GDT: UFA Watch central thread Part II

[Redux91]

And MTL made a better offer to Bonino yet he still chose to go to Nashville.

Nashville had gone to the cup.... VS him!

 

[jaffy27]

Excuse.

It’s a fact, not an excuse

 

[scrubadam]

3 out of 4 teams New York area. I'm guessing he likes New York.

And Dallas popping up again.

A team that missed the playoffs 2 years in a row, 3 of the last 5. Yet players keep wanting to go there. Radu/Hanzal JT and now DeHaan this year.

But taxes and weather have nothing to do with players decisions they only care about winning

 

[Bryson]

Nashville had gone to the cup.... VS him!

And Statsny signed with the team that eliminated him!

Oh Hossa... see what you started!!

 

[scrubadam]

So which newspaper or news channel do you work for?

There are close to 20 teams who are in the 50-55% total tax range in the league.

New York and Toronto are very close to Montreal, there's close to a 1% difference between all of the 3.

It's the prevailing pro hockey culture which is the problem and both Habs management and the sports media are to blame.

So why have the habs had trouble bringing in UFA for the last 30 + years? Why couldn't Gainey get Danny B or Sundin?

Winning makes a difference but I dont think for the majority of players its the highest priority. And what a team looks like today can be different in a year or 2 or 3. Most GM's last on average just under 5 years and coaches even less. Odds are if you are signing for 4 years or more you outlast the GM and coach.

And how can you explain Dallas which signed 2 big UFA last year in Hanzal and Radu, and are on DeHaan's and JT's list of cities to play in? When Dallas has missed the playoffs 3 out of the last 5 years and the past 2 years consecutively?

Being a disaster isn't helping the team, but after the team went to the ECF they couldn't get any UFA. The next year they finished 2nd in the NHL and got Semin. After getting 100 points and winning the division they lost Radu to Dallas and only signed Alzner.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

And Dallas popping up again.

A team that missed the playoffs 2 years in a row, 3 of the last 5. Yet players keep wanting to go there. Radu/Hanzal JT and now DeHaan this year.

But taxes and weather have nothing to do with players decisions they only care about winning

why would u want to waste 25m on 5 years for De-haan , awful

Also explain ''big ufa'' and Hanzal Martin Hanzal hockey statistics and profile at hockeydb.com

Wilds wasted a 1st on Hanzal
and then Dallas signed this garbage player in the ufa for 5m for 3 years with NTC

talk about overrated

 

[Michelangelo]

Read his post again, he said that Québec has no top-notch players, he never mentioned the UFA status. It's true that Québec doesn't produce nearly enough compared to the other hockey hotbeds, but Michaelangelo is being of bad faith to pretend there are no top players hailing from here. I simply rectified his false claims.

As for Couturier, he lived most of his childhood in Québec. His father moved the family in NB when he was mistreated by Hockey Québec (his father wanted Sean to play for another team than the one from his region). Still a product of the province.

It can be interpreted both ways, because we're talking about UFAs, but, his phrasing was more general.

Pas vraiment, c'était vraiment juste un commentaire général. Faut pas sur-interpréter non plus..

Well if he's saying there's no good Quebec players at all, he's just trolling. Maybe I'm trying to diffuse the situation by making it a more relevant statement.

hmm I should have been more clear -- it was in relation to the Tavares signing, not just talking about any NHLer. The only times were remotely "close" to signing one was in the times of Briere circa 2007 and Lecavalier

My point was that as of now --- the only Quebecois player imo up there in stature with a player like John Tavares is Patrice Bergeron (and perhaps Fleury) --- and thus it would be difficult to attract a big name hometown player given how sparse they are. Granted, the case could also be made for Vlasic and Letang.

I am fully aware that there strong talent coming up with the Dubois, Lavoie, Lafreniere. My intention wasn't to create a debate about the future at all. That being said, I am fully on board the Alexis Lafreniere 2020 train.

 

[Kac3e]

Is it me but i wont mind for Emelin coming back. ...way better then Benn shelmok

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

Is it me but i wont mind for Emelin coming back. ...way better then Benn shelmok

Get rid of Benn and Schlemko and sign Emelin for 1 year 1m and maybe ill think about it

 

[scrubadam]

why would u want to waste 25m on 5 years for De-haan , awful

Also explain ''big ufa'' and Hanzal Martin Hanzal hockey statistics and profile at hockeydb.com

Wilds wasted a 1st on Hanzal
and then Dallas signed this garbage player in the ufa for 5m for 3 years with NTC

talk about overrated

I didn't say I would sign them. Just find it interesting that UFA's seem to always have Dallas on their list. Even JT had Dallas on his list.

Its not that Dallas is this amazing winning cup contending franchise. They have 2 playoff appearances in the last 5 years.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

So why have the habs had trouble bringing in UFA for the last 30 + years? Why couldn't Gainey get Danny B or Sundin?

Winning makes a difference but I dont think for the majority of players its the highest priority. And what a team looks like today can be different in a year or 2 or 3. Most GM's last on average just under 5 years and coaches even less. Odds are if you are signing for 4 years or more you outlast the GM and coach.

And how can you explain Dallas which signed 2 big UFA last year in Hanzal and Radu, and are on DeHaan's and JT's list of cities to play in? When Dallas has missed the playoffs 3 out of the last 5 years and the past 2 years consecutively?

Being a disaster isn't helping the team, but after the team went to the ECF they couldn't get any UFA. The next year they finished 2nd in the NHL and got Semin. After getting 100 points and winning the division they lost Radu to Dallas and only signed Alzner.

Are you still arguing it's the taxes?

Despite NY and TO getting big time UFAs while having as high taxes as Mtl?

 

[Adam Michaels]

Are you still arguing it's the taxes?

Despite NY and TO getting big time UFAs while having as high taxes as Mtl?

California teams are also heavily taxed. But Toronto and New York are much more similar in weather, so much closer in comparison to Montreal, whereas the Cali teams at least have that going for them.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

I didn't say I would sign them. Just find it interesting that UFA's seem to always have Dallas on their list. Even JT had Dallas on his list.

Its not that Dallas is this amazing winning cup contending franchise. They have 2 playoff appearances in the last 5 years.

Because Dallas is a good city , good weather and quiet market.

 

[Bryson]

Because Dallas is a good city , good weather and quiet market.

Getting to play with Jamie Benn, Seguin and Radulov doesn't hurt either. They are just have trouble putting it all together but hard to blame them. Look at their division. It's the group of death lol.

 

[scrubadam]

Are you still arguing it's the taxes?

Despite NY and TO getting big time UFAs while having as high taxes as Mtl?

Taxes play a role but I think the bigger role is Language and Media and then overall city.

TBH I just think hockey wives/families don't want to transplant themselves here for 4/5 years and have to deal with 2 languages, deal with a TMZ style media, one in a language you don't understand, and in a city that for all intents and purposes has been on the decline for a couple of decades.

Hell ya I would rather live in NY or TO as opposed to MTL even if its the same taxes. Same with LA/SJ/DAL or probably 20 other cities in the NHL. Ask me to chose between EDM/OTT/BUF then Montreal might win out but those are the dreg cities of the league (no offense to anyone who lives in those cities).

Its been 30+ years so we can't just say its MB. MB even landed one of the better habs UFA signings in Radu. And even when the team was winning the best they could muster is Semin. So to me there is more at play than just MB. And don't get me wrong MB does play a role and the condition of the team does as well but its much smaller than factors outside of any GM's control.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Taxes play a role but I think the bigger role is Language and Media and then overall city.

TBH I just think hockey wives/families don't want to transplant themselves here for 4/5 years and have to deal with 2 languages, deal with a TMZ style media, one in a language you don't understand, and in a city that for all intents and purposes has been on the decline for a couple of decades.

Hell ya I would rather live in NY or TO as opposed to MTL even if its the same taxes. Same with LA/SJ/DAL or probably 20 other cities in the NHL. Ask me to chose between EDM/OTT/BUF then Montreal might win out but those are the dreg cities of the league (no offense to anyone who lives in those cities).

Its been 30+ years so we can't just say its MB. MB even landed one of the better habs UFA signings in Radu. And even when the team was winning the best they could muster is Semin. So to me there is more at play than just MB. And don't get me wrong MB does play a role and the condition of the team does as well but its much smaller than factors outside of any GM's control.

Hamrlik, Cammaleri, Gionta, Cole.

All good signings in the same breath as Radu. Although they all played more than just 1 year, except for Cole.

 

[DAChampion]

Montreal is a fun city to live in, but the way I read things on this site sometimes, I often feel like you guys need to travel more. I often get the sense that some believe that the culture and nightlife in Montreal are exceptionally good.

Millionaire pro athletes in their 20s and 30s can live a good life in most North American cities. There is nightlife, culture, museums, restaurants, etc nearly everywhere. There are beautiful women everywhere. Moreover, some hockey players may have different interests, they may wish to live in a place surrounded by a particular geography, or to go to someplace with great schools that don't require a lot of commuting.

 

[walsy37]

Taxes play a role but I think the bigger role is Language and Media and then overall city.

TBH I just think hockey wives/families don't want to transplant themselves here for 4/5 years and have to deal with 2 languages, deal with a TMZ style media, one in a language you don't understand, and in a city that for all intents and purposes has been on the decline for a couple of decades.

Hell ya I would rather live in NY or TO as opposed to MTL even if its the same taxes. Same with LA/SJ/DAL or probably 20 other cities in the NHL. Ask me to chose between EDM/OTT/BUF then Montreal might win out but those are the dreg cities of the league (no offense to anyone who lives in those cities).

Its been 30+ years so we can't just say its MB. MB even landed one of the better habs UFA signings in Radu. And even when the team was winning the best they could muster is Semin. So to me there is more at play than just MB. And don't get me wrong MB does play a role and the condition of the team does as well but its much smaller than factors outside of any GM's control.

This may be one of a few times I'll mostly agree with Scrubadam. ALL of those are reasons why players choose to go somewhere else. But generally speaking if you are not French, the media will try and run you out of town and that gets noticed. While Toronto and others have large media spotlights, the only city that players have to deal with that issue is Montreal. And if the media is not enough navigating through the complexities of French education adds on.

With respect to Tavares, if someone does not think that what MB and this franchise did to his close friend from childhood played a role in not even giving a sniff, then.. .

 

[scrubadam]

Hamrlik, Cammaleri, Gionta, Cole.

All good signings in the same breath as Radu. Although they all played more than just 1 year, except for Cole.

Well I did say one of the better signings.

But ya look at that list. Not exactly a murders row of talent there. Decent players but if thats what your hanging your hat on to show how UFA's love Montreal, well it kinda proves the opposite at least IMO.

It comes down to people not from here on the whole would chose to apply their trade and live their lives in a myriad of other cities that provide everything Montreal does but just better.

If the team is good they have a better chance of overpaying a UFA to come here. If the team sucks they have very little chance. But both ends I think the chance is smaller than 80% of the teams in the NHL.

 

[MaxDummy]

But taxes and weather have nothing to do with players decisions they only care about winning

I dont think anyone said it had NOTHING To do... but at the end of da day there is more important variables .

 

[Team_Spirit]

Because Dallas is a good city , good weather and quiet market.

NHLers spend their time at the practice facility and f*** off to the lake house in the summer.

The real reason is the lowest taxes in the NHL

 

[Wats]

And Dallas popping up again.

A team that missed the playoffs 2 years in a row, 3 of the last 5. Yet players keep wanting to go there. Radu/Hanzal JT and now DeHaan this year.

But taxes and weather have nothing to do with players decisions they only care about winning

They have names like Seguin/Benn/Klingberg/Radu/Bishop. But sure let's pretend they're like Montreal's roster just because they both missed playoffs 2/3 years. Players would be lining up to play with LTIR staples Price/Weber and ghost captain without the tax/weather.

 

[Tyson]

These GM’s never learn. They throw money and long contracts at guys who are about done-
Ladd
Hanzal
Alzner
Backes
Lucic

So many more insane contracts that backfired.

In this regard I am glad Bergevin is not going down this road this year.

 

[scrubadam]

I dont think anyone said it had NOTHING To do... but at the end of da day there is more important variables .

I wont deny winning helps, its why JT landed in TOR and Stamkos didn't.

But for the habs its a blip on the radar compared to the other obstacles they have to face.

I don't think JT choses MTL over the other teams on his list even if the Habs had a nice run last year. Maybe would of taken our calls but I doubt he would of come here.

 

[yianik]

So why have the habs had trouble bringing in UFA for the last 30 + years? Why couldn't Gainey get Danny B or Sundin?

Winning makes a difference but I dont think for the majority of players its the highest priority. And what a team looks like today can be different in a year or 2 or 3. Most GM's last on average just under 5 years and coaches even less. Odds are if you are signing for 4 years or more you outlast the GM and coach.

And how can you explain Dallas which signed 2 big UFA last year in Hanzal and Radu, and are on DeHaan's and JT's list of cities to play in? When Dallas has missed the playoffs 3 out of the last 5 years and the past 2 years consecutively?

Being a disaster isn't helping the team, but after the team went to the ECF they couldn't get any UFA. The next year they finished 2nd in the NHL and got Semin. After getting 100 points and winning the division they lost Radu to Dallas and only signed Alzner.

Aside from 4th liners, which scoring type players would have willingly wanted to play for MT ?