The Crypto Guy
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- Jun 26, 2017
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The points will come if he keeps doing what he's doing.
Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo (MOD WARNINGS: Post #12/#900)
- Thread starter free0717
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Kaapo di tutti capi
Registered User
Vesey needs to read this. He'd be a lot more successful if he tried to emulate Graves - not saying he'll ever be nearly that good, but that playing style would make him a lot more palatable.
Rangers in 7
Registered User
i wouldnt completely blame ADA for his inability to put up points, hes still a kid as well and has shown progress this preseason....im not worried at all with him not putting up points yet but if he plays like this he is going to put up plenty of points, right now he is a 4/5 guy PP2 and i think that alone will be good
aufheben
#Norris4Fox
Some things you have to consider when you're trying to gauge an unestablished player's production:
ice-time
quality of teammates
sample-size
shot attempts
luck
past seasons
I did find it a tiny bit interesting that 6 of his 8 assists last year were primary.
ice-time
quality of teammates
sample-size
shot attempts
luck
past seasons
I did find it a tiny bit interesting that 6 of his 8 assists last year were primary.
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Rongomania
Registered User
How old was Dan Boyle when he broke out ?
I remember some of you guys (back when ADA was acquired) said his upside could be a Dan Boyle type of Dman .
Everything seems to point in that direction with this kid, he’s been doing all of the right things. If he keeps up this play the points just have got to come. That in itself is another hurdle for this kid to jump and so far he’s looking like he’s driven to accomplish all of that.
*edit
Add in the fact that he has a competent new-age coach who has been letting him do his thing. Could be so huge.
I remember some of you guys (back when ADA was acquired) said his upside could be a Dan Boyle type of Dman .
Everything seems to point in that direction with this kid, he’s been doing all of the right things. If he keeps up this play the points just have got to come. That in itself is another hurdle for this kid to jump and so far he’s looking like he’s driven to accomplish all of that.
*edit
Add in the fact that he has a competent new-age coach who has been letting him do his thing. Could be so huge.
UnSandvich
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- Sep 7, 2017
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Assuming my math is correct, Boyle was 22 when he played his first games in the NHL. 26 before he put up a season over 26 pts
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
Happy he’s come out swinging.
But let’s remember to not press to firmly on the gas pedal when talking about direction at this point. We’re two games into the preseason here.
But let’s remember to not press to firmly on the gas pedal when talking about direction at this point. We’re two games into the preseason here.
Rongomania
Registered User
I know, I know, but..
If it were the other way around and Tony D came out flat in these past two games, we all know the gas pedal would be to the floor at the other end of this spectrum.
Let me be very clear ADA is a much better player than Pionk in my book. I just think Pionk has the inside track based off of his performance last year. ADA has to put up some points has to
Rempe73
RIP King of Pop
I agree, but not completely. As of right now, I think they are both close. ADA may only be a little better right now, in my opinion, but his upside is higher than Pionk’s. He could be a 1st pairing defenseman if everything goes right, while Pionk’s ceiling is probably a good #4 defenseman on a good team (maybe mediocre #3 defenseman). However, Pionk is better defensively (and probably has a higher hockey IQ). Therefore, he is less likely to “bust” than DeAngelo.
But the fact is Pionk so far has been the better player. Not just defensively, but offensively as well.
Rempe73
RIP King of Pop
Eh, the underlying stats (and even the eye test, I would say) show that ADA has been better offensively. Then again, Pionk has been able to more get assists, albeit secondary. Why can’t ADA get as many? Is it only extremely bad luck? Or is it something more? Don’t get me wrong. I really like both of them. It’s hard to pinpoint who the better player is.
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Rongomania
Registered User
He was also given a much, much longer leash from AV than ADA was and ADA got hurt. Many variables are coming into play here. I think that since Pionk is waiver eligible, he will be THE GUY in Hartford if he doesn’t absolutely play his way back onto the team. And if he does absolutely force his way back onto the team and ADA does as well, then **** we have one fantastic problem..
ADA: top of the line tools, no tool box.
Pionk: Hammers and Handsaws
At end of the day, it's about who builds the better product, not how much attention they drew building it.
ADA can wow people with potential, but he's got to get the results. If he doesn't, there's going to be about three guys hot on his tail next year trying to take a job that he is hanging onto by his fingernails now. If you're a one trick pony, you better be real good at the trick. Right now he isn't cutting it.
Inferno
Registered User
No toolbox? What?
The toolbox is fantastic..what he's lacking is a shot. His shot is weaker than Scott Gomez .if he put a few mph on his shot it would make a world of difference.
The toolbox is fantastic..what he's lacking is a shot. His shot is weaker than Scott Gomez .if he put a few mph on his shot it would make a world of difference.
Irishguy42
Mr. Preachy
Blue Blooded
Most people rejected his message
At least he doesn't go for center mass every time. I swear Gomez did target practice with the NYPD.
eco's bones
Registered User
Pretty hard to be effective on the power play point if opposition goalies/defenses don't respect your shot. They will cheat on you making the pass all the time. Not sure that ADA's shot velocity is all that bad but he needs to be able to score now and again if only to keep the goalies honest. Otherwise it's going to be hard for him to put up a lot of points.
Blue Blooded
Most people rejected his message
Shot velocity has been an issue for a while, his scouting reports that were praising his offensive game had the caveat that while his shot was very accurate it might lack power. That isn't as much of an issue against lesser goalies when you can pick corners, but it doesn't fly as well in the NHL where a good release and shot power is much more important.
I hope he can get some mentoring from Shatty who also has an accurate, but weakish shot. He has managed to work around it and his shot is a real weapon.
eco's bones
Registered User
It's extremely difficult to beat any goaltender cleanly from out past the circles and even harder from the blueline and even harder when your angle is coming off the boards. Those are the areas that DeAngelo is going to shoot mainly from. It's tough when your shot isn't that great. Yandle's shot isn't that great either but he's an exceptional and creative passer and there is a lot of deception in what he does...and yet he usually ends the year with 6,7, 8 goals. He can really place a shot through a screen though. Getting his shots through screens and being able to place shots is where ADA has to go on this. Against Philadelphia he was in close on Hart and that was a nice shot he made. Hart is very talented young goalie though and he is big and there wasn't a lot to shoot at and Hart made it look routine.
As has been mentioned a bunch of times by myself and others, Gorton also brought Pionk along to the WC. I think the organization is really high on Pionk, and it wasn't just an AV thing.
And as we know, the shooting lanes on an NHL PP are basically non-existent, and when they do exist they close really quickly. If you've got a popgun instead of a cannon, that split-second difference can be what allows a guy to get a skate in front of the shot, or a stick or whatever. And 5-on-5? If your shot sucks you have to either hope for a great screen or a deflection.
It is amazing that some fans are not high on Pionk, he is clearly better than ADA and they are both competing for that RD spot. And they are same age, but Pionk is just way better rounded and while is not as flashy as ADA he just produces points.
Rongomania
Registered User
I absolutely understand that. I am real high on Pionk as well, I just think ADA wasn’t given as fair of a shake as NP while AV was here. I understand ADA is not a defensive whiz kid like NP, but as we all know, with a defenseman in ADA’s mold, you’ve got to live with the growing pains, and I believe Quinn has that plan now. I’m just excited that we’ve got both of these guys.
Yeah I get it, I'm not making it an ADA vs. Pionk thing. I just see a lot of people suggest that it simply AV that was behind Pionk big minutes, whereas I think it was much more of an organizational thing, given that AV was basically a lame duck at that point and then Gorton brought Pionk to the Championships. That was my only point.
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