Top 50 NHL Prospects: Oilers, Sabres, and Leafs each place duo in Fall Top 10

[Gabriel426]

I am sorry but how come McDavid, Eichel, Bennett, Larkin, and Ehlers are consider to still be prospects but Domi is not? Considering all of them are rookies playing regularly in the NHL this season. To me, if you are playing regularly in the NHL, you can't be consider a prospect.

My list would also include someone like Matthews.

 

[Nithoniniel]

I am sorry but how come McDavid, Eichel, Bennett, Larkin, and Ehlers are consider to still be prospects but Domi is not? Considering all of them are rookies playing regularly in the NHL this season. To me, if you are playing regularly in the NHL, you can't be consider a prospect.

Are you sure Domi isn't? He hasn't played more than several on this list.

Edit: He is at #14 on the list.

 

[Gabriel426]

Are you sure Domi isn't? He hasn't played more than several on this list.

He is at #14 on the list.

Sorry, I only read the top 10, plus he is better than Reinheart and Bennett. But anyhow, prospects list should be players who have not play regularly in the NHL.

 

[Leaf Lander]

I can't load the list can someone p it to me thanks

 

[shelf]

Exactly. Prospect rankings are supposed to be about who will be the best NHL player. There's no possible reason to suggest Larkin and Ehlers are going to be better than Marner.

Sure they've made the NHL, but they're a year older than Marner. Marner's draft year put both of them to shame and it was one of the best draft years in recent memory.

This also applies to Strome. Both of them should rank in the top 5. Their draft seasons are practically unheard off and are usually #1 overall caliber years.

Under 19 year old season in the NCAA since 2000

Eichel- 1.78
Schwartz- 1.57
Parise- 1.56
Heatley- 1.47
Cammalleri- 1.45
Jessiman- 1.38
Vanek- 1.38
Toews- 1.35
Larkin- 1.34
Kessel- 1.31

Thats some solid company. I realize you could could post a list probably better for Marner but to suggest that "there is no possible reason" to put larkin ahead of Marner is absurd.

 

[BigWilly]

1. Connor McDavid, C, Edmonton Oilers
2. Jack Eichel, C, Buffalo Sabres
3. Sam Bennett, C, Calgary Flames
4. Sam Reinhart, C, Buffalo Sabres
5. Dylan Larkin, C, Detroit Red Wings
6. Nikolaj Ehlers, LW, Winnipeg Jets
7. Mitch Marner, C, Toronto Maple Leafs
8. William Nylander, C, Toronto Maple Leafs
9. Dylan Strome, C, Arizona Coyotes
10. Leon Draisaitl, C, Edmonton Oilers

My Opinion
1. Connor McDavid, C, Edmonton Oilers
2. Jack Eichel, C, Buffalo Sabres
3. Dylan Larkin, C, Detroit Red Wings
4. Mitch Marner, C, Toronto Maple Leafs
5. Sam Bennett, C, Calgary Flames
6. Nikolaj Ehlers, LW, Winnipeg Jets
7. Dylan Strome, C, Arizona Coyotes
8. William Nylander, C, Toronto Maple Leafs
9. Sam Reinhart, C, Buffalo Sabres
10. Leon Draisaitl, C, Edmonton Oilers


Marner and Strome too low, Reinhart too high.. I think Larkin is gonna be Toews level good

 

[TheProspector]

Under 19 year old season in the NCAA since 2000

Eichel- 1.78
Schwartz- 1.57
Parise- 1.56
Heatley- 1.47
Cammalleri- 1.45
Jessiman- 1.38
Vanek- 1.38
Toews- 1.35
Larkin- 1.34
Kessel- 1.31

Thats some solid company. I realize you could could post a list probably better for Marner but to suggest that "there is no possible reason" to put larkin ahead of Marner is absurd.

U-18s in the OHL between 1.69 and 2.3 ppg (1stdev):

• Bryan Little - 229% of that year's league average
• Dylan Strome - 239%
• Steven Stamkos - 240%
• Kyle Wellwood - 243%
• David Legwand - 251%
  [*]Mitchell Marner - 252%
  
• Taylor Hall - 263%
• John Tavares - 279%
• Sam Gagner - 294%
• Jason Spezza - 294%

Average best season for his comparables is 72 points.

Dylan Larkin does look damn good, though. There's just a lot more sample size to use in the OHL. But they both could be 70-80 point guys regularly.

 

[Mats13]

Under 19 year old season in the NCAA since 2000

Eichel- 1.78
Schwartz- 1.57
Parise- 1.56
Heatley- 1.47
Cammalleri- 1.45
Jessiman- 1.38
Vanek- 1.38
Toews- 1.35
Larkin- 1.34
Kessel- 1.31

Thats some solid company. I realize you could could post a list probably better for Marner but to suggest that "there is no possible reason" to put larkin ahead of Marner is absurd.

That's Larkin's draft+1 year, all of that elite company you listed with him did it in their draft years. There is a very big difference.

What I was saying was that Marner's draft year blew Larkin's and Ehlers draft years out of the water. How can you penalize Marner for being a year younger? Because up to this point in their careers, Marner puts both of them to shame (maybe an exaggeration but whatever).

I'm not saying Larkin or Ehlers is bad, I'm just saying they shouldn't be ahead of Marner.

 

[Raymoondo]

When was this list made? Why is Domi so low on the list?

 

[shelf]

That's Larkin's draft+1 year, all of that elite company you listed with him did it in their draft years. There is a very big difference.

What I was saying was that Marner's draft year blew Larkin's and Ehlers draft years out of the water. How can you penalize Marner for being a year younger? Because up to this point in their careers, Marner puts both of them to shame (maybe an exaggeration but whatever).

I'm not saying Larkin or Ehlers is bad, I'm just saying they shouldn't be ahead of Marner.

Wrong. In order to play college in your draft year you either have to skip a grade or have a late birthday. Most of those guys werent actually drafted in their draft year.

Eichel- Late birthday
Schwartz- +1
Parise- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Heatley- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Cammalleri- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Jessiman- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Vanek- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Toews- +1
Larkin- +1
Kessel- Late birthday


Yes Marners draft year was most definitely better than Ehlers/Larkin but you cant just ignore their most recent seasons. Its not a coincidence that Ehlers/Larkin are having success in the NHL this year. I really dont think it matters and really just comes down to opinion where these guys should be ranked. All are fantastic prospects.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Sorry, I only read the top 10, plus he is better than Reinheart and Bennett. But anyhow, prospects list should be players who have not play regularly in the NHL.

it's a top prospects list heading into the season, before the season none of these guys were regular NHLers, so they're all fair game for the list. Next list McDavid, Eichel, Domi, Reinhart, Bennett, Ehlers, etc, etc will not be on the list.

 

[Nithoniniel]

When was this list made? Why is Domi so low on the list?

Before this season started I'd have said it was a fine position, perhaps even a tad generous. Didn't like Domi as a prospect, thought that CHL-Domi was a significantly less impressive player than WJC-Domi, with larger sample size and more importance.

In many ways, Domi has looked better as an NHL player than a CHL player. I honestly don't know what to think of him right now.

 

[Mats13]

Wrong. In order to play college in your draft year you either have to skip a grade or have a late birthday. Most of those guys werent actually drafted in their draft year.

Eichel- Late birthday
Schwartz- +1
Parise- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Heatley- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Cammalleri- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Jessiman- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Vanek- Passed over in first year eligible for draft
Toews- +1
Larkin- +1
Kessel- Late birthday

Actually I am right. And what are you talking about? None of those 5 players were passed over in their draft years... I don't know if you're being serious or not.

Eichel - Larkin isn't even comparable.

Schwartz - he did it in his draft+1 year, he's a good player, but not elite.

Parise - Did you really think he got passed over in his draft year . Anyway, he scored well over PPG in 02-03 and was in the 03 draft.

Heatley - Again did you really think the #2 overall pick was passed over in his draft? He was well over PPG in 99-00 and was #2 overall in his 00 draft.

Cammalleri - Again not passed over in his draft year, but wasn't PPG that year either.

Jessiman - Again not passed over, but he was over PPG in his draft year.

Vanek - Also not passed over, he went 5th overall in his draft for crying out loud. Anyway, he was well over PPG in his draft year.

Toews - He was basically PPG in his draft year, like 2 points short.

Kessel - Did it in his draft year.

So based on your list, with proper facts, the most comparable players to Larkin are Schwartz and Cammalleri. Did you really help his argument?

 

[tmlms13]

I think another problem with the leafs is that there is nobody between 9th and 50th

 

[shelf]

Actually I am right. And what are you talking about? None of those 5 players were passed over in their draft years... I don't know if you're being serious or not.

Eichel - Larkin isn't even comparable.

Schwartz - he did it in his draft+1 year, he's a good player, but not elite.

Parise - Did you really think he got passed over in his draft year . Anyway, he scored well over PPG in 02-03 and was in the 03 draft.

Heatley - Again did you really think the #2 overall pick was passed over in his draft? He was well over PPG in 99-00 and was #2 overall in his 00 draft.


Cammalleri - Again not passed over in his draft year, but wasn't PPG that year either.

Jessiman - Again not passed over, but he was over PPG in his draft year.

Vanek - Also not passed over, he went 5th overall in his draft for crying out loud. Anyway, he was well over PPG in his draft year.

Toews - He was basically PPG in his draft year, like 2 points short.

Kessel - Did it in his draft year.

So based on your list, with proper facts, the most comparable players to Larkin are Schwartz and Cammalleri. Did you really help his argument?

Yes these guys were passed over in their first year eligible for the draft.

Parise was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.
Heatley was eligible to be drafted in 1999 but was not drafted.
Cammalleri was eligible to be drafted in 2000 but was not drafted.
Jessiman was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.
Vanek was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.

"any player who will be age 18 on or before September 15 in the year in which such Entry Draft is held"

Larkin is only 3 months older than Eichel.
Larkin was only 2 months older last year than Kessel was in his draft year.
Larkin outproduced Toews in his draft year +1 even though it was Larkins rookie season vs Toews 2nd season.


Edit:
I think I may be wrong. Pre-lockout these guys may not have been eligible as 18 year olds. But the point remains the same, these guys were the same age or older than Larkin was.

 

[QuietContrarian]

Alot of untrue subjective statements going on in here.... Geeez

 

[ULF_55]

I think another problem with the leafs is that there is nobody between 9th and 50th

That was my thought.

Two top 10 players, then nothing? Oilers 3 in top 20, and then look at their other under 24's.

Maybe next year one or two of the Leafs' reaches will make the list?

It would be nice if it was a list and not a PP.

 

[Mats13]

Yes these guys were passed over in their first year eligible for the draft.

Parise was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.
Heatley was eligible to be drafted in 1999 but was not drafted.
Cammalleri was eligible to be drafted in 2000 but was not drafted.
Jessiman was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.
Vanek was eligible to be drafted in 2002 but was not drafted.

"any player who will be age 18 on or before September 15 in the year in which such Entry Draft is held"

Larkin is only 3 months older than Eichel.
Larkin was only 2 months older last year than Kessel was in his draft year.
Larkin outproduced Toews in his draft year +1 even though it was Larkins rookie season vs Toews 2nd season.


Edit:
I think I may be wrong. Pre-lockout these guys may not have been eligible as 18 year olds. But the point remains the same, these guys were the same age or older than Larkin was.

Again, you're wrong. None of them were passed over. That is false, there's no debating that.

Also, here's what you're forgetting. Larkin had one more year of development. He may have been close to the same age as a couple of them, but he had one full year of development more than them.

Most of those players (all the elite ones) did it in one less year of development. I don't know how many more ways I can explain this.

 

[shelf]

Age as of Oct. 1st during the season where they put up these PPG.


Eichel- 1.78, 17 years, 11 months, 2 days.
Schwartz- 1.57, 18 years, 3 months, 6 days
Parise- 1.56, 18 years, 2 months, 3 days
Heatley- 1.47, 18 years, 8 months, 10 days
Cammalleri- 1.45, 18 years, 3 months, 23 days
Jessiman- 1.38, 18 years, 6 months, 3 days
Vanek- 1.38, 18 years, 8 months, 12 days
Toews- 1.35, 18 years, 5 months, 2 days
Larkin- 1.34, 18 years, 2 months, 1 days
Kessel- 1.31, 17 years, 11 months, 29 days

Seriously you only had to take a second to look at their birthdays.

Larkin did not have an extra year of development on any of these guys, and the only guys that were younger than him were Kessel and Eichel and they were only a couple of months younger.

 

[ULF_55]

Again, you're wrong. None of them were passed over. That is false, there's no debating that.

Also, here's what you're forgetting. Larkin had one more year of development. He may have been close to the same age as a couple of them, but he had one full year of development more than them.

Most of those players (all the elite ones) did it in one less year of development. I don't know how many more ways I can explain this.

Thomas Vanek

Right Wing -- shoots R
Born Jan 19 1984 -- Vienna, Austria
[31 yrs. ago]
Height 6.02 -- Weight 218 [188 cm/99 kg]
Drafted by Buffalo Sabres
- round 1 #5 overall 2003 NHL Entry Draft

Vanek would have been 18 in 2002 correct?

 

[Mats13]

Thomas Vanek

Right Wing -- shoots R
Born Jan 19 1984 -- Vienna, Austria
[31 yrs. ago]
Height 6.02 -- Weight 218 [188 cm/99 kg]
Drafted by Buffalo Sabres
- round 1 #5 overall 2003 NHL Entry Draft

Vanek would have been 18 in 2002 correct?

He wasn't eligible for the 2002 draft. I'm not too sure what the rules were like back then, but it's pretty obvious just looking at his stat line in 2001-02. That player does not get passed over.

 

[Mats13]

Age as of Oct. 1st during the season where they put up these PPG.


Eichel- 1.78, 17 years, 11 months, 2 days.
Schwartz- 1.57, 18 years, 3 months, 6 days
Parise- 1.56, 18 years, 2 months, 3 days
Heatley- 1.47, 18 years, 8 months, 10 days
Cammalleri- 1.45, 18 years, 3 months, 23 days
Jessiman- 1.38, 18 years, 6 months, 3 days
Vanek- 1.38, 18 years, 8 months, 12 days
Toews- 1.35, 18 years, 5 months, 2 days
Larkin- 1.34, 18 years, 2 months, 1 days
Kessel- 1.31, 17 years, 11 months, 29 days

Seriously you only had to take a second to look at their birthdays.

Larkin did not have an extra year of development on any of these guys, and the only guys that were younger than him were Kessel and Eichel and they were only a couple of months younger.

He did have an extra year of development though. He did it in his draft+1 year, the others did it in their draft year. I'm not talking about age here, I'm taking about development years.

 

[shelf]

He did have an extra year of development though. He did it in his draft+1 year, the others did it in their draft year. I'm not talking about age here, I'm taking about development years.

So players dont develop if they arent drafted? Larkin was younger than Vanek therefore had less time in life to develop his hockey skills. Does a guy like Tyler Johnson have 0 years of development because he was never drafted?

 

[MJ65]

Both Nylander and Marner are top end prospects and Kasperi should be ranked at top 20 but we still need some top end talent to be competitive in this new era

 

[ULF_55]

He wasn't eligible for the 2002 draft. I'm not too sure what the rules were like back then, but it's pretty obvious just looking at his stat line in 2001-02. That player does not get passed over.

He turned 18 in January, the draft is in June, 18's have been draft eligible for decades.

http://proicehockey.about.com/od/prospects/a/How-The-Nhl-Draft-Works.htm

NCAA Players - As of 2004, 18-year-old players from NCAA Division I schools can be drafted and retain their college eligibility as long as they don't play for a pro team or hire an agent. In previous years, an 18-year-old who opted into the draft lost his NCAA eligibility.

Vanek was eligible, but would have opted out to retain his NCAA eligibility.