Post-Game Talk: Toronto barely loses to carolina

[Nineteen67]

Big picture I really liked our game last night. I know that sounds weird, but sometimes all we care about is the goal scorer and miss all the things that lead to the triumph. Last night, the result didn’t favour us but honestly with were so dominant at times, they’re lucky they survived. We made mistakes obviously, but Matthews is back to top form and our four lines can roll with authority.

Teams like Carolina and NJ are great opponents for the Leafs. For e.g., Nylander was able to win a lot of puck battles in the O zone by using his quickness and strength, but, will he be willing and able against Cernak, Hedman, Sergachev.
Same goes for Marner and Matthews.

 

[Hellcat]

Murray starting tonight according to The Score App.

The fix is in, they are trying to get Murray injured Murray said his ankle is OK as long as its heavily taped ... if that is true you don't play that guy two games in a row that are less than 24 hours apart with a NHL level back up in Woll or it it tough love , forcing Murray to play through the demons in his head?

 

[Nineteen67]

Murray starting tonight according to The Score App.

Glad I’m not driving up

 

[thusk]

I agree that he needed to stop that goal but it wasn't a bad one.
The shot drifted through at least 4 plates and there was a definite screen, moving screen, and possibly a tip on the original shot




https://www.nhl.com/maple leafs/video/aho-takes-the-lead/t-277350912/c-16194551

The moving player didn't had time to screen murray and it was a direct shot from slavin. An NHL goalie need to control it, if he can keep the puck with him he need to redirect it in the corner and not directly in the slot

 

[saltming]

IMO, this is the best season of any made for Disney+ Star Wars spinoff. Really enjoying the story and the cinematography.

100% agreed. The other ones are all meh

 

[saltming]

The moving player didn't had time to screen murray and it was a direct shot from slavin. An NHL goalie need to control it, if he can keep the puck with him he need to redirect it in the corner and not directly in the slot

I agree to an extent. All factors come into play. It's really easy to sit here watching on a screen and say things but reality is different.
In that split second Murray has to track the puck, keep an eye on all the players and expect deflection. All these factors will affect his positioning and save selection.
Aho being wide open is the questionable play here and that looks like a decent screen to me

 

[Hellcat]

I agree to an extent. All factors come into play. It's really easy to sit here watching on a screen and say things but reality is different.
In that split second Murray has to track the puck, keep an eye on all the players and expect deflection. All these factors will affect his positioning and save selection.
Aho being wide open is the questionable play here and that looks like a decent screen to me
View attachment 676329

Lets play a game it's like Where is Waldo but its called Where is Morgan's man? AKA where is Carolinas best goal scorer? AKA where was Morgan headed two seconds before that screen capture? AKA who is out of position on that play? Lilly and Morgan SHOULD NEVER play together, they have proven that does not work.

 

[saltming]

Lets play a game it's like Where is Waldo but its called Where is Morgan's man? AKA where is Carolinas best goal scorer? AKA where was Morgan headed two seconds before that screen capture? AKA who is out of position on that play? Lilly and Morgan SHOULD NEVER play together, they have proven that does not work.

I love the addition of McCabe and Schenn. When I look at them, if they are not covering a man, they are clearing the slot, not roaming around

 

[Clark4Ever]

We were the better team but Carolina got more timely saves from their goaltender.

Matthews continues to regain his form.

 

[thusk]

I agree to an extent. All factors come into play. It's really easy to sit here watching on a screen and say things but reality is different.
In that split second Murray has to track the puck, keep an eye on all the players and expect deflection. All these factors will affect his positioning and save selection.
Aho being wide open is the questionable play here and that looks like a decent screen to me
View attachment 676329

At this moment when he could be screen or get player in position to deflect a puck coming at his left puck was already on aho stick. It was a direct point shot without any risk of deflection.

But it just one play and at the end im more happy withnthis lost than with win vs ottawa or that kind of win.

A game playing that way, leafs would win it 19 of 20 time. Yesterday it was the 1 of 20 we lost... But still a great game for leafs close of playoff

 

[saltming]

Lets play a game it's like Where is Waldo but its called Where is Morgan's man? AKA where is Carolinas best goal scorer? AKA where was Morgan headed two seconds before that screen capture? AKA who is out of position on that play? Lilly and Morgan SHOULD NEVER play together, they have proven that

does not work.

Looked again. Rielly pointed to aho for Willie to pick up and he didn't. Still the wrong call from the defense Imo. Morgan was in front of aho, so he should have boxed him out instead of asking Willie to try to catch up to a speeding aho

 

[Shanwhatplan]

"Except for last years champs"

But their d corps were outstanding, and Kuemper only had to make the saves he was supposed to. Although his save % wasn’t spectacular (.902) his GAA was pretty solid (2.57).

 

[saltming]

At this moment when he could be screen or get player in position to deflect a puck coming at his left puck was already on aho stick. It was a direct point shot without any risk of deflection.

But it just one play and at the end im more happy withnthis lost than with win vs ottawa or that kind of win.

A game playing that way, leafs would win it 19 of 20 time. Yesterday it was the 1 of 20 we lost... But still a great game for leafs close of playoff

Great game! I agree with most what you're saying. It's a split second and I could screen shot the whole thing but I really don't want to hahaha
When the shot came Murray was partially screened.
The last screen shot I posted aho actually hadn't touched the puck but in a nano second he would have it in his stick.
I would have loved a big save there and tbh I think samsonov might have stopped it, but don't think it was a weak goal in any way. I feel the defensive breakdown that left aho wide open is the questionable thing. The second goal was also a breakdown by our defensive unit. Keeping the slot clear and closing passing lanes is the key function of defense

 

[Cotton]

There is no such thing as having a dominating team in hockey if this trait exists.

Going off on my own rant from this point, rest of the post isn't targeted towards you.

I mean, it's different year same shit. Our top guys are top tier in the whole league so they can mask all flaws when they have good games. Our top guys are being taken for granted at this point. You can surround them with any crap you want and we'll finish top 10 every single time. We just need Matthews and Marner alone to have peak level games to dominate an entire team. Mix in Nylander and Tavares and it's game over.

This always breaks down in the playoffs. Boggles my mind we didn't go all in with additions like Horvat or Jeannot. The headlines say we went "all in" yet all I see is a bunch of old guys and sideways players. Our management continuously fails to realize the gold mine they are sitting on and opt for these weird money puck moves all the time. O'Reilly falls in that category. We went for the 32 year old, "look how smart our cap specialists are" move instead of the younger Horvat who has found a new gear in the scoring department. Acciari is already in preservation mode, rationing when he can be a bottom 6 warrior and when he needs to re-charge. If we were choosing the old man route then Patrick Kane was the no.1 choice. At least bring in the no.1 choice for the route you're taking. We needed a top 4 and they went the usual cute route getting McCabe and Lafferty instead. Our playoff opponents easily wash out these type of additions even though these additions keep us competitive on the NHL scope.

We needed to surround the core with full time warriors like how Tampa does every single year, even when they have zero draft picks. We've known this for 4+ years now and still never do it. Maybe 2024 is when we finally get our Coleman, Goodrow, Jeannot etc. depth warriors, or still-in-their-prime impact player like Horvat or Lindholm.

Your rant makes no sense, first, Tanner Jeannot has been such an addition that Lightening fans have done nothing but complain about him. They are on a 4 game losing streak and he got all of 6 minutes of ice time yesterday. And Bo Horvat's new scoring prowess has translated to 5 goals in the 22 games he's played since being traded. As an Islander, he's pacing for something like 38 points in a full season.

We have yet to see the payoff from ROR, who is known to perform in the post season. And we are a far more difficult team to play against with Accari, Lafferty and McCabe than Engvall, Anderson and Sandin.

Our biggest issues have been inconsistent goaltending and the play of Rielly, and to a lesser extent, Liljegren.

And in reference to you bringing up age, Gary Roberts was 35 when he was p/pg for us through 19 games in 01-02, and just absolutely bossing the opposition.

 

[thusk]

Great game! I agree with most what you're saying. It's a split second and I could screen shot the whole thing but I really don't want to hahaha
When the shot came Murray was partially screened.
The last screen shot I posted aho actually hadn't touched the puck but in a nano second he would have it in his stick.
I would have loved a big save there and tbh I think samsonov might have stopped it, but don't think it was a weak goal in any way. I feel the defensive breakdown that left aho wide open is the questionable thing. The second goal was also a breakdown by our defensive unit. Keeping the slot clear and closing passing lanes is the key function of defense

When you stop the video when shot had been taken, Murray was able to perfectly seeing the puck. He saw the puck left slavin stick. It was not necessairly a weak goal but kind of goal your goalie need to make especially in a key moment.

Its not only about murray or even rielly who had been agressive on aho to prevent pass on the slot and get caught with aho behind him on rebound.

Just kind of play everything goes on wrong side

 

[Al14]

Keefe really needs to play a more defensive lineup after getting that tied goal. Having JT out there is a joke. Really wish ROR was playing and we are probably be in OT.

They were gifted that tying goal and chose to reject it. Bad defense after tying it, and poor rebound control on that 4th goal and there goes at least a loser point.

They had all but a few minutes to secure a single point at least, and they threw it all away on bad coaching, bad defense, and poor goal tending!

They seem ready to lose again in the 1st round!!!

 

[Hellcat]

I love the addition of McCabe and Schenn. When I look at them, if they are not covering a man, they are clearing the slot, not roaming around

Yep, agree 100%.

I'm gonna go on a Morgan rant as Morgan's game has been on my mind lately.

Players get paid to score, lets face it a guy who suppresses 50 goals a year does not get paid like a guy who scores 50 goals a year but they both have the same effect on the game. This is why I don't get why Morgan is playing so poorly. Morgan has no pressure to perform for his next contract. Morgan has signed his retirement contract, there is no reason why he should feel obligated to take risks to drive offence. No matter how shitty he plays, he will never lose his current contract. He's still considered our #1 Dman, that alone means he will get his ATOI, often it will be with our best forwards, high ATOI with the likes of Marner, Matthews, Tavares, Nylander that alone by default means he should get points for just being on the ice. He's still our #1 dman, he's going to get his looks on the PP. The points will come, there is no reason for him to cheat or force plays to drive offence like he has been doing since he came back. Often those cheats end up in a turnover and the puck in our net.

I had some great advice, when I was playing like shit, my coach told me to clear my mind, play one shift at a time and take my game down to a simple 45 seconds at at time, don't try to be a hero, stay in front of the puck and count the number of opponents in a 25 foot range of you, if you know where those 2 or 3 are, you know what ice you have avail to you. Many years later I asked him about the counting thing, he told me the counting was just a mental distraction, he was Jedi mind f-ing with me. In reality he was trying to get me away from overthinking the game and have my mind busy on thinking about my options (positive) vs thinking about the stupid shit I could do to lose the puck (negative). I think Rielly needs to simplify his game, concentrate on the game without the puck, playing defence for a guy with Riellys edges/skating skills should be pretty easy.

If he wants to be a hero, he needs to find his shutdown defender game, Leaf fans will appreciate that more than an end to end goal. If there is one thing that will make you a folk hero in Toronto, is be a blue collar, heart and soul, get bloody player. Salming, Gilmour, Clark, Sandin they are revered not just because they were highly skilled, they fought for their ice.

 

[Al14]

Rielly is really pissing me off. That's our supposed #1 D-man?

First off, he is far off being a #1 d-man. IMHO, he is a 3-4 d-man at best. However, he is paid like a #2.

 

[Puckstuff]

There is no reason to sit Schenn the rest of the way, he missed time before we acquired him due to injury and then trade related reasons. Then he's either been rotated or had the kid coming, going forward, we want him in.

Jarnkrok-Matthews-88
Bunting-JT-Marner
Knies-ROR-Laff
ZAR/Kerfoot-Kampf-Cookie

McCabe-Brodie
Rielly-Schenn
Gio-Holl/Liljegren

Sammy

Alternatively

JT-ROR-Marner
Bunting-Matthews-88
Knies-Acciari-Jarnkrok
ZAR/Kerfoot-Kampf-Laff

I just worry about that second forward group lacking offense in the bottom 6.

Obviously if Knies looks bad or something in the 2-3 games, you have him as a black ace.

Knies-Matthews-Jarnkrok
Bunting-J.T-Marner
Kerfoot-O’Reilly-Nylander
Acciari-Kampf-Lafferty

 

[Hellcat]

Great game! I agree with most what you're saying. It's a split second and I could screen shot the whole thing but I really don't want to hahaha
When the shot came Murray was partially screened.
The last screen shot I posted aho actually hadn't touched the puck but in a nano second he would have it in his stick.
I would have loved a big save there and tbh I think samsonov might have stopped it, but don't think it was a weak goal in any way. I feel the defensive breakdown that left aho wide open is the questionable thing. The second goal was also a breakdown by our defensive unit. Keeping the slot clear and closing passing lanes is the key function of defense

Yep the way Murray improves his GA, is our defensive coverage in our own end improves. We gave two easy looks to two very talented players and that became two easy goals.

 

[saltming]

When you stop the video when shot had been taken, Murray was able to perfectly seeing the puck. He saw the puck left slavin stick. It was not necessairly a weak goal but kind of goal your goalie need to make especially in a key moment.

Its not only about murray or even rielly who had been agressive on aho to prevent pass on the slot and get caught with aho behind him on rebound.

Just kind of play everything goes on wrong side

This is the perfect definition of a partial screen with the potential deflection.
On the entry Morgan deflects ahos shot, great. Then goes into the corner to try to collect the puck, great. Then comes back and instead of stopping and protecting the left side of the net he chooses to ask the winger to pick up aho so he could go challenge the shot coming from the point on the other side of the ice from him.
JT was down low clearing the crease and lili was at the dot as he chased his man wide.
It was a clear defensive breakdown and a bad choice by Morgan. Nothing to crucify him as others do because it happens to every player all the time

 

[Gilmour1996]

The fix is in, they are trying to get Murray injured Murray said his ankle is OK as long as its heavily taped ... if that is true you don't play that guy two games in a row that are less than 24 hours apart with a NHL level back up in Woll or it it tough love , forcing Murray to play through the demons in his head?

Leafs sure taking a stupid risk not giving Woll more time. What if one of our beaten-up goalies goes down and Woll is forced into a playoff game with little experience? Or they lose Woll on waivers down the road without knowing his potential and he goes on to win the Vezina. Dumb asset management.

 

[Hellcat]

We were the better team but Carolina got more timely saves from their goaltender.

Matthews continues to regain his form.

I agree we were the better team, we outplayed the Canes for the last 50 minutes but we also made more mistakes in the last 50 minutes too... we clean up those breakdowns and we are a legit contender not just a good team with some high end skill..

Leafs sure taking a stupid risk not giving Woll more time. What if one of our beaten-up goalies goes down and Woll is forced into a playoff game with little experience? Or they lose Woll on waivers down the road without knowing his potential and he goes on to win the Vezina. Dumb asset management.

I remember a guy named Potvin that came out of no where and kinda did OK in '93 for the Leafs., give Woll a chance I don't think this is an inditement against Woll as much as they are trying accomplish something with Murray.

 

[saltming]

Yep, agree 100%.

I'm gonna go on a Morgan rant as Morgan's game has been on my mind lately.

Players get paid to score, lets face it a guy who suppresses 50 goals a year does not get paid like a guy who scores 50 goals a year but they both have the same effect on the game. This is why I don't get why Morgan is playing so poorly. Morgan has no pressure to perform for his next contract. Morgan has signed his retirement contract, there is no reason why he should feel obligated to take risks to drive offence. No matter how shitty he plays, he will never lose his current contract. He's still considered our #1 Dman, that alone means he will get his ATOI, often it will be with our best forwards, high ATOI with the likes of Marner, Matthews, Tavares, Nylander that alone by default means he should get points for just being on the ice. He's still our #1 dman, he's going to get his looks on the PP. The points will come, there is no reason for him to cheat or force plays to drive offence like he has been doing since he came back. Often those cheats end up in a turnover and the puck in our net.

I had some great advice, when I was playing like shit, my coach told me to clear my mind, play one shift at a time and take my game down to a simple 45 seconds at at time, don't try to be a hero, stay in front of the puck and count the number of opponents in a 25 foot range of you, if you know where those 2 or 3 are, you know what ice you have avail to you. Many years later I asked him about the counting thing, he told me the counting was just a mental distraction, he was Jedi mind f-ing with me. In reality he was trying to get me away from overthinking the game and have my mind busy on thinking about my options (positive) vs thinking about the stupid shit I could do to lose the puck (negative). I think Rielly needs to simplify his game, concentrate on the game without the puck, playing defence for a guy with Riellys edges/skating skills should be pretty easy.

If he wants to be a hero, he needs to find his shutdown defender game, Leaf fans will appreciate that more than an end to end goal. If there is one thing that will make you a folk hero in Toronto, is be a blue collar, heart and soul, get bloody player. Salming, Gilmour, Clark, Sandin they are revered not just because they were highly skilled, they fought for their ice.

My only counter to this is that just because his contract is secure doesn't mean he's not pressuring himself to be a difference maker. Pride can be a double edged sword. The fact that his contract is new gives me hope that he will settle down as you said because he has the tools to be a good shutdown defender.

The only thing that disappoints me from your post is that you left stumpy Thomas out, but the inclusion of my avatar was a saving grace

 

[Petrus]

They were gifted that tying goal and chose to reject it. Bad defense after tying it, and poor rebound control on that 4th goal and there goes at least a loser point.

They had all but a few minutes to secure a single point at least, and they threw it all away on bad coaching, bad defense, and poor goal tending!

They seem ready to lose again in the 1st round!!!

I am debating in my head if Keefe should have brought out a defensive unit following the tying goal.

Those subsequent 30 seconds (following the tying goal) cost Toronto the game:

A) Liljegren could not clear. Seems to fumble the puck once again. Allowing the Canes to gain the blue line.

B) Rielly was directing the forwards to defend while he himself was standing in no man’s land.

C) Murray giving up a big rebound.

D) Wide open Aho walking in uncontested.