Blue Jays Discussion: Trade deadline coming: Jays acquire 3B Valencia from KC for C Kratz, P Hendriks.

[613Leafer]

Also, to the "Jays are not a young team" comment

35+
Buehrle
Dickey

30-34
Happ
Janssen
McGowan
Navarro
Johnson
Kawasaki
Reyes
Tolleson
Bautista
Reimold
Encarnacion
Lind
Morrow

25-29
Cecil
Loup
Redmond
Thole
Francisco
Goins
Valencia
Cabrera
Rasmus

<25
Hutchison
Sanchez
Stroman
Gose
Lawrie

Basically half the roster is under 30. and several of the 30-34 guys like Edwin, Lind, Reyes, Janssen, McGowan are all like 30-32. Plus 3 important pieces in the rotation moving forward are all under 25, and our starting 3B is under 25.

There's going to be some turnover among some of the elite playrs soon, but we're not the Yankees, running out a roster of greybeards.

Guys like Thole, Redmond, Cecil, Francisco, Loup, Valencia, etc all count the same amount as guys like Bautista, EE, Dickey, Buerhle, Lind, etc, in your "analysis".

The length of time you can keep a good strong core together is what matters, not the secondary/tertiary pieces. We have some good young pitchers, but will need to replace Dickey/Buerhles 350-400 innings within the next few years, and most of our key fielders are in their 30s with a relatively thin group of young guys to replace them with as they age / leave.

 

[Muston Atthews]

Hearing what Jose Bautista says is actually A LOT different. Geez, he goes on to say that you its mixed feelings and you can look at it the other way and that they believe in the club and didn't think they needed to go out and get another player.

Ya talk about taking what he said out of context

 

[Eyedea]

Lol. If not adding is going to kill the morale of a club house, than we have some immature players and dont deserve to win
Players need to perform. Not AA's fault he didn't want to risk the future

I wonder if Trout is voicing his displeasure to Angels management right now. Clearly it must have killed their morale too seeing the A's went after Lester and Dipoto was sitting there twiddling his thumbs.

 

[mikebel111*]

He was willing to trade 2 of our top 5 prospects for a 38 year old knuckleballer though

And? That deal is looking decent but yeah Dickey is a joke
Am I right?

 

[Dingers]

Will adding Cliff Lee at the trade waiver deadline be a possibility

 

[mikebel111*]

I wonder if Trout is voicing his displeasure to Angels management right now.

Thats the thing. I love Jose's passion. He wants to win. But what does complaining to the media do?

 

[Canada4Gold]

Guys like Thole, Redmond, Cecil, Francisco, Loup, Valencia, etc all count the same amount as guys like Bautista, EE, Dickey, Buerhle, Lind, etc, in your "analysis".

The length of time you can keep a good strong core together is what matters, not the secondary/tertiary pieces. We have some good young pitchers, but will need to replace Dickey/Buerhles 350-400 innings within the next few years, and most of our key fielders are in their 30s with a relatively thin group of young guys to replace them with as they age / leave.

have you heard the names Sanchez and Norris before? The Jays have some really good almost MLB ready pitching prospects. To the point where we could probably go out and trade Buerhle and Dickey in the offseason and use cheap young piutching for the forseeable future. In doing so they would clear salary to resign Melky, and use that money to bring in some other players.

Pompey is only a year out, Pentecost maybe 2 or 3. Lawrie is still very young, and Bautista/EE will be here long enough for the guys very low down in the farm to develop.

I don't know where you got your info but it's definately not a playoffs of bust year. It would have been if you went out and bought a Laster or a Price though, the future is still very bright.

But by all means ignore the facts, I really enjoy laughing at the nonsense posts that fill up half these pages

 

[Bravid Nonahan]

And? That deal is looking decent but yeah Dickey is a joke
Am I right?

No, you're rambling like a fool. You said that AA wasn't willing to mortgage the future in a deal. Just a year and a half ago, he was willing to trade 2 of our top 5 prospects for RA Dickey. So don't ******** me about the fact that he didn't want to "mortgage the future" or whatever you want to call trading young players for established help.

 

[mikebel111*]

We will see how team plays in this series, that will tell the character of the club house.

 

[TootooTrain]

Hearing what Jose Bautista says is actually A LOT different. Geez, he goes on to say that you its mixed feelings and you can look at it the other way and that they believe in the club and didn't think they needed to go out and get another player.

Gotta love those cherry picked quotes without context. Gets the masses riled up.

 

[theaub]

No, you're rambling like a fool. You said that AA wasn't willing to mortgage the future in a deal. Just a year and a half ago, he was willing to trade 2 of our top 5 prospects for RA Dickey. So don't ******** me about the fact that he didn't want to "mortgage the future" or whatever you want to call trading young players for established help.

So since AA apparently did so poorly mortgaging the future last time, you'd like him to do so again?

 

[mikebel111*]

No, you're rambling like a fool. You said that AA wasn't willing to mortgage the future in a deal. Just a year and a half ago, he was willing to trade 2 of our top 5 prospects for RA Dickey. So don't ******** me about the fact that he didn't want to "mortgage the future" or whatever you want to call trading young players for established help.

He did it one year. And since apparently those 2 prospects will be elite players according to you it seems. Let me guess we should have traded for a rental

 

[Muston Atthews]

So since AA apparently did so poorly mortgaging the future last time, you'd like him to do so again?

That's just a stupid comment. I don't see what that has to do with anytging

 

[Jaysfanatic*]

Just trade Bautista and EE at this point. Both are worth premium position player prospects now. Keep the pitching staff in tact.

 

[trellaine201]

We can still make a trade in August? But chances are these players won't be as good as pre august? Safe to say? For the most part.

And it's true we won't spend the money, otherwise why would Jays players try and help AA and the organization before the season started to obtain a pitcher. That was telling then.

 

[mikebel111*]

So since AA apparently did so poorly mortgaging the future last time, you'd like him to do so again?

Yes so he can complain AA ruined the future again
Rinse and repeat

 

[theaub]

Yeah clearly the best move to make when you're in a playoff position is trading your two best players for prospects

Hell I wish the Hawks traded Kane and Toews for draft picks instead of re-signing them

We can still make a trade in August? But chances are these players won't be as good as pre august? Safe to say? For the most part.

And it's true we won't spend the money, otherwise why would Jays players try and help AA and the organization before the season started to obtain a pitcher. That was telling then.

There's still some useful pieces in August - think some bullpen arms will slip through.

 

[Z0S0]

No, you're rambling like a fool. You said that AA wasn't willing to mortgage the future in a deal. Just a year and a half ago, he was willing to trade 2 of our top 5 prospects for RA Dickey. So don't ******** me about the fact that he didn't want to "mortgage the future" or whatever you want to call trading young players for established help.

And how many of today's deals consisted of prospects for top players?

Everyone seemed to be trading young MLB roster players, and why would you want to break that up when they're playing so well and getting some top bats back from injury soon.

 

[Bravid Nonahan]

So since AA apparently did so poorly mortgaging the future last time, you'd like him to do so again?

No.

First of all, quit calling it "mortgaging the future". It is trading prospects for immediate help. Giving it a name with a negative connotation is showing your bias. And NO I don't want AA to make a ****** trade. I want him to make a GOOD trade. What, so since he made a bad deal involving prospects once, he can never deal prospects again? LMAO. It's called learning from your mistakes. If that good deal wasn't available, then fine, good for him for holding out.

 

[RayzorIsDull]

I wonder if Trout is voicing his displeasure to Angels management right now. Clearly it must have killed their morale too seeing the A's went after Lester and Dipoto was sitting there twiddling his thumbs.

They got Street, Grilli and Thatcher.

 

[Bravid Nonahan]

And how many of today's deals consisted of prospects for top players?

Everyone seemed to be trading young MLB roster players, and why would you want to break that up when they're playing so well and getting some top bats back from injury soon.

Hey you make a good point and that's what AA is saying on PTS now.

 

[Eyedea]

They got Street, Grilli and Thatcher.

And the A's got Samardzija, Lester, Hammel, Fuld and Gomes.

 

[Bravid Nonahan]

He did it one year. And since apparently those 2 prospects will be elite players according to you it seems. Let me guess we should have traded for a rental

Lol what are you even talking about? I never said anything about those prospects. I said that at ONE TIME, AA was willing to deal players that were considered to be top prospects at the time.

 

[Canada4Gold]

No.

First of all, quit calling it "mortgaging the future". It is trading prospects for immediate help. Giving it a name with a negative connotation is showing your bias. And NO I don't want AA to make a ****** trade. I want him to make a GOOD trade. What, so since he made a bad deal involving prospects once, he can never deal prospects again? LMAO. It's called learning from your mistakes. If that good deal wasn't available, then fine, good for him for holding out.

And there were no good trades out there so he didn't make one. Do you expect him to pull a good trade out of his ass?

Other teams aren't going to give their good players for nothing, there's got to be a give and take and obviously what AA thought was a good deal the other GM's didn't see that as a god deal for their team and vice versa.

So you options are either overpay(a la Dickey trade) or do nothing. And half the people here have complained about both those things now

edit: forgive me for not realying the last line in your post, I guess that makes this more added to your post and being directed at others now who are saying the same thing

 

[theaub]

http://gregorchisholm.mlblogs.com/2014/07/31/blue-jays-closer-janssen-speaks-out/#more-2118235

Obviously, we value our prospects, we value our players, I’m sure the other teams do as well. Maybe they just value the player or the opportunity to get into the playoffs more. It takes something to get something and congratulations to those teams that got those guys.

That's far more direct than what Jose said that's for sure