I'll say it again, the biggest thing that could come of this might be some coach betting ring that involves Krause and others where the teams trade information so they all know who to bet on. Then you wouldn't have to bet on your own fighters, you could bet on fighters from other camps. Like one of those revenge movies where two people go after the other's enemies to stay hidden in plain sight.

To be fair I also made those Spivac bets, he was a considerable favorite

 

[td_ice]

Spoiler alert it wasn’t me

Hahaha.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

I could be wrong but I think there's a big difference between TJ and Minner. I don't recall there being a massive line movement with TJ I'm pretty sure his team somehow kept it quiet or at least kept their bets low key.

 

[MD thaivuN]

I think it was a couple years ago, a poster on here picked 11 fights, 11 wins. I wish I would have commented on it, at the time. (I doubled check time stamp, and no edit of the post). But I did not.

This is probably the closest I'll ever be to a perfect win prediction hahaha

 

[m9]

Yeah, I have no doubt that Krause (and many other people) have had great nights betting MMA. I know that "picks list" from Krause got posted on Twitter like it's some smoking gun but it's nothing. You can be assured they've got much more evidence than that.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Decent info here,

 

[m9]

Decent info here,

Thanks for posting - I had meant to watch this and then completely forgot. Good recap for those who haven't really been paying attention. If you have been paying attention, not much new info here.

I know Dana has been pissy at Ariel again this week and you wonder if this video has something to do with it. Dana White is super arrogant and dismissive in this in regards to the original betting situation with Minner. He also shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how betting works, which is kind of crazy for someone who has done his share of gambling/betting and has basically lived in/around here in Vegas half his life. Bad look for Dana overall.

They play some of Ariel's interview with Krause and I wonder if something Krause said might end up being a bit of a bigger deal. He mentions that he "makes bets for other people" or "goes on their account" or something like that. Wonder if this is as simple as he's making bets under other people's accounts to skirt limits or even to collect bonuses, which betting companies could easily catch if he's making the same bets everywhere all the time. This would explain the Minner line moving so much as well if he had a bunch of accounts he was pushing money through within a couple hour period.

 

[pistolpete11]

Thanks for posting - I had meant to watch this and then completely forgot. Good recap for those who haven't really been paying attention. If you have been paying attention, not much new info here.

I know Dana has been pissy at Ariel again this week and you wonder if this video has something to do with it. Dana White is super arrogant and dismissive in this in regards to the original betting situation with Minner. He also shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how betting works, which is kind of crazy for someone who has done his share of gambling/betting and has basically lived in/around here in Vegas half his life. Bad look for Dana overall.

They play some of Ariel's interview with Krause and I wonder if something Krause said might end up being a bit of a bigger deal. He mentions that he "makes bets for other people" or "goes on their account" or something like that. Wonder if this is as simple as he's making bets under other people's accounts to skirt limits or even to collect bonuses, which betting companies could easily catch if he's making the same bets everywhere all the time. This would explain the Minner line moving so much as well if he had a bunch of accounts he was pushing money through within a couple hour period.

Dana's clearly just trying to down play this as much as possible, but it is kind of strange that he's pretending like there is nothing here. I think he would be better off trying to frame it as 1 rogue coach/fighter.

 

[m9]

Dana's clearly just trying to down play this as much as possible, but it is kind of strange that he's pretending like there is nothing here. I think he would be better off trying to frame it as 1 rogue coach/fighter.

In his defense (kind of) the clip I was referencing was from a couple of weeks when the Integrity group was first investigating the issue, it's not from now.

But that being said, you can go back to the Lemos/Rodriguez thread (or other places online, I'm sure) and see that right away people thought something was up. White's kind of a "stupid or liar" thing to me here.. he either truly believed nothing happened which is incredibly stupid.. or he's just straight up lying to protect his brand.

 

[pistolpete11]

In his defense (kind of) the clip I was referencing was from a couple of weeks when the Integrity group was first investigating the issue, it's not from now.

But that being said, you can go back to the Lemos/Rodriguez thread (or other places online, I'm sure) and see that right away people thought something was up. White's kind of a "stupid or liar" thing to me here.. he either truly believed nothing happened which is incredibly stupid.. or he's just straight up lying to protect his brand.

Dana is a lot of things, but stupid isn't 1 of them. Especially when it comes to gambling, as you pointed out before, something he's been around his entire career.

 

[chicagoskycam]

I think Dana kept referring to one large better that was refused at a Sportsbook vs the overall movement of the line prior to the fight. I didn’t really care for the dismissive attitude, he should had said we take this very seriously and if it’s proven, we will take action. He acts like this isn’t a problem but again, his tune has probably changed since then.

The interview with Krause was a bit disturbing. He mentioned the discord channel being his primary source of income and that be barely makes any money as a coach. Placing bets for people. It’s clear he was more motivated by his betting gig. These guys have so much insider info so I’m sure he hasn’t been the only one.

 

[pistolpete11]

White calls fight fixing 'huge concern' for UFC

UFC president Dana White told ESPN that fight fixing is a "huge concern" for the promotion

www.espn.com

Dana's at least admitting there is a concern now

 

[MMC]

 

[MMC]

 

[m9]

Well, better late than never.

I wonder if eventually we'll find out why most people were so slow on this one. UFC/Dana White said it's nothing, okay. Protect the brand.

But the MMA media for the most part went radio silent and didn't comment on it. I like MMAFighting and listen/read to some of their stuff, but they basically ignored it or said it was nothing. They weren't the only ones. But yet people online were able to figure it really quick? I get there's a difference between being some guy online and actually reporting on something, but it's really weird how almost nobody would talk about it or was even willing to give a real opinion.

 

[pistolpete11]

Well, better late than never.

I wonder if eventually we'll find out why most people were so slow on this one. UFC/Dana White said it's nothing, okay. Protect the brand.

But the MMA media for the most part went radio silent and didn't comment on it. I like MMAFighting and listen/read to some of their stuff, but they basically ignored it or said it was nothing. They weren't the only ones. But yet people online were able to figure it really quick? I get there's a difference between being some guy online and actually reporting on something, but it's really weird how almost nobody would talk about it or was even willing to give a real opinion.

Luke Thomas talks about it a lot, but MMA media is very access based. Nobody wants to stick their neck out and piss of the UFC, Dana, coaches, managers, fighters, etc. because then they can't get the interviews or whatever else.

I think Krause is pretty well liked throughout the industry, so it's better for most of them to just shut up and see what happens. Don't want to be critical and then end up being wrong.

 

[DingerMcSlapshot]

Dana should be investaged in match fixing. Too many bad decisions to be coincidence. UFC has turned into a joke.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

A Krause fighter who the column is saying is linked to the investigation gets suspended...

 

[CDJ]

Explains why he’s not fighting Jimmy Flick soon. Molina is a good prospect and a fun fighter. Would be a shame if he did something stupid to put an end to his career

 

[MMC]