Top 5 Positionally

[YNWA14]

This is something that I figure could be interesting to list given all the debate about it constantly.

Please keep it friendly, and remember that even if someone aggressively presents their opinion as fact, it is still very much an opinion. I'm sure everyone appreciates different parts of the game and weights different aspects of the game differently so while discussion is encouraged I think it can be done in a respectful manner.

Top 5 Forwards
Lionel Messi
Cristiano Ronaldo
Neymar
Arjen Robben (healthy)
Luis Suarez

Top 5 Midfielders
Luca Modric
Thiago Alcantara
N'Golo Kante
Toni Kroos
Marco Verratti

Top 5 Defenders
Thiago Silva
Mats Hummels
Leonardo Bonucci
Javi Martinez
Marcelo

Top 5 Keepers
Manuel Neuer
David de Gea
Thibaut Courtois
Gianluigi Buffon
Jan Oblak

Feel free to of course separate those into further categories. I'm just looking at overall impact because I know different positions within each category demands different things.

Cheers.

Click to read more...

 

[Savant]

I don't think you can look at it holistically. You can't compare strikers to wingers. Fullbacks to centerbacks. Attacking midfield to defensive midfielders etc.

Glad to know I have two of the top 5 defenders though.

 

[Evilo]

A few things on your lists :
Robben isn't top 5 anymore.
Busquets isn't on your top MF list. Second best, so you must have forgotten him. Thiago isn't there yet. Rest is debatable. I rate Kroos lower than 5th for instance.
Javi Martinez has no business in any top 5 category.
Lloris is top 5 in nets.
You also mix FB and CB, and those are really different positions.

But all of this is subject to change after a few months, depending on form, etc...

 

[YNWA14]

I heavily weighted current season, and talent, as well as accomplishments. Fullbacks are defenders, and personally I don't rate many fullbacks that highly which is why only Marcelo made the list. I don't rate Busquets as high as some do which is why he's not in my top 5 (especially this season), and I do believe Robben is absolutely a top 5 forward when he's healthy (though if I had to replace him in the top 5 due to health it would be Hazard probably) -- Thiago is definitely there based on talent and this season's performances for me.

Also I grouped wingers/attacking midfielders with strikers because a lot of wingers these days really are just wide forwards, and I'm still looking at the overall group that make it their priority to affect the game in the final third. Like I said I rated the players based on their overall impact on the game and how I felt they contributed to their position. But like I said feel free to separate those into more specialized categories if you want to.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Gotta be more specific categorically. While it is true that many wingers are wide-forwards, I think you can differentiate on a case by case basis. Ronaldo is undoubtedly a forward, but I wouldn't classify Hazard as one. Midfielders is similarly broad, you can't compare a guy like N'golo Kante to Luka Modric, they have incredibly different roles. I'll edit this post later with my positions and lists.

 

[YNWA14]

Sure you can compare them. Just because their role isn't the same doesn't mean you can't compare their relative impact.

Hazard while not being necessarily goal scoring certainly prioritizes in creating goals and focuses on facilitating that. Modric and Kante have different styles but similar goals in midfield.

That's why I looked at how they impact the team overall rather than just how they contribute to a specific aspect of their position. You can have a ton of specialized categories otherwise.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

How are the likes of Busquets, pique and Dybala not in the top 5?

 

[Vasilevskiy]

How are the likes of Busquets, pique and Dybala not in the top 5?

Don't think Dybala is quite there yet mate, I'm shocked that Griezmann wasn't mentioned and instead Robben was.

I like Javi Martinez but to me he also has no business in the top 5 over the likes of Chiellini, Pique, Godin, Boateng...

Thiago is not a top-5 midfielder for me either.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Don't think Dybala is quite there yet mate, I'm shocked that Griezmann wasn't mentioned and instead Robben was.

I like Javi Martinez but to me he also has no business in the top 5 over the likes of Chiellini, Pique, Godin, Boateng...

Thiago is not a top-5 midfielder for me either.

It'd be hard not to put Thiago among the top 5 midfielders after the season he just had.

 

[Havre]

Don't think Dybala is quite there yet mate, I'm shocked that Griezmann wasn't mentioned and instead Robben was.

I like Javi Martinez but to me he also has no business in the top 5 over the likes of Chiellini, Pique, Godin, Boateng...

Thiago is not a top-5 midfielder for me either.

Agree on Dybala and Martinez.

Lloris not being top 5 for goalies is wrong in my opinion. I guess neutral supports don't watch Spurs that often and with his tendency to make some big blunders you just forget (or don't know) how good he is 99.9% of the time. Even many Utd-fans (in England) would say Lloris was better than DDG last year (obviously partly because DDG didn't have his best year). And if you want to expand the defenders list I'm not sure how Alderweireld didn't make it.

Healthy Robben is better than Griezmann in my opinion. Healthy Robben is better than Neymar. But then you might ask who is this "healthy Robben" these days. Close call for me, but I don't find it the least shocking that Robben is in a top 5 list for many.

 

[Luigi Habs]

This is something that I figure could be interesting to list given all the debate about it constantly.

Please keep it friendly, and remember that even if someone aggressively presents their opinion as fact, it is still very much an opinion. I'm sure everyone appreciates different parts of the game and weights different aspects of the game differently so while discussion is encouraged I think it can be done in a respectful manner.

Top 5 Forwards
Lionel Messi
Cristiano Ronaldo
Neymar
Arjen Robben (healthy)
Luis Suarez

Top 5 Midfielders
Luca Modric
Thiago Alcantara
N'Golo Kante
Toni Kroos
Marco Verratti

Top 5 Defenders
Thiago Silva
Mats Hummels
Leonardo Bonucci
Javi Martinez
Marcelo

Top 5 Keepers
Manuel Neuer
David de Gea
Thibaut Courtois
Gianluigi Buffon
Jan Oblak

Feel free to of course separate those into further categories. I'm just looking at overall impact because I know different positions within each category demands different things.

Cheers.

I'll put them in those categories:

Strikers
1- Messi
2- Ronaldo
3- Suarez
4- Lewandowski
5- Cavani

Wingers/attacking mids
1- Neymar
2- Hazard
3- Griezmann
4- Alexis
5- Bale

You could have Messi as 1st in this category as well which kicks out Bale, and add one of Dybala or Benzema in the top 5 strikers.

Midfielders (mainly b2b/8s)
1- Modric
2- Kante
3- Kroos
4- Verratti
5- Undecided between Vidal/Pogba/Thiago

Defensive midfielders (6)
1- Busquets
2- Weigl
3- Matic

Don't see whole lot of outstanding DMs there other than these 3 tbh.

Full backs
1- Marcelo
2- Dani Alves
3- Alaba
4- Carvajal
5- Alex Sandro

Center backs
1- Thiago Silva
2- Hummels
3- Bonucci
4- Ramos
5- Boateng or Godin

Goalkeepers
1- Neuer
2- De Gea
3- Buffon
4- Courtois
5- Lloris

 

[Theon]

I really, really don't think Buffon's up there with the best anymore.

 

[Peen]

I really, really don't think Buffon's up there with the best anymore.

Courtois is much better

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

Boateng is better than Ramos and Courtois is undoubtedly better than Buffon.

 

[Theon]

Courtois is much better

Agreed.

For me it's Neuer, DDG, Courtois, Lloris and Handanovic/Oblak.

 

[Luigi Habs]

There were talks before the CL final that if Juve wins it, Buffon would be the favorite to win the Ballon D'Or. He crapped the bed in the final and he's no longer top 5 now?

Anyway, I don't expect him to be in the top 5 discussion by next season, but today definitely he is.

 

[Wee Baby Seamus]

There were talks before the CL final that if Juve wins it, Buffon would be the favorite to win the Ballon D'Or. He crapped the bed in the final and he's no longer top 5 now?

Anyway, I don't expect him to be in the top 5 discussion by next season, but today definitely he is.

That talk was because the media loves a story and 40 year old Buffon winning a UCL was that story. He, Lloris, and Oblak all have a solid claim on that #4 spot. Neuer, De Gea, and Courtois are an undisputable top 3.

 

[Luigi Habs]

Fair enough. For me Neuer and De Gea are undisputable top 2. Courtois does have an argument being number 3, but let's not forget he had a poor season last year. He needs to be a bit more consistent to consider him undisputed top 3 as far as I'm concerned.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

Don't think Dybala is quite there yet mate, I'm shocked that Griezmann wasn't mentioned and instead Robben was.

I like Javi Martinez but to me he also has no business in the top 5 over the likes of Chiellini, Pique, Godin, Boateng...

Thiago is not a top-5 midfielder for me either.

He's certainly better than Robben today. Agreed on Greizz.

 

[YNWA14]

You obviously don't watch Robben. Even in between injury he easily outproduced him. Robben is still a top 5 talent he just has a hard time staying on the pitch. Just watch that Bayern team in the CL with and without Robben.

 

[Duchene2MacKinnon]

RObben has been around for years but yes, I've never seen him play.

They play different positions one that plays further up the pitch will more likely get their stats padded.

Dybala dragged Juve to the final... what did Robben do this year?

 

[KJS14]

That talk was because the media loves a story and 40 year old Buffon winning a UCL was that story. He, Lloris, and Oblak all have a solid claim on that #4 spot. Neuer, De Gea, and Courtois are an undisputable top 3.

I personally think Oblak and Courtois are debatable for #3. I can't claim to watch Oblak too much outside of the CL, but from what I've seen he's definitely closer to Neuer/de Gea/Courtois than he is to Buffon/Lloris.

 

[Suiteness]

Midfielders need to be split here. Any notion of having Kanté (whose main attributes are running and tackling) in the same sentence as Modric is so ridiculously outrageous that it should not even be up for debate.

 

[YNWA14]

RObben has been around for years but yes, I've never seen him play.

They play different positions one that plays further up the pitch will more likely get their stats padded.

Dybala dragged Juve to the final... what did Robben do this year?

I didn't say you've never seen him play, but saying that Dybala is better than Robben is stretching things. He's not on a healthy Robben's level -- not that it's a shot at him, very few players are. Dybala didn't carry Juve to the final come on now; Robben doesn't play further up the pitch than Dybala either. If you want to talk about this season look at their relative performances against Real Madrid -- Robben was probably the only threat for Bayern while Dybala was a ghost. Dybala had 4 goals in 11 CL games; Robben had 3 goals and 3 assists in 8. Keep in mind that Robben was injured again this year and is 33. Dybala has been getting overrated lately. Yes, he's a fantastic talent and one of the better forwards in the world but no he's not better than Robben.

Midfielders need to be split here. Any notion of having Kanté (whose main attributes are running and tackling) in the same sentence as Modric is so ridiculously outrageous that it should not even be up for debate.

Please enlighten me.

 

[Live in the Now]

I didn't say you've never seen him play, but saying that Dybala is better than Robben is stretching things. He's not on a healthy Robben's level -- not that it's a shot at him, very few players are. Dybala didn't carry Juve to the final come on now; Robben doesn't play further up the pitch than Dybala either. If you want to talk about this season look at their relative performances against Real Madrid -- Robben was probably the only threat for Bayern while Dybala was a ghost. Dybala had 4 goals in 11 CL games; Robben had 3 goals and 3 assists in 8. Keep in mind that Robben was injured again this year and is 33. Dybala has been getting overrated lately. Yes, he's a fantastic talent and one of the better forwards in the world but no he's not better than Robben.

I've noticed over the last few years that you like to post numbers completely devoid of context. Here's who Robben scored and assisted against.

PSV (goal)
Arsenal (two goals)

That's it, he didn't have any assists. Don't know where you got that. So he did nothing against Atleti or RM.

Dybala's goals came against Zagreb, Porto, and Barcelona.

I think the players are about equal, but it bears pointing out that Robben plays on by far the best team in Germany while Juventus now has competition.

I also want to point out because Dybala is starting to get overrated, and because nobody here watches Italian football, that he only had one good game against the top teams in Italy. Italian teams are simply much more capable at marking top players out of the game, and it would have been interesting to see Robben play there at some point because the same thing would have happened to him.